<colemickens>
I just think the amount of hand wringing about the reddit over the last 6 weeks is kind of... well, wouldn't be a problem if we owned the platform.
<colemickens>
samueldr: well, shucks
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<colemickens>
oh, I was even here the other day
<samueldr>
colemickens: you're totally right :)
<samueldr>
(btw, bbl, have to run to the grocery store)
<colemickens>
I also think NixOS Weekly does a nice job of aggregating things I miss around the edges.
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<cole-h>
If only it had enough content to actually be weekly :P
<bqv>
samueldr: "<samueldr> oh please stop it with the eliltism" was that at me?
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<bqv>
oh, no, guess not
<bqv>
nevermind
<bqv>
samueldr: to be clear, my phone had lagged the hell out at that point cause i switched networks, i meant "it is reddit tbh" in response to domen having a strange username
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<cole-h>
I hope AMD drops Zen 3 soon, so I can get a 3xxx for cheap(er) :D
<drakonis>
zen 3 soon
<drakonis>
oh
<drakonis>
cyberpunk 2077 is so close
<cole-h>
You jinxed it
<cole-h>
It's your fault if it gets delayed again
<cole-h>
Mark my words
<ashkitten>
mw
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<bqv>
cole-h: christ, my partner just pointed me at that oculus tweet
<bqv>
worst timeline
<cole-h>
:D
<ashkitten>
oculus has been owned by facebook for a while now, honestly it's not unexpected
<ashkitten>
but it does suck
<drakonis>
entirely unsurprising, really.
<cole-h>
I knew it was coming when I read that they bought Oculus way back when.
<cole-h>
Still sucks to see.
<ashkitten>
i don't even have a facebook account
<samueldr>
bqv: I see, sorry
<bqv>
:)
<samueldr>
I often see remarks against *people* using a service, instead of remarks against a *service* they dislike, and often I think it's likely wrong
<samueldr>
like, that is definitely stereotyping :)
<bqv>
i mean reddit does have a pretty defined demographic, as i understand it, but people do go overboard with the generalising about it, it annoys me too (cause i quite like reddit)
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<elvishjerricco>
Yea, the benefits of ZFS encryption and the benefits of LUKS are quite different
<elvishjerricco>
I think ZFS encryption is sufficient for like 99% of use cases, but there are those few where leaking stuff like leaking inodes and file sizes is really critical
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<srhb>
I think I want to go back to encryption on zfs at some point though. Strips away a layer, and I really don't think NSA s that much out to get me.
<srhb>
otoh, things do just work currently, so meh
<srhb>
I suppose if I wanted to send encrypted datasets, I'd have a real reason.
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<ashkitten>
???? oracle wants to buy tiktok??
<FireFly>
apparently!
<ashkitten>
why tho
<ashkitten>
they are literally the last company id expect to have any interest in tiktok
<ashkitten>
it makes zero sense for them in every way
<colemickens>
Larry promised to keep the anti-Trump teens off the rebranced OracleTok 2020 app.
<ashkitten>
excuse me?
<srhb>
I'm sure license blackmail of tweens is a lucrative market.
<ashkitten>
does tiktok even make money? i figered they were just another investor honeypot
<srhb>
I have absolutely no idea.
<srhb>
I guess it also depends how much you buy into the anti-China propaganda.
<bqv>
Rare to see someone not rabidly anti-china
<bqv>
colemickens: you're joking right?
<bqv>
It's hard to tell these days.
<srhb>
Probably not public knowledge, but frankly I'd be more surprised if Oracle hadn't promised something like that. :-P
<srhb>
What an interesting society we live in.
<ashkitten>
i'm just so confused why they care about tiktok at all
<srhb>
Same.
<ashkitten>
they've never had consumer focused products
<bqv>
Well microsoft wanted it, so it must be worth it
<ashkitten>
and they don't really buy companies to do things with them, to put it lightly
<bqv>
Who wouldn't want a premade social network, tbh
<ashkitten>
oracle??
<bqv>
Evidently not :D
<ashkitten>
oracle historically doesn't seem to care about competition or new products or anything when they purchase other companies, they only care about money they can make off of the dying remains of the company as it suffocates to death
<ashkitten>
i don't know how or even if tiktok makes money but idk, it doesn't suit what i know about oracle
<ashkitten>
like when they purchased sun they didn't care to do anything with sun's products, they just leeched money off the other companies that depended on sun and solaris and java
<bqv>
I mean, if you're company's dying, a social network that rivals the likes of instagram etc, being handed to you on a silver platter, seems a pretty good bet
<ashkitten>
since when is oracle dying?
<ashkitten>
they are gigantic
<bqv>
You said it was
<bqv>
I was going off that
<ashkitten>
no, i said the companies they buy suffocate to death under their grip
<bqv>
Oh, hm. Meh
<ashkitten>
they don't care to innovate with the ideas of companies they acquire
<bqv>
Well theres no better time to change that! :p
* ashkitten
presses x to doubt
<ashkitten>
oracle is a lawnmower
<ashkitten>
they don't do that
<ashkitten>
they eat up other companies and make money and move on, and every acquisition is a tragedy in slow motion because they don't care about anything but money
<ashkitten>
innovation is something companies do before they're acquired by oracle
<talyz>
ashkitten: "Do not fall into the trap of anthropomorphizing Larry Ellison"
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<etu>
Oracle tend to only take decisions that makes them money, all the time. Not always in the long term. But all the time in the short term...
<etu>
So I guess they see that they can monetize tiktok somehow
<ashkitten>
they don't care about the long term
<etu>
Yeah, I know. Their motto is to make money.
<ashkitten>
sun could've made them so much more than it ended up, if they actually cared to innovate with it
<etu>
Which is true for most compaines, but most companies aren't as upfront about it :D
<ashkitten>
it was a horrific loss when sun was bought
<ashkitten>
i guess they basically were the mozilla of their time
<ashkitten>
or the closest thing to what mozilla is now
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<sphalerite>
ashkitten: an entity that's being gutted for money by its C-level?
<ashkitten>
oof
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<colemickens>
I forgot. I have screenshots of YouTube showing me clearly right wing content with the "Subscriptions" tab of the app highlighted, as if I was subscribed to them. Literally some off-the-wall RT (Russia Times) video about Obama. In my g-damn "subscriptions" feed as if I was subscribed. On a Pixel 3 running stock Android w/ YT app.
<colemickens>
I've seen this before where they show other non-Sub content in the Subscription feed, but this is insane. I would post about this on Twitter but I no longer have an account with a following. I'm incensed about it but I have nothing I can do about it.
<colemickens>
I keep doing things half asleep, I noticed that this morning and just remembered and now I feel much less sleepy than I was feeling.
<colemickens>
I would really love to be mistaken, but I'm not seeing it yet.
<srhb>
Apparently some HPE servers include an "Innovation Engine"
<srhb>
I get images of something brass clad and steam-spewing that allows the commonfolk to think new thoughts.
<srhb>
As long as they feed The Innovation Engine.
<srhb>
(With children, obviously)
<srhb>
Why is enterprise naming so ridiculous
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<eyJhb>
Hoping that in 2 years, that there still will be someone, that will fund (EU?) security projects, so that I could do some work on the project I believe in without having to worry about uni
<eyJhb>
srhb: Come on, that must be the best name for it
<eyJhb>
I am certain some poor people who had to work on it, had a much better name for it, but sales decided on... that
<Valodim>
man. why is nix's android support so
<Valodim>
I would like to use it, I've spent many hours trying to get it to build an app in CI
<__monty__>
I think eyJhb successfully built some android apps recently?
<Valodim>
and then I use an ubuntu docker image and it just works. feels bad man :(
<Valodim>
here's my requirements: 1) use sdk dependencies from a list of such names (e.g. "ndk;21.3.6528147"), 2) ./gradlewDebug assembleDebug
<Valodim>
what nixpkgs does, for 1): there is a generator for a fixed set of such available deps, that is updated in nixpkgs every now and then. those deps can't be straight included in an sdk environment, they have to be specified as attributes in an attrset in a non-straightforward way (e.g. { enableNDK = true; ndkVersion = "21.3.6528147" }). need a new package that's not in the generated expression - bad
<Valodim>
luck. need a package that doesn't have a corresponding attribute (in my case "patcher") - bad luck.
<eyJhb>
Valodim: Basically what I did some time ago
<eyJhb>
Which app?
<eyJhb>
Basically just need to use gradle2nix, then you can build most stuff with some modifications
<eyJhb>
My current goal is to have a Nix FDroid repo :p
<eyJhb>
ALSO! Anyone who knows a way to visualise SQL results? Graphs, etc. but without much programming? Not sure that it is even possible
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<Valodim>
eyJhb: it's for work
<eyJhb>
But you are using Gradle, right?! :p
<Valodim>
yes
<eyJhb>
But basically, that should work, ESPECIALLY when you control the app
<eyJhb>
There are however some things, I am in the mid of changing, since they make no sense...
<Valodim>
does gradle2nix have android support these days? I remember there was an open issue about it
<Valodim>
also, there is a cpp build step in there to build and include native libs
<eyJhb>
It has always had Android support, as far as I know, there are just some simple steps
<eyJhb>
Hopefully Valodim ! Lets see if we can't get a nice way of making it work :P
<Valodim>
I would love that
<eyJhb>
I want my fdroid repo. So someday! - Just having it all in Nix would be so awesome. Eg. applying patches to anything, soo easy <3
<Valodim>
what are your thoughts on stability of this build process? gradle is a very complex build system and you can (and sometimes are required to) do all sorts of magic with it
<Valodim>
I don't know how gradle2nix works, and I'm impressed that it does at all, so maybe the build steps can be extracted and performed identically enough that there won't be an issue
<eyJhb>
Basically it just fetches all the deps in a somewhat magic way, that sometimes fails a lot for android and then just makes gradle use those deps offline. The way it fetches the deps is also using gradle
<eyJhb>
Sooo :p Basically it is gradle that we just put into Nix. But there are some faults, that might need another way of doing ti
<eyJhb>
But regarding stability, it should be fairly stable, as even the gradle version is pinned
<Valodim>
sounds good
<eyJhb>
Also, the only fix I have found for when gradle2nix does not work, is... Log parsing!
<eyJhb>
So I hope not to use that. Ever.
<Valodim>
heh, yeah that sounds awful
<Valodim>
what's your take on the generated android sdk stuff
<Valodim>
none of it is built on hydra anyways, couldn't the dependencies just be downloaded and constructed on the fly?
<Valodim>
hmm writing that out, it sounds like that type of thing might require an IFD
<Valodim>
but maybe not really? it should be possible to just generate an android environment from a list of sdk packages I want, shouldn't it?
<eyJhb>
It should be possible to just give it a list of things, yes. But just doing the above wouldn't be very Nix way of doing things, the precious version is not specifed, no hashes, no way to get the packages, etc. Like most of that file also uses the net `extras;google;m2repository`
<eyJhb>
Basically it is the build tools, platform tools, ndk, platforms and sdk version
<eyJhb>
And these could be overriden on a pr. package as needed, but it should be backwards compatible, and basically want it to work on newer versions. Else it will be split into androidsdk_9, like it is atm.
<Valodim>
package list + hash over those would be perfectly fine imo
<Valodim>
like cargoSha256
<Valodim>
what I mean is, I care to have a reproducible android env, I don't really care to have a reproducible specific build tool in version 29.235.2616398
<eyJhb>
Valodim: but I guess that is like most of Nix still, having a base package that is the newest, and then you can depend on that
<eyJhb>
The generate script does not work
<eyJhb>
GG
<Valodim>
"the newest" isn't really how android dev works :P
<eyJhb>
Then it sounds magic Valodim :P
<eyJhb>
If you do not want to specify version, and do not want to use the newest :p
<Valodim>
I never said I didn't want to specify a version?
<eyJhb>
That is what I gathered :p Sorry
<eyJhb>
What versions would then be specified? A collection of the 29 tools?
<Valodim>
I just said I don't need it to be reproducible by version number and hash
<eyJhb>
But at no point, can you really get away with not caring when you are building in Nix. Then it is just a matter of you not needing to touch it
<eyJhb>
Btw. trying to update the tools now :)
<Valodim>
package.txt + hash would work better for me, than only a version number and the hash is implicitly somewhere in nixpkgs and must be generated on a regular basis
<Valodim>
basically the generate pins hashes for the versions of all sdk components, right?
<Valodim>
eh, there are probably other reasons
<eyJhb>
Ehmm. but...
<eyJhb>
Basically, you only care about very little, and everything we need to know except the SDK is in your gradle files
<eyJhb>
So the only versions you need to specify, is the SDK version, NDK version , which could just be version 29
<eyJhb>
Everything else is taken care of gradle2nix
<eyJhb>
Basically
<Valodim>
right, assuming I 1) always use a typical set of build tools + platform tools + ndk etc, and 2) can wait for generate to land in nixpkgs, 3) we're not overlooking anything else
<Valodim>
where for this 3), my project needs "patcher" to build, and I wasn't able to include that in androidenv
<eyJhb>
Gradle2nix will not land in nixpkgs I would assume, it will be a seperate tool
<Valodim>
I have no idea what that is, but I remember gradle complained it was missing, and I couldn't figure out how to include it in the androidenv
<Valodim>
although come to think of it, I think I didn't install it in the docker image I have now for building and it works. not sure
<Valodim>
anyways. I'm sure there are good reasons why things are the way they are. I'm just empirically saying, after putting in many hours, I wasn't able to get an androidenv to work where I could ./gradlew my project (at least not without cheating with an fhs env)
<Valodim>
for all I know, it might just be me being incompetent :P
<eyJhb>
As far as I know, patcher has worked fine for mo :/
<eyJhb>
Well! If you have any project that does the same as yours build wise, or at some point can give me src then I could try to get it to work :p
<Valodim>
it's been a couple weeks, I don't recall the details about it :\
<eyJhb>
But with none it is hard
<eyJhb>
Also, I will not leak the source! Not even to adisbladis
<Valodim>
might do
<Valodim>
I'd also give gradle2nix a shot. should it still work if I simply use your branch?
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<bqv>
JJJollyjim: w.r.t broken nyxt videos, turns out you need gstreamer plugins *in your system profile*, then they work fine
<bqv>
worldofpeace: is there a better solution to this^
<samueldr>
is there a wrapGAppsHook (or similarly named) into the nyxt derivation?
<samueldr>
not sure gstreamer things end up using that
<bqv>
samueldr: yep
<bqv>
But yeah afaik this is separate
<samueldr>
then I guess gstreamer don't end up using this, or nyxt uses them in a breaking way :)
<bqv>
I had to dig through ancient PRs to see that the code currently just sets the plugin path to your profiles
<bqv>
It's not nyxt specific, aiui
<worldofpeace>
bqv: gstreamer has a setup hook that sets GST_PLUGIN_SYSTEM_PATH_1_0 for the gstreamer plugins. wrapGAppsHook adds those paths into the format of arguments to makeWrapper
<worldofpeace>
by putting both gstreamer and it's plugins into buildInputs and wrapGAppsHook into nativeBuildInputs the program will wrapped so that gstreamer can find those plugins
<bqv>
oh, i see. i think maybe i'm breaking that with dontWrap, then.
<drakonis>
y'know, the real way to learn anything is to have a need to drive that learning
<drakonis>
if i get too comfortable with something, i'll not make an attempt to grow
<drakonis>
i'm looking into a way to ssh into a container
<bqv>
why not just use nixos-container root-login
<bqv>
or machinectl shell
<bqv>
true, tho
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<monsieurp>
is someone AWS certified here? is there an added value to getting the certification?
<monsieurp>
I'm going through the AWS online training courses and it feels like learning how to click on the right tab, in the right panel to set the right value for a fuckin VM to start.
<monsieurp>
feels like attending an "Excel 101" course
<__monty__>
Sounds like most certifications.
<samueldr>
monsieurp: I guess the added value *is* the certification that you can add to your certification kebab when working with clients or getting hired
<samueldr>
sometimes help with pencil pushers that don't know much except to check for "has certification X" when triaging potential contractuals or employees
<monsieurp>
getting certified on the workings of an HTML UI to set up VMs isn't particularly useful I guess
<__monty__>
I hate perpetuating the certification scam.
<joepie91>
I strongly suspect that AWS is intentionally designed to be complicated just so that you can be an "AWS specialist" and basically get locked into their ecosystem through training investment
<samueldr>
monsieurp: it could make some people actually learn (the basic) things, but in actuality I would be scared to work with people that only learned things through certs
<monsieurp>
joepie91: totally
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<eyJhb>
bqv: removed...
<bqv>
e?
<abathur>
global proposal: like the comment syntax you know and love, but VCSes refuse to commit/track it without a force flag
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<samueldr>
abathur: I think I'm missing some context
<infinisil>
Is pinging random public ips a good way to figure out whether you have internet connection?
<infinisil>
As long as a single one responds you're good
<samueldr>
random? no, arbitrary, you've proven you can do ICMP
<infinisil>
Yeah that could be like the first step to checking internet access
<abathur>
samueldr: I suppose, though there's no in-channel context :)
<samueldr>
abathur: then I don't understand :)
<abathur>
samueldr: I'm just committing some work on something else where I have an alt-implementation of something already stubbed out and commented; it doesn't really need to be in the permanent history, but I suspect I'll forget it exists if I do an interactive commit, leave it out, and then stash it
<samueldr>
ah! commented-out code!
<abathur>
samueldr: but if I had an alt-comment syntax that git treated like .gitignore at the line level
<__monty__>
abathur: Put it in an untracked file?
<abathur>
oh, sure, there are workarounds (and in my case, just committing it, commented out, with the explanation is it)
* c74d
wonders why the Fedora LXDE live-image is a gigabyte smaller than the Debian LXDE live-image when Fedora claims to take more space once installed than Debian
<samueldr>
"fun"
<genevino>
c74d: could have a variety of reasons. different compression algorithms for the packages, some packages being pulled from network not the iso, different actual package selections than what is on the iso, ...
<c74d>
mm
<genevino>
that's the 3 i was able to think of...
<genevino>
pretty sure there's more.
<genevino>
c74d: i would probably compare the netinstall images, if any. and even those would have completely different set of packages on the ISOs probably. what are you trying to do? did you have a look at iso.nix already?
<colemickens>
can I smarted memtest than Windows' detect which stick is bad? Or is my afternoon going to be binary memtesting my sticks?
<colemickens>
s/can I smarted/can a smarter/g. typing is hard.
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<c74d>
genevino: I'm trying to set up a VM running a 'normal' distro to run some unpackaged software. I'm not really terribly concerned about the image size. :)