gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
dotdotok has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
hexa- has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.9]
red[evilred] has quit [Quit: Idle timeout reached: 10800s]
hexa- has joined #nixos-chat
abathur has quit [Quit: abathur]
cole-h has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
abathur has joined #nixos-chat
rajivr has joined #nixos-chat
krkini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
* elvishjerricco There's a thing you can do to get the bot to let someone know I was looking for them next time they join, isn't there?
<elvishjerricco> whoops, apparently ctrl+enter does a /me
<samueldr> ,tell
<{^_^}> Use `,tell john Remember to do the laundry` to send this to john next time he's talking in this channel
<elvishjerricco> ,tell cole-h ping
<{^_^}> elvishjerricco: I'll pass that on to cole-h
<gchristensen> ,tell {^_^} =)
<{^_^}> gchristensen: I'll pass that on to {^_^}
<aanderse> DigitalKiwi: did you message me earlier?
<DigitalKiwi> yes
<siraben> .tell siraben hello
<siraben> ,tell siraben hello
<{^_^}> siraben: I'll pass that on to siraben
<aaronjanse> hello
<aaronjanse> GPT-3 helps user learn NixOS
<siraben> cursed use of `sudo nix-env -i`
<{^_^}> siraben: 33 minutes, 44 seconds ago <siraben> hello
<DigitalKiwi> "helps" and "learn" are being used there differently than I understand them to mean :P
<aaronjanse> This one is better
<DigitalKiwi> 03:40 DigitalKiwi: !vampire
<DigitalKiwi> 03:40 phrik: Take the Help Vampire challenge! http://www.slash7.com/pages/vampires
waleee-cl has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
<DigitalKiwi> #archlinux needs that GPT-3 bot
<siraben> Q: What's Nix's flakes good for?
<siraben> A: Nix's flakes is good for making cereal.
<siraben> this is what the GPT-3 bot replied to me
<siraben> Q: What's Nix flakes good for?
<siraben> A: Nix flakes are good for making a delicious breakfast cereal.
<siraben> bah
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
<Church-> Hmm, well this is fun. Running a static binary in a system service. Core dumps as a service, runs fine when I run it bare. Grumble
<pie_> env vars?
<pie_> i wonder if you can strace what it tries to access
<pie_> well i guess first id try to replicate the failure outside the service
<pie_> aaronjanse: xD
<samueldr> env -i # is cheap to completely obliterate the environment
Dotz0cat_ has joined #nixos-chat
<Church-> pie_: Yeah planning to try that.
Dotz0cat has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
<Ke> I thought you were recommending people to do non-declarative package management first
<Church-> Packaged up a speed test exporter for prometheus that calls out to the static speed test binary ookla provides.
<siraben> nix-env -u # is cheap to completely obliterate declarative package management
strikerlulu_ has joined #nixos-chat
strikerlulu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
cole-h has joined #nixos-chat
<pie_> old systems are scary but so are new ones https://www.vidarholen.net/contents/blog/?p=1035
<pie_> Amazingly, the x-hack could be used to work around certain bugs all the way up until 2015, seven years after StackOverflow wrote it off as an archaic relic of the past!
<pie_> The bugs are of course increasingly hard to come across. The Zsh one only triggers when comparing left-paren against right-paren, as otherwise the parser will backtrack and figure it out.
<pie_> [...]
<pie_> In all cases, the x-hack is effective because it prevents the operands from being recognized as parentheses.
<eyJhb> supersandro2000: Ended up with freeing 200 GB
<eyJhb> Wonder if it should be more than that.
endformationage has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
lopsided98 has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
lopsided98 has joined #nixos-chat
srk has joined #nixos-chat
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
<ashkitten> :( this is the only level 2 doesnt work in ruffle
<ashkitten> i'm pretty sure i know exactly why
<ashkitten> there's a level where you have to open a second tab with the game to flip a switch and open the door in the first tab
cole-h has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
__monty__ has joined #nixos-chat
<arcnmx> would anyone be able to kick me from #nixos?
<Taneb> That's an odd request
<eyJhb> Taneb: don't kink shame \s
<__monty__> arcnmx: If this is because you can't renick because of a previous log in you can use nickserv's ghost command.
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
<hexa-> likely because matrix-appservice-irc.
* arcnmx nod
<arcnmx> hoping it might help the server or bridge realise I'm not supposed to be in the channel .-.
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
endformationage has joined #nixos-chat
rj has joined #nixos-chat
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
AkechiShiro has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.9]
rj has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
MichaelRaskin has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
rj has joined #nixos-chat
rj has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
rj has joined #nixos-chat
MichaelRaskin has joined #nixos-chat
AkechiShiro has joined #nixos-chat
<eyJhb> Debugging why the hell wireguard won't work, and you forget that networking.firewall.enable is true by default.
<eyJhb> Damn it
waleee-cl has joined #nixos-chat
<Church-> heheheh
<Church-> Yeah that'll getcha
<gchristensen> unless you set up both peers with direct IPs and persistent keepalive
<eyJhb> Church-: And you need to reboot, if you want it to be gone. :/
<eyJhb> gchristensen: Well, they still won't be able to connect if you don't open the UDP port :D
<clever> eyJhb: outgoing udp packets punch a hole in the firewall for the reply
<clever> and udp is connectionless, so if the 2 ends agree on ports ahead of time, they can talk thru those holes
<gchristensen> yep
<gchristensen> as long as both sides are trying to talk to each other at the same time, the firewall opens it up
<Church-> eyJhb: Really? Bah
<Church-> Okay there is no reason this should coredump
<Church-> I could just run it on a cron
<Church-> But I am stubbornly going to get this systemd service working and upstrea it.
<pie_> eyJhb: did that yesterday with "why arent the dhcp packets hitting dnsmasq"
<pie_> eyJhb: to my defence, the containers where i was doing stuff before werent firewalled
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
h0m1 has joined #nixos-chat
cole-h has joined #nixos-chat
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
Dotz0cat_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<eyJhb> Church-: iptables is... Hell.
<eyJhb> pie_: WELL! That is the same for me. Or.. Something along those lines :p
<Church-> Heh it can be
<MichaelRaskin> gchristensen: I thought that with proper abuse of TCP simultaneous-syn you could do the same with TCP, it is just not done (and VoIP wanted UDP in the first place)?
<gchristensen> I don't think so, because TCP sends back "uhh.. no" packets
<cransom> i would think that would make stateful firewalls very upset.
<gchristensen> which?
<cransom> trying to do a simultaneous syn thing.
<gchristensen> oh
<MichaelRaskin> Collision-course-SYN
<gchristensen> OH
<MichaelRaskin> Because of course it is legal and of course firewalls do not care about standard
<sphalerite> Forgive me, Father, for I have synned.
<cole-h> sphalerite++
<{^_^}> cole-h: 16 hours, 43 minutes ago <elvishjerricco> ping
<{^_^}> sphalerite's karma got increased to 122
<cole-h> elvishjerricco: pong
<cole-h> elvishjerricco: if we miss eachother again, feel free to dm on twitter
rajivr has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
lukegb has quit [Quit: ~~lukegb out~~]
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
lukegb has joined #nixos-chat
kini has joined #nixos-chat
numkem has quit [Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat]
ece has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
ece has joined #nixos-chat
<drakonis> oh my oh my
<sphalerite> I hate the name Pop!_OS an irrational amount.
<cole-h> yes
srk has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
<pie_> sphalerite: :D
<pie_> rip and tear until it is done
<srhb> sphalerite: Imagine it wiht versions on
<sphalerite> yeah…
<MichaelRaskin> Wait, is underscore in the official spelling or did you just use it instead of ␣ as visible space?
<sphalerite> Official spelling.
<sphalerite> I'm not sure I've ever read it out loud, but I think I should probably read it as pop exclamation mark underscore oh ess.
<samueldr> aggravating edge case: it's actually Pop␣OS!
<sphalerite> samueldr: NO.
<cole-h> yes
<samueldr> oops
<samueldr> aggravating edge case: it's actually Pop!␣OS!
<samueldr> ugh, still messed it up
<samueldr> I NEED A BIGGER DESK
<samueldr> the SBCs have invaded
<hodapp> YOU DON'T DESERVE A BIGGER DESK
<cole-h> I need a better desk and a better chair and a better
<samueldr> the thing is it's not a small desk either
<samueldr> and the monitors are already on elevated arms that are out of the way of actual desk space
<hodapp> just went to IKEA and got a bigger desk to work at because my existing 10-year-old one is just killing my freaking neck at this point
<hodapp> monitor too low, monitor too close, blahblahblah, I freaking hate it
<samueldr> what I'd need is a custom made work surface to make an L shaped work surface
<hodapp> for my little boards and SBCs and things I was using those modular shelf units from IKEA as well that have 8 compartments
<hodapp> which end up being handy for sticking little equipment in that needs a place to go
<samueldr> though right now it's in actual use, when shelved away they're elsewhere
<samueldr> the thing that eats the most space right now, though, is the nexdock being at a prime location where my keyboard really should be
<MichaelRaskin> Wait wait wait. System76 of all people, makes a distribution… and makes its website JS-only?
<samueldr> "makes its website"
<samueldr> it's a tumblr
<MichaelRaskin> I feel this all is an elobarate troll op
<MichaelRaskin> elaborate
<MichaelRaskin> But you do not need a larger desk, you need multy-level shelf system for your SBCs. With good airflow. But not as good as in SBG2
<samueldr> no, I need desk space to set things up to use it
<samueldr> the *other* aarch64 things are still present on the desk because they're just on hold temporarily
numkem has joined #nixos-chat
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
<elvishjerricco> cole-h: So with my vfio vm, I don't know how to get my VTs back after going back to Linux.
<elvishjerricco> Any advice?
<cole-h> this is all I had to do
<cole-h> after reattaching gpu etc, of course
<elvishjerricco> Hm I have that already
<elvishjerricco> And I'm pretty sure I reattach the GPU correctly too
<elvishjerricco> Considering the display manager comes up fine
<cole-h> but you just can't switch to e.g. tty1, tty2, ...?
<elvishjerricco> cole-h: I can switch to a blank black screen with ctl+alt+f1
<cole-h> and you can get an actual tty like that if you don't boot into the vm first?
<cole-h> (e.g. no black screen, but getty splash screen)
<elvishjerricco> Yea I can get a tty with getty via ctl+alt+f1 if I haven't used the vm this boot
<cole-h> hmmmmmmm
<cole-h> I don't have that issue
<cole-h> do you restart the display manager?
<elvishjerricco> Yes I do in the ExecStopPost of the service that starts the vm
<cole-h> what if you manually restart it?
<cole-h> I'd also check `systemctl status getty@tty1.service` to see if there's something fscked up
<elvishjerricco> cole-h: Hm not sure why manually staring the display manager would work. Isn't that independent of the Getty ttys?
<cole-h> no idea -- I don't use a display manager :P
<cole-h> just trying to explore
__monty__ has quit [Quit: leaving]
<elvishjerricco> I know no services are failed when I do this (my shell tells me any failed ZFS pools or systemd units when I log in)
<elvishjerricco> You don't use a display manager?
<cole-h> no
Dotz0cat has joined #nixos-chat
<pie_> joepie91: UX circlejerk: if people spent 5 minutes to an hour actually thining about CLIs from user perspective...
<joepie91> pie_: unfortunately there seems to be a heavy bias in UX-blind people working on all the CLI stuff
<pie_> blind or just did not spend 5 minutes actually trying to design soething
<joepie91> pie_: UX-blind in the sense that they do not recognize the importance of UX as a thing
<pie_> im probably the asshole here but
* pie_ victim shames himself :P
<pie_> ok </ux circlejerk> thanks
<joepie91> lol
<samueldr> but ugh
<samueldr> CLI don't have UX
<samueldr> duh, there is no GUI for the UX
* samueldr smears the /s heavily
<joepie91> samueldr: without the /s you sound just like every other terminal fetishist :P
<samueldr> I know, my imitation is perfect
<samueldr> and yes, please, think more than 5 minutes about the experience of the CLI tools you build!
<samueldr> and there's probably (sadly) no one-size-fits-all answer here
<samueldr> but really, an important thing I guess would be: EXPLAIN
<samueldr> explain why the thing failed
<samueldr> -EBADTHING is not helpful
<pie_> i mean, i can accept that the design space is big and hard and sometimes the problem domain is just complicated
<pie_> ok so here's the actual thing that im wastin way too much time being angry about
<samueldr> if you have an error message, write "what" exactly in the error message
<pie_> theres this thing in networking where apparently you can make differnt routing tables
<samueldr> and try to make unique error messages so grepping your source doesn't reveal multiple location with the same error message
<joepie91> if the design space is too big for you to deal with, then err on the side of information vomit, not on the side of "shit's fucked lol"
<pie_> and they can have names, but the kernel only actually sees id numbers
<pie_> which is fine i guess
<pie_> but ip lets you use names
<joepie91> people can extract meaning from information vomit with sufficient effort
<joepie91> a generic "shit's fucked" however is a guaranteed dead end
<pie_> except the default names are hardcoded and theres no interface for adding names, you have to add stuff to some config file
<pie_> its just an id - name mapping
<pie_> the file doesnt exist by default
<pie_> why couldnt they just add an ip rule create table <name> command so i dont have to figure any of this out
<pie_> AITA?
<samueldr> I don't know about your specific case
<samueldr> but at face value it sounds right
<pie_> it would have been "add a named routing table"
<pie_> but $person told me they just use the id number and i guess ehh why not
<MichaelRaskin> samueldr: if -EBADTHING is the same as syscall returned and you print it right afterwards, then it is more helpful than what people thinking about the topic come up with
<MichaelRaskin> Because -EBADTHING I will search in strace log.
<MichaelRaskin> And error messages are not always better than strace output
<pie_> so say "Syscall returned EBADTHING"
<samueldr> it can say things
<MichaelRaskin> That's surely better
<samueldr> like what it was trying to do when it failed
<pie_> though tbh ididnt think of that till you brought it up
<samueldr> *and* transmit that error
<samueldr> and that's assuming here it's about syscalls
<samueldr> but I've seen tools reuse those error codes
<samueldr> for their own uses
<samueldr> so that wouldn't hold water here
<MichaelRaskin> Yeah, that's bad
<MichaelRaskin> Also requires thinking
<MichaelRaskin> So maybe thinking for 5 minutes about what the hell you are doing is not always making things better
rj has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<supersandro2000> maybe something useful for nixos security
kini has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kini has joined #nixos-chat
<Church-> Hmm well seems generating a wireguard interface in a container is more annoying then I thought.
supersandro2000 has quit [Killed (kornbluth.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))]
supersandro2000 has joined #nixos-chat
Church- has quit [Quit: WeeChat info:version]
aleph- has joined #nixos-chat