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<ashkitten>
any opinions on openssl vs nss?
<ashkitten>
also: what's generally preferred in nixpkgs
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<eyJhb>
Another upgrade, another vbox rebuild
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* etu
started writing a module for freshrss this weekend
<etu>
I have gone from really liking that software to: "they do some really weird stuff with how they handle their configs and users"
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<eyJhb>
etu: soooo many modules :D What will you use it for?
<etu>
eyJhb: freshrss? It's a feed reader. :p
<eyJhb>
Right, thought it was something else :p
<eyJhb>
etu: do you have any good ways of writing files outside of /nix/store? Would be fine, if it wasn't because I can't make /nix/store dir writeable to a application
<__monty__>
etu: I really like selfoss.
<etu>
eyJhb: freshrss requires a systemd-timer/cronjob. And the systemd-timer can have a prestart script that checks if everything is in order.
<etu>
eyJhb: I made a clever thing that checks for /var/lib/freshrss/.installed-<nix-store-path> and if that exists it just does "exit 0", if it doesn't it triggers the setup of freshrss.
<eyJhb>
So you basically use systemd to write outside of /nix/store etu ?
<etu>
__monty__: Hmm, haven't heard about that one before. Looks promising :)
<etu>
eyJhb: Yes
<eyJhb>
I really hoped I could have everything regarding my ZNC inside configuration.nix, without much hackery :(
<eyJhb>
I just need my nickserv module configuration, then I am done
<aanderse>
etu: ohhh... that sounds like a really good way to keep track of "migrations"
<aanderse>
not a simple "yes" or "no" for has a migration been run... but tied to a specific version of the software
<etu>
aanderse: Yeah, then it can copy the source to the webroot, but only if needed. Both upgrades and downgrades.
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<etu>
But freshrss is *weird* because it has ./data/config.php that contains not just database settings, it contains other things as well. And ./data/users/<username>/config.php that is users settings etc :(((
<etu>
So I haven't decided which route to take to make a good module of it.
<aanderse>
ah, yeah, sounds tough
<etu>
I've already decided to *not* remove those files on migrations
<etu>
But maybe I should only create files if they don't exist and leave them writable
<etu>
or something
<etu>
But that wouldn't handle for example changes of database passwords
<etu>
But __monty__ just sold me on trying out selfoss, most
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<etu>
mostly because there's a nixos module :DD
<aanderse>
etu: yeah sounds like it will be difficult to make a really good module out of that... good luck!
<etu>
So maybe I'm not building that module after all
<aanderse>
etu: __monty__: selfoss module could really use some love, if either of you are motivated :)
<etu>
I'm only sure of one thing. I won't run tt-rss.
<__monty__>
aanderse: Ah, good to know. The host I run selfoss on isn't nixified yet though.
<etu>
__monty__: My freshrss is on my last arch-box and is one of the biggest blockers to get rid of that system :p
<eyJhb>
Thinking about overriding znc module prestart script, to include these changes
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<qyliss>
eyJhb: if it's a whitelist of files that need to be writable, you can point the program into the nix store, and then symlink those files out of it
<aanderse>
oh, actually... i just checked and it looks like i'm actually thinking about tt-rss (which needs some love)
<aanderse>
selfoss module code looks pretty good
<aanderse>
oops :D
<etu>
aanderse: :D
<eyJhb>
qyliss: but how would I symlink those files out? Am I missing something?
<qyliss>
eyJhb: ln -s in your derivation
<qyliss>
You can symlink outside the Nix store
<eyJhb>
SO I can symlink, but I cannot create files outside the store?
<eyJhb>
Or am I missing something? Tried to do a simple `touch /tmp/test`, with no results
<qyliss>
You can't do anything outside the sandbox
<qyliss>
But symlinking just creates an entry in a directory _inside_ the store
<qyliss>
It doesn't have to do anything on the other end
<qyliss>
A symlink is a pointer. You don't have to do anything to the thing being pointed to to create it. It doesn't even have to exist.
<aanderse>
etu: if you're bored, though, the systemd.services.selfoss-config systemd unit appears to run as root, that could be fixed :)
<aanderse>
actually that whole job could be removed and replaced by tmpfiles + a preStart in the other systemd job
<etu>
aanderse: ouch, yeah. I'm probably giving selfoss a try first and if I decide to migrate to it I'll give up on my freshrss work and put some effort on selfoss instead.
<aanderse>
mhm
<eyJhb>
qyliss: I currently use pkgs.runCommand in my configuration.nix, where would you suggest I symlink ? Inside the runCommand, because that wouldn't work, right?
<qyliss>
It would!
<qyliss>
Why wouldn't it?
<qyliss>
It's not touching anything outside the store
<eyJhb>
Because it's not touching anything outside the store :p
<qyliss>
why would it need to do that?
<eyJhb>
Because I need it to point to `/var/lib/znc/user-configs`, outside the store :D
<eyJhb>
s/user-configs/users/
<aanderse>
eyJhb: you were the person mildly interested in moodle, right?
<qyliss>
eyJhb: but to point it there, you don't actually need that directory to even exist, right?
<qyliss>
I can do `ln -s /doesntexist`
<qyliss>
And it works fine, because symlinks don't have to point to anything
<qyliss>
ln doesn't care
<qyliss>
it's basically just writing the path you give it into something that's a bit like a file
<eyJhb>
aanderse: yes, why? :) -- qyliss: I can't see how it will help me, as the goal is that configuration.nix, and everything znc related is in that file, without me having to execute additional commands. I could ln -s into the store manually, but that wouldn't help me much
<aanderse>
eyJhb: i put in a simple moodle update today. i don't think you said you're using it yet... but the update made me think there is no one who i know that uses moodle in nix community so reviewers are sparse to come by ;-) the change is pretty trivial today, but in the future it might be more substantial and always nice to have more people to ping for review :)
<eyJhb>
Btw. qyliss not trying to be rude, I simple just don't understand it :p
<eyJhb>
aanderse: I can, but I have no clue if I will use it at all :D And it would only be in these 4 months or so (till December) if so :)
<eyJhb>
Unless I continue working with the organisation in Cape Town
<__monty__>
eyJhb: Why don't you want to go full nix? Why do you need to mutate the config?
<eyJhb>
__monty__: I want to go full nix, that is why I don't want to mutate the config
<eyJhb>
But there are no options for it in the module, so I either have to overlay it (don't know if possible), or make a local version of it. Unless I can get this working somehow :)
<__monty__>
eyJhb: No "extraConfig?"
<eyJhb>
znc only allow for options to be set in znc.conf, and set the dataDir
<eyJhb>
The closests thing is extraFlags. Also, extraconfig wouldn't even help, as it is a file structure I need to create for the rest of the configuration :/
<eyJhb>
So I can create the structure easily using runCommand, etc. but I need a way to ln , copy or anything that to `"${services.znc.dataDir}/users"`
<eyJhb>
DOes that somewhat make sense __monty__ ? :/
<__monty__>
I'm not sure why FILES aren't in the nix store in the first place.
<eyJhb>
Defaults to /var/lib/znc, but it could maybe be put into /nix/store, without problems. But I have no clue, if that would help anything
<eyJhb>
Guessing I will have to try overlaying the module
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<qyliss>
eyJhb: just try it, and you'll see that it works
<eyJhb>
qyliss: I am not sure what you want me to try
<eyJhb>
`ln -s $out /var/lib/znc/users`?
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<qyliss>
And then you can use the path in the store as where the config works
<qyliss>
Whether this works for ZNC I don't know. If it tries to write anywhere but users/ it won't work, of course
<colemickens>
12 hours ago I document my setup for building my system config with a pinned nixpkgs (while supporting overlays consumed in the config) and then see that there's a PR for nixpkgs+flakes today :D woot
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<eyJhb>
qyliss: hmm, makes better sense. Might be able to use that!
<qyliss>
sorry for not being clear
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<eyJhb>
qyliss: quite alright, might as well be me who is tired :p
<eyJhb>
I tried some deviation of what you said, and just made everything in /nix/store, and pointing it to that, but wouldn't work ,as it tries to open the file in write mode as well :(
<eyJhb>
THe only problem, with using the ln trick now, is that /var/lib/znc needs to be created, before the symlink will work I guess
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<hyperfekt>
So in the future flake.lock will manage all my dependencies, as long as they're Nix, and flakes, and on Github? :/
<qyliss>
eyJhb: you should do that in a preStart
<qyliss>
hyperfekt: they don't have to be on GitHub
<eyJhb>
qyliss: yes, but I don't have access to that part :(
<hyperfekt>
qyliss: I see. So s/on Github/in Git/
<__monty__>
hyperfekt: No, source won't be constricted to git repos.
<hyperfekt>
__monty__: At some point, or generally? RFC says tarballs are a 'should' and 'in the future'?
<__monty__>
At some point. People lacking time to do everything all at once shouldn't discredit what's already there imo.
<hyperfekt>
__monty__: Absolutely not, you're right about that. I just can't get out of my head the thought that a highly vertical solution is being built that necessitates a lot of dev time and bloat to cover all the use cases that inevitably pop up.
<hyperfekt>
But I'm not really in the position (yet?) to contribute to the high level design of Nix stuff so I'm mostly just trying to have my worries for the project calmed. ^^
<qyliss>
fwiw, it's not clear to me that the current design actually _can_ be sufficiently extended, because it would interfere with what's already been proposed
<hyperfekt>
qyliss: Not sure if that's good or bad, at least it won't fall in the 'good enough' trap then. But "it's hard to get into the tarpit" is not something that fills me with joy.
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<__monty__>
qyliss: Can you be more specific? I've only been tracking it in the corner of my eye.
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<manveru>
well, that was fun... you can turn off automatic publishing in netlify, but once you do that even if you use their `netlify deploy` CLI, it won't actually activate it :P
<manveru>
found a way around that by using their API directly, but I really wish that was a bit more obvious
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<ashkitten>
hmmmmm
<ashkitten>
i added twitter-color-emoji to my fonts so that i would get color emoji in dunst and such (twemoji-color-font doesn't work in color with pango), but the font is rendered way too big
<qyliss>
spacekookie was working on fixing twemoji
<qyliss>
there's something wrong with teh package
<ashkitten>
hmm
<ashkitten>
so now we've got two twitter emoji fonts
<ashkitten>
twitter-color-emoji and twemoji-color-font
<ashkitten>
hmmmm
<ashkitten>
fontconfig.ultimate.enable was breaking the sizing
<samueldr>
I think the defaults were just changed before 19.09 fork, so color emojis should work better by default starting with 19.09
<samueldr>
I would even say missed, rather than ignored :)
<eyJhb>
Time for somebody with merge powers to merge it!
<eyJhb>
Include my purple-slack as well! ;) :p
<manveru>
it's also pretty heavy to build
<samueldr>
yeah, I was looking at the build closure
<samueldr>
not that bad
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<__monty__>
emily: Yes, I was hoping someone'd trodden the path before me. Maybe with a method to only override it for packages that don't pose a problem?
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<samueldr>
the thing is, I've known this, but I must be broken, as long as my head is not on its side, I've never been able to definitely say a side is more open than the other... on the other side I always feel constricted up there and that may be it
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<__monty__>
infinisil: If you haven't noticed you're no sherlock holmes.
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