gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
<samueldr> this project name is a gem
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<aleph-> Heh
<samueldr> I didn't get it until it hit me: cargo
<aleph-> Heheheh
<aleph-> Nifty tool however
<gchristensen> oh now it makes sense, samueldr
<pie_> still not hitting for me
<samueldr> the evergiven was hauling cargo
<pie_> ok i had to google it and yeah
<pie_> xD
<MichaelRaskin> But then had problems with a channel
<samueldr> it's still having some troubles
<samueldr> it'S been impounded
<pie_> lel , oof ; On 13 April 2021 canal authorities announced that the ship had been seized on court orders until the owners paid $900 million dollars.[36]
<samueldr> jess: goujoun john's goujoun poupon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1UUoiteH_Y
<samueldr> (I wasn's sure if it was appropriate enough in #freenode)
<samueldr> re: [20:54:27] <je//ss> coupons more like poopons
<jess> i will spray my poupon through your vents
<hodapp> wut
<samueldr> digitizer at that point in time was producing... surreal content
<samueldr> the whole series of "mr biffo's found footage" is like some alternate cursed reality community TV content was found on a VHS tape
<gchristensen> std::bad
<gchristensen> std::bad_alloc -- https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/memory/new/bad_alloc -- does this mean you're low/out of memory?
<samueldr> won't e.what() tell you more?
<samueldr> maybe not
<samueldr> see my previous thing about error messages ;)
<gchristensen> yields uncaught exception building ‘/nix/store/40fq788ks8vid0ly2ka53l73z808rlc9-ros-melodic-novatel-oem7-driver-2.1.0-r1.drv’ on ‘localhost’: std::bad_alloc
<samueldr> but that points to something I had in mind: memory fragmentation
<samueldr> and also limits (e.g. ulimit), never have really had to fight with that
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<pie_> I cant suspend my system
<pie_> why is there no override for this
<hodapp> interesting, didn't realize that one could also do C/C++ in GraalVM
<pie_> so i have 3 systemd-shutdown (kernel threads?) processes running at 100% cpu
<aleph-> Pretty poggers if I say so
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<eyJhb> All the state that I keep forgetting on my server. I just nuked my certs for my website.
<talyz> eyJhb: nuke those certs \o/
<eyJhb> talyz: I think I hit the limit, I am running self signed now :p
<eyJhb> *not intentional
<eyJhb> ` too many certificates already is` ups.
<eyJhb> is -> issued
<eyJhb> Guess I have to wait a week now?
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<talyz> yay, so you have a downtime limiter: take down server too often -> lose certs?
<eyJhb> If I reboot more than 50 times a week, then I will have a added extra downtime :D
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<ar> eyJhb: erase your darlings \o/
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<talyz> eyJhb: :D
<eyJhb> Oh, it is actually 5 for the same domain... :p Guess who is setting up `nextcloud2....`
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<eyJhb> :( Forgot to change my DNS
<eyJhb> ar: Yeah, very much! It is totally different on a server vs. a working laptop
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<eyJhb> Certs for me! Not pretty however.
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<talyz> eyJhb: \o/
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<eyJhb> talyz: Now we just play the waiting game............
<eyJhb> And then I have to readd my nextcloud server on my phone once more
<sphalerite> thought for a second you were running a nextcloud server on your phone
<eyJhb> sphalerite: I am hoping that samueldr makes that possible. Going to be nice once my mobile carrier supports IPv6!
<eyJhb> \s but could be nice :p
<sphalerite> it's already possible, as long as mobile-nixos works sufficiently on your phone :D
<eyJhb> https://github.com/NixOS/mobile-nixos/pull/89 just need to have some time to check it out
<{^_^}> mobile-nixos#89 (by dguibert, 1 year ago, open): [WIP] oneplus-bacon: add kernel
<eyJhb> Also need to fix my own phone. It keeps loosing connection to mobile networks... Until I restart it..
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<etu> > all: simplify the spelling of Linux
<{^_^}> <LAMBDA>
<pie_> linux torvalds
<pie_> etu: also wow someone is bored and looking to troll
<etu> pie_: I hear RMS tears ;)
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<lukegb> also arguably wrong in a bunch of those cases
<lukegb> e.g. the size of the siginfo_t struct wouldn't change based on whether it's a GNU userland or a BSD userland, right? :P
<gchristensen> right
<gchristensen> some but not all of our GNU/ prefixes are not really releant
<gchristensen> for example, Nix works on non-GNU Linux
<philipp[m]> Maybe we could fork the gnu userland and call it STandard Forked Userland and thus end the debate by creating STFU/Linux?
<lukegb> for most programs I suspect the GNU/ prefix would mean specifically "uses GNU extensions to POSIX utilities when shelling out" or "relies on behaviours that are glibc specific"
<gchristensen> oh ... great ... I'm expecting 3" of snow tomorrow
<eyJhb> philipp[m]++
<{^_^}> philipp[m]'s karma got increased to 3
<eyJhb> Support that idea
<eyJhb> gchristensen: Do you want to build a snoooooowpeersoooon
<gchristensen> lol
<gchristensen> I want to build as summerperson
<eyJhb> Dirtpeople? :p
<gchristensen> I want to be on my porch drinking a leinenkugel's summer shandy
<eyJhb> gchristensen: soon (tm) soon ;)
<eyJhb> Also.. How many of you should go to hell and uses emojis in your passwords? Didn't really think of it until now.
<gchristensen> most password boxes can't even properly deal with passwords too long that are pasted in, I'm not trying emojis
<eyJhb> I just tried with a danish site, bilbasen.dk, worked on mobile and laptop :D BUt I don't trust them to work over larger amounts of time.
<MichaelRaskin> lukegb: given our reliance on bashisms, that indeed makes Nixpkgs primary platform GNU/Linux
<lukegb> MichaelRaskin: :(((
<MichaelRaskin> lukegb: is there a BSD userland that will be happy to run on Linux kernel? I mean actual BSD-style, not BSD-licensed Android horror
<aleph-> gchristensen: I mean you can still be on your porch drinking a shandy
<aleph-> Just watching the snow fall
<aleph-> I feel I've ossified to early in life.
<aleph-> I already yearn for a porch and a comfortable rocking chair
<gchristensen> if I'm on the porch watching snow fall I want a porter
<aleph-> Heh very specific
<aleph-> I'll take a nice cider either way
<gchristensen> oh sure
<aleph-> Or a coffee with some cheap whiskey splashed in
<gchristensen> winter is forever here, I need to enjoy different things at different times of the year :P
<aleph-> Heheheh
<MichaelRaskin> Seasons? I am slowly making peace with the idea that these switches between clear summer and clear winter can continue in Bavaria however long they want
<LinuxHackerman> Really? I thought that's just April.
<LinuxHackerman> Though yeah this is a very extreme case of April.
<MichaelRaskin> Well, it started in February
<MichaelRaskin> If this case of April is symmetric, and we get a similar October that covers like entire year, no?
<infinisil> Oof, this night I dreamed that one of our cats caught a mouse, then brought it into my bed, leaving blood smears all along the way, including the mattress
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<__monty__> I'm sorry to say Mrs Europe, but your case of Aprilits looks like it's developing into a case of mayosis.
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<philipp[m]> ,launch blue origin ns-15 mission webcast starts in ~6 Minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=domwsgorRW0&feature=emb_title
<{^_^}> blue origin ns-15 mission webcast starts in ~6 Minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=domwsgorRW0&feature=emb_title: Ping for space stuff (edit this command to add yourself, see ",help"): infinisil Taneb ldlework etu philipp[m] eyJhb gchristensen __red__ red red[evilred] risson
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* infinisil tunes in
<lukegb> MichaelRaskin: I don't know but it'd be fun to try
<philipp[m]> Actual launch in t-47, will reping around t-10.
<MichaelRaskin> lukegb: I am not sure BSD approach to system development is even compatible with such a task…
<MichaelRaskin> Would it even be a true BSD userland!
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<pie_> any advice for regenerating some network configs and restarting services when interfaces change?
<pie_> (besides avoid it if you can - which I _might_ be able to)
<MichaelRaskin> Re: BO — is it in truth a «reliability stats» launch, or is there something new to look for?
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<philipp[m]> They are holding at T-10:45 for a really long time, I might have to leave before they launch.
<pie_> wow. im stumped by a simple mkderivation
<pie_> its not applying patches and im not sure why
<andi-> patchPhase overriden?
<pie_> wlel, this is main topic but https://bpa.st/XYSA
<pie_> i checked with ` x.overrideAttrs (old: builtins.trace old.patches old) ` that patches is definitely getting set
<pie_> DOH
<pie_> buildCommand?
<pie_> yeah buildcommand.
<pie_> im not very sharp with reading the details of expressions so my eyes just flew right over it assuming it was an overridden buildphase
<pie_> andi-: well thanks for the rubber duck
* andi- prepares the invoice
<gchristensen> speaking of which, wheres my storage
<andi-> gchristensen: I am waiting for your data!
<andi-> The offer is off the table as soon as there is one encrypted file :P
<gchristensen> open up netcat, I will send you fully decrypted data
* gchristensen looks for a bytestream-to-prose converter
<andi-> If you data is valued more than 10c I might send you the drives with the data!
<pie_> something about indexing into the linux dictionary
<andi-> gchristensen: alternative: Add your data as package to nixpkgs.
<andi-> S3 will then take care of the backup.
<pie_> periodic reminder about https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~tom7/abc/paper.pdf
<pie_> .
<pie_> . The following characters were inserted to make the .. above converge: 000004669 ..
<hexa-> ,launch blue origin T-10
<philipp[m]> ,launch go for launch, terminal countdown t-10 minutes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=domwsgorRW0
<{^_^}> blue origin T-10: Ping for space stuff (edit this command to add yourself, see ",help"): infinisil Taneb ldlework etu philipp[m] eyJhb gchristensen __red__ red red[evilred] risson
<{^_^}> go for launch, terminal countdown t-10 minutes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=domwsgorRW0: Ping for space stuff (edit this command to add yourself, see ",help"): infinisil Taneb ldlework etu philipp[m] eyJhb gchristensen __red__ red red[evilred] risson
<hexa-> :p
<gchristensen> nice
<hexa-> wasn't sure you were still around
* infinisil tunes in again
<gchristensen> nobody is in there right?
<gchristensen> they're just imagining+
<philipp[m]> There was crew in there but only for countdown testing. They all left again at t-30. Now there's only a dummy.
<infinisil> Liftoff!
<infinisil> They didn't wanna let her go for the first couple seconds eh
<infinisil> Metric units -.-
<infinisil> I mean, imperial units -.-
<philipp[m]> They count like arianespace where t0 is engine ignition.
<MichaelRaskin> Well, even SpaceX uses kph for stage velocities for some reason…
<gchristensen> BO probably does too internally
<infinisil> mps > kph > mph
<MichaelRaskin> I hope neither does!
<gchristensen> ohlol right
<MichaelRaskin> If you need things to work, you count mps
<gchristensen> kmpd
<lukegb> clearly miles per second > kilomiles per hours > meters per hour
<MichaelRaskin> flpfn
<infinisil> Lol
<philipp[m]> No love for nautical miles and knots here?
<infinisil> lightyears per year
<infinisil> But, accounted for the medium
<infinisil> Damn, it landed!
<philipp[m]> And didn't go boo!
<infinisil> Was a bit wobble, but that was smooth!
<__monty__> Wow, just in time for the landing, thanks! : )
<Ke> at least lightyears per year is handy to input to relativistic corrections
<MichaelRaskin> It landed much less wobbly than usual
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<hexa-> the inflation was nice
<Ke> are there no decent people just watching it for the explosions?
<infinisil> Their drone footage is really awesome
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<MichaelRaskin> Ke: it's BO
<MichaelRaskin> It's New Shepard
<gchristensen> Ke: I hope for explosions ... :)
<Ke> BO?
<MichaelRaskin> They do not change enough for a meaningful risk of explosion
<MichaelRaskin> Blue Origin
<philipp[m]> And they don't really push the envelope at all with new shepard.
<MichaelRaskin> Well, first flight/first reflight were a convincing step
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<MichaelRaskin> But since then it looks like they are just polishing the g's and collecting reliability stats
<philipp[m]> I guess exploding millionaire customers is expensive.
<gchristensen> are they going to do commercial stuff too?
<MichaelRaskin> Apparently next flight should be inhabited and then maybe they will finally actually do tourism?
<MichaelRaskin> Eventually they promise to build a pretty large orbital-class rocket
<philipp[m]> gchristensen: yes, that vehicle is purely built for tourism.
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<{^_^}> nix#2981 (by yorickvP, 1 year ago, open): replace in-memory nar caching with on-disk nar caching when >256MB
<pie_> still collecting dust :(
<pie_> no followup from upstream
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<pie_> eyJhb: was i talking to you about nutty escaping?
<pie_> sed -e \"s|\\\\\\\\|\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\|g\" -e \"s|\\\"|\\\\\\\\\\\"|g\")\\\"
<samueldr> pie_: content warning: nuts allergies
<pie_> infinisil: how do you run nixlisp
<infinisil> pie_: nix-instantiate --eval
<pie_> ok cool
<pie_> i tried nix eval -f default.nix and it didnt work
<pie_> said more arguments are required
<pie_> infinisil: whats the a argument?
<infinisil> Magic!
<infinisil> pie_: (it allows lisp.nix to figure out which file it was called from, so it can reparse it lol, so just a big hack)
<pie_> aha
<pie_> wait so you parse yourself? :P thats cheating
<pie_> also oh dear this might not work then
<pie_> infinisil: anyway wanna write an argument parser? :P
<infinisil> No thanks :)
<infinisil> I think there's a parser combinator library out there for nix
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<aleph-> Oh god nix lisp? :|
<clever> pie_: i still need to get into parsing stuff
<pie_> nix-parsec has some interesting stuff in it...
<pie_> people are overpowered >_>
<infinisil> The hardest thing that shouldn't be hard in Nix is to convert from a float to an int
<infinisil> The "easy" way is to print the float, split on the ".", then running `builtins.fromJSON` on the left part
<infinisil> The harder way is to not go through strings
<infinisil> Which is implemented with floatToInt
<infinisil> > floatToInt 10.7
<{^_^}> 10
<infinisil> (uses bisection..)
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<gchristensen> ;_; quit like 30s before I pressed enter on a longish DM
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<pie_> infinisil: how do I add a nix function to nixlisp?
<pie_> i tried just using a function but it seems like nixlisp uses an AST
<pie_> or, how do i put this
<pie_> if i act like it was actually getting raw arguments, i just get ast nodes
<pie_> how do i lift my function to ast
<pie_> yeah i see that
<pie_> can I do it without patching that there?
<infinisil> Let's go to #nix-lang
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<abathur> brain cells, unite!
<samueldr> brain cells, untie!
<abathur> more accurate tbh
<infinisil> Damn: "1734 out of 1738 (99.77%) paths in the minimal installation image are reproducible!"
<infinisil> From https://r13y.com/
<lovesegfault> pango, isl, ruby, and gcc
<lovesegfault> the final bosses
<rmcgibbo[m]> that's actually pretty awesome.
<rmcgibbo[m]> the ruby one looks easy, too.
<rmcgibbo[m]> gcc is the big boss.
<{^_^}> #112928 (by baloo, 8 weeks ago, open): stdenv: provide a deterministically built gcc
<rmcgibbo[m]> is there any marking on packages that are reproducible in meta that indicates that they are?
<infinisil> Don't think so
<rmcgibbo[m]> e.g. i could make nixpkgs-review check to prevent backsliding in the future.
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<rmcgibbo[m]> if i'm understanding `pkgs/top-level/ruby-packages.nix` correctly, it doesn't look like we ever patch ruby packages, right? (i've never contributed to nixpkgs's ruby infra).
<rmcgibbo[m]> so if i wanted to fix the ruby-racc one, i think i would just have to file an upstream PR and wait for them to do a new release.
<samueldr> you know that carcinisation theory?
<samueldr> I think there's a parallel with Nix and making filesystem and disk images
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<samueldr> ♥ nix, since I can refactor the tooling and rely on the store paths being unchanged meaning I at least did not break the current implementation
<samueldr> imagine a tooling that rebuilds things even if the input hasn't changed
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<cole-h> pls no
<lukegb> samueldr: worse, imagine tooling that _doesn't_ rebuild things even if the input has changed
<samueldr> worse?
<samueldr> depending on how you interpret this, it may or may not be worse :)
<samueldr> e.g. content-addressed store
<samueldr> inputs have technically changed, but all intermediary results are the same
<samueldr> did input change or not?
<samueldr> but yes, at face value I don't like your thought
<lukegb> (I'm mostly thinking about most hand-written Makefiles that don't take into account things like the Makefile itself changing)