gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
<JJJollyjim> weird, I just checked cpuinfo on my phone, it claims to be dual-socket
<JJJollyjim> i guess that's the big.LITTLE or something?
<JJJollyjim> oh wow the 845 has pretty nice mainline linux support
<JJJollyjim> now i need a new phone so i can do hacky things with this one :P
<samueldr> hahaha
<samueldr> though I haven't tried mainline yet
<samueldr> it might have troubles there too, all depending on whether its dual dsi setup is "standard" or not
<samueldr> but comparing it to other SDM845 source trees, it has a different implementation
<samueldr> almost looks like a WIP from qualcomm that got shipped
<cole-h> This sounds bad...
<andi-> the more computes we put in those portable "consoles" the more issues we will see, pretty logical evolution
<samueldr> it's not a new issue
<samueldr> it's over a year old
<samueldr> though someone wrote a fresh article recently about it
<samueldr> andi-: what do you mean by console?
<samueldr> the T2 is "the real" computer in T2-toting mac computers
<samueldr> it kickstarts the intel "co-processor" at boot
<samueldr> the T2 mediates with storage
<andi-> samueldr: devices with limited capabilities as we don't really own them.
<samueldr> yeah, but console is a weird term here
<samueldr> any access to the storage is done through it, and it uses a value in its secure enclave to write to the storage
<samueldr> so whenever the T2 fails, good bye data!
<andi-> ha, as if things ever break...
<andi-> Also, isn't all your data on the cloud?
<samueldr> exactly
<samueldr> the T2 is "good" if you agree with the security choices, but for anything else it's terribly anti-consumer
<andi-> It is an unfortunate reality that the more stripped down the access to a system is the "more secure" some of the devices are.
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> something I have as parts of my notes for an article about that dichotomy in security
<samueldr> but my notes are more biased towards "supply chain" integrity
<samueldr> e.g. xiaomi locking the bootloader unlock via a mothership command and account linking
<samueldr> since otherwise in their "supply chain" people open the boxes, change the OS with one with malware, seal those back and sell them
<samueldr> the point I'll bring across is that _their_ issues with the supply chain is greatly harming _my_ ownership of the product
<samueldr> the moment they stop supporting a device unlock, it's as dead as a door knob
<samueldr> welcome e-waste!
<samueldr> though with the new full-screen warnings on boot
<samueldr> it shouldn't be needed anymore
<samueldr> (for that point of view)
<ashkitten> samueldr: how's the fairphone for linux compared to pinephone?
<samueldr> unknown
<samueldr> though I would assume just as good as a snapdragon if its vintage (or mtk for the first one)
<samueldr> of its*
<samueldr> ashkitten: warning: the modem isn't that good for north american bands
<samueldr> which is "not an issue" since they can't be bought here
<samueldr> which is horrible
<ashkitten> ah
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<samueldr> (and it is an issue, for visitors!)
<samueldr> (what a terrible mistake!)
<samueldr> we almost had a different pinephone variant per region
<ashkitten> ouch
<samueldr> to save what I think was a couple bucks per SKU
<samueldr> per unit*
<samueldr> which, great for pine, but whew what a mistake to do
<ashkitten> yeah
<samueldr> I'm not sure how much of the decision not to go for that has been influenced by me though
<ky0ko> current fairphone supposedly does not have the issue ith the modem bands
<ky0ko> fairphone 1 and 2 did, 3 adds a lot more bands
<samueldr> ky0ko: to be fair I never checked
<samueldr> like, verified
<samueldr> oh, that might be it
<samueldr> might still be thinking in terms of the 2
<samueldr> I would have loved to get a fairphone to port to it
<ashkitten> siiiiiigh i just want a pinetab pro...
* ashkitten whines about this shit again
<samueldr> there is something in the works
<ashkitten> there is excuse me whah
<samueldr> I don't know much details though
<ky0ko> there's a pinephone pro in the works, i hadn't heard about a pinetab pro
<ashkitten> im INTERESTED
<samueldr> I think they may be related
* ashkitten 👀
<samueldr> I really don't have details though, I'd have to read carefully through logs
<samueldr> it came up in a discussion about the pinetab "expansion slot"
<abathur> > spongebobify "I seem to have lost SSH access to my garage door."
<{^_^}> "i seEm to HaVE LoSt SsH ACcESs To MY gAraGE DOOR."
<samueldr> https://i.imgur.com/J9NQy7n.png <- related to that thing
<V> there's a PINE soldering iron as well
<V> and security camera
<V> and [...]
<samueldr> hmm
<samueldr> might be what ky0ko said
<samueldr> >> if PineTab and Pinephone projects goes well, then we can come out a 4.7' PineTab that can accomodate plug-in module such as LTE, Lora, and etc
<samueldr> or at another point in time
<samueldr> I can't seem to find what I had in mind though
<samueldr> just checked, fairphone 3 is better than fairphone 2, but lacks bands
<samueldr> the annoying thing about bands, is that it's totally opaque
<samueldr> while I can see which bands my telco operator uses, no way to know what it means to lack support for a band
<samueldr> is it like one antenna out there or am I literally missing the majority of them?
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<samueldr> I guess y'all end up seeing them in other ways (I post them on my twitter and the discourse thread), but here it is anyway: https://mobile.nixos.org/news/2020-10-06-august-september-round-up.html
<samueldr> there's also the RSS feed https://mobile.nixos.org/index.xml
<lovesegfault> do I need to do anything fancy to start using flakes?
<samueldr> Nix
<samueldr> Nix is pretty fancy
<samueldr> spiffy even
<lovesegfault> :D
<samueldr> the bee's knees?
<samueldr> sorry, I don't actually know, other than you might want to use nixUnstable, though even then I'm not sure it's _required_
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<pinpox> Hello, just getting into nix. Any good recommendations on interesting nix(os) blogs or news to follow?
<samueldr> there is a planet https://planet.nixos.org/
<samueldr> that means two things
<samueldr> 1) GET YOUR INTERESTING BLOGS ON IT Y'ALL, if you need information ask
<samueldr> 2) hopefully there's all the interesting blogs on there for you pinpox :)
<samueldr> I should (1) add tagging and an rss feed for tags on my site and (2) blog about nix/nixos maybe?
<pinpox> samueldr: thanks looking into it!
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<ashkitten> samueldr: what if a blog is uninteresting?
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<samueldr> about Nix, Nixpkgs or NixOS?
<samueldr> unlikely
<ashkitten> samueldr: is that a challenge?
<samueldr> yes
<eyJhb> samueldr: it needs some wrapping :/
<samueldr> eyJhb: what does?
<samueldr> planet?
<samueldr> that's probably a design from the early 2000s
<eyJhb> Yeah
<samueldr> before screens were wide :)
<samueldr> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN" "https://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
<samueldr> look at that
<ashkitten> i could create a blog which just aggregates the titles of the least commented, status:merged pull requests of each week
<eyJhb> Shhhh :p
<eyJhb> But it has a very long line...
<samueldr> ashkitten: see, that's interesting
<ashkitten> is it?
<samueldr> yes!
<samueldr> the under-the-radar list of things that happened!
<samueldr> $ cat /nix/store/4pmrswlhqyclwpv12l1h7mr9qkfhpd1c-hello-2.10.drv
<ashkitten> but it's only things that nobody cared about and are mostly automatic updates
<samueldr> eyJhb: a derivation will do that to the design :)
<samueldr> ashkitten: sure, but then it's interesting in a way, you see that it's uninteresting stuff
<samueldr> the fact that it's uninteresting makes it interesting here
<ashkitten> i mean, i sure as hell wouldn't subscribe to that feed
<samueldr> I wouldn't either
<samueldr> but the fact that it's being noticed makes it somewhat interesting
<samueldr> eyJhb: I guess at some point the planet may get a basic coat of paint
<samueldr> though that's pretty low in the order of priorities
<ashkitten> "notable" and "interesting" are different concepts :p
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> you're right
<samueldr> but it's interesting that they were notable
<samueldr> the changes themselves are uninteresting!
<samueldr> (probably)
<ashkitten> how many prs are merged a week anyways
<samueldr> maybe ~450
<ashkitten> lotta prs
<ashkitten> haha
<ashkitten> it always gets weird around release time doesn't it?
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> though
<samueldr> that doesn't seem right
<samueldr> OH
<samueldr> could open be the delta of *leftover* open PRs?
<samueldr> it sure has to be
<samueldr> surely in a month there's not been 535 PRs opened
<samueldr> that's 535 left over from that span
<ashkitten> i think it's any PR with activity (comments, etc)
<ashkitten> and the count of status:merged vs status:open
<ashkitten> so it's not an accurate count of how many were opened or merged
<ashkitten> only how many are open or merged, that were discussed in the past week
<samueldr> I don't know what it's trying to show
<samueldr> but I don't think "0" applies to many metrics
<ashkitten> i hope the string value "0" applies to 0 metrics
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<gchristensen> so, this is almost working: https://gsc.io/snaps/040e2769-c16e-4a66-a477-549793642381.png
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<gchristensen> the problem I'm seeing right now is I'm running that prompt as my user, and need to recover root to do the upgrade -- and gksudo / lxqt-sudo don't seem to work from a user's systemd unit... or I need to find a way to graphically prompt the user from a root unit
<__monty__> Interesting. Would "next boot" build the system without switching? So, not run during boot?
<gchristensen> it'd upgrade the system's bootloader but not switch the running services
<gchristensen> by the time this prompt is up, the system is already built
<__monty__> I'm not one for notifications that keep insisting I update but that'd be a far more painless way to handle it than "update now OR be bothered again in X hours."
<joepie91> gchristensen: wait, what's that screenshot from?
<__monty__> Yeah, pretty cool. Don't have input on your permissions issue though.
<gchristensen> my laptop, joepie91
<joepie91> gchristensen: well yeah :P but like, is this some sort of custom thing, or a new NixOS feature, or...?
<gchristensen> custom thing
<joepie91> ah, right. any chance of that ever becoming a not-a-custom thing in some form? seems useful
<gchristensen> not likely to be un-custom until it works :P
<gchristensen> it'd be cool for it to become A Thing
<joepie91> lol
<joepie91> also, have you tried just setting the X display thingemajig env var in the systemd unit?
<andi-> gchristensen: I am missing the "view changelog" button ;)
<gchristensen> yea (both)
<joepie91> because the unit is probably running headlessly and that's why the graphical sudos aren't working?
<gchristensen> I'm using wayland, and I can't seem to force gksu to use wayland
<andi-> ,locate gtksu
<{^_^}> Couldn't find in any packages
<gchristensen> the missing "t" isn't a typo
<andi-> oh
<andi-> gtk+2.24 o.O
<andi-> that might explain why no wayland
<joepie91> oh, Wayland. yeah then I have zero idea
<gchristensen> I'm not married to gtk, of course
<andi-> gchristensen: pkexec with an "agent" sounds like one of the attractive solutions.. I know you didn't want DBUS ;)
<gchristensen> I just was searching around for gui wrappers around sudo and found a kde one I didn't see in nixpkgs, pkexec which doesn't pop up a gui for me, and gksudo
<andi-> gnome-authentication-agent 🤮 probably requires 30 other services as well
<sphalerite> gchristensen: I think policykit is what you'd usually use for that, though yeah I think that means you need some sort of authentication agent (which includes for example pkttyagent, AFAIU)
<abathur> gchristensen: thanks for reporting that edge-case; it's not exactly what I had in mind when I made that warning
<gchristensen> oh cool
<gchristensen> I think it is a good thing to require allowing
<abathur> I guess the end answer in a case like that is just going to be, if I turn it into an error, having to explicitly specify that it's OK
<abathur> yeah
<abathur> my rough plan is to make it an error after I can "handle" simple (hopefully most-common) cases like `GIT_COMMAND="git"; "$GIT_COMMAND" status`
<gchristensen> nice
<abathur> but, if you've got contra feedback there, I can do it first
<abathur> or weigh it at least :)
<das_j> nice looks like we're going to hit 100k PRs today \o/
<lassulus> or issues
<__monty__> Yeah, mixed count.
<lassulus> so will 100k be an issue or PR?
<abathur> gchristensen: also, after many previous fruitless searches, I think I've finally identified a few candidate projects that, on both macOS and linux, can execute something and record sub-executables that run
<gchristensen> oh?
<gchristensen> :o
<abathur> :]
<abathur> I have two working well with fairly small interventions on packaging, though both have python as a runtime dependency; I have a third (with no runtime python dep) compiling/running with a heavier modifications--but it's not enumerating sub-executions
<abathur> I suspect the latter might work okay on Linux and just need some cross-platform work? it's fairly new, and it seems like maybe macOS support isn't finished
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<gchristensen> sphalerite: are there any light-weight ways to get a policykit agent? I reckon I should go googling some :)
<sphalerite> gchristensen: running pkttyagent, I believe
<gchristensen> a graphical one, though :)
<sphalerite> gchristensen: I'm a little afraid to say this, because I suspect you might actually do it, but pkttyagent + expect + zenity?
<gchristensen> the monkey's paw curls
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<gchristensen> sphalerite: I'd not heard of zenity and I think I shouldn't have
<srhb> sphalerite: Your mind, seriously :P
<gchristensen> sigh, sphalerite, I think I have to do it. My system is prompting me to upgrade my system, and I can't click the "now" button
<abathur> I have some shell functions in my bootstrap/backup scripts that abstract over zenity on linux and osascript on macOS to pop up dialogs and prompts and such
<abathur> prompts in the human sense
<abathur> hey human, do x
<sphalerite> gchristensen: congratulations on being one of the 10000! Had I known you didn't know about zenity I might have kept my mouth shut :D
<gchristensen> haha
<makefu> #100000 GET already?
<sphalerite> makefu: well my 10000 was https://xkcd.com/1053/
<makefu> ah, that kind of 10000
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<makefu> #99964 is the latest open. so only .... 36 PRs or Issues left!
<{^_^}> https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/99964 (by guserav, 2 minutes ago, open): horizon-eda: init at 1.2.1
<makefu> i do hope someone prepared something :D
<sphalerite> r-ryantm has a wonderful package bump coming up.
<cole-h> lol
<makefu> Bump "ALL" outdated packages
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<sphalerite> ugh why can't cmake find libcurl?
<makefu> pkg-config missing as buildinput ?
<sphalerite> it's in nativeBuildInputs, I hope it doesn't need to be in buildInputs for cmake to find it D:
<sphalerite> oh wait wrong channel
<makefu> correct channel i'd guess
<sphalerite> ok, I think the package's makefile is just broken and looks for a feature named "libcurl", which curl doesn't provide
<sphalerite> hrm, though it's been like that in the package for over 5 years
<sphalerite> (the package = springLobby)
<sphalerite> patching the "libcurl" bit out makes it build though, and it seems to run fine too
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<gchristensen> sigh. winter is coming. early October and the pain of cold fingers is already setting in.
<ashkitten> i keep looking for some nice half-finger gloves but i always end up hating the style of everything i find
<drakonis> yiiiiiikes
<sphalerite> is this about the java interface copyright stuff again?
<sphalerite> wow what a stupid analogy fest
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<eyJhb> Follow up about my question about Linux + math. I have begun to use Jupyter Notebook + Sympy/Scipy/Numpy, where it will display equations nicely using mathjax (even the output equations from Python), e.g. https://i.imgur.com/VhrQNvo.png
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<elvishjerricco> I am not a lawyer so I know nothing but I got a vague sense that they made a reasonable legal argument in favor of fair use. Though it bothers me they based it so much in being transformative because they were creating a new smartphone platform. If Google wins, further cases like this will now have to prove that it's fair use for other reasons.
<elvishjerricco> But of course from a programmer's perspective, holy crap would it be a disaster if Google lost.
<lovesegfault> can someone give me a hand and tell me what does `/nix/var/nix/gcroots/profiles` is to them?
<lovesegfault> (i.e. what does the symlink point to)
<infinisil> lovesegfault: /mnt/nix/var/nix/profiles
<samueldr> same
<lovesegfault> does that exist on your system?
<samueldr> no
<infinisil> Nope
<samueldr> it must have come from install
<lovesegfault> huh
<lovesegfault> alright then I'm going insane
<lovesegfault> I had home-manager installing a file with `xdg.configFile.foobar.source ...
<lovesegfault> I deleted that and deployed
<lovesegfault> file is there
<lovesegfault> no matter how hard I try
<lovesegfault> it always puts the file there on activation
<lovesegfault> well, the contents are gone it puts a `{}`
<abathur> gchristensen: set up a repo to poke at these sub-executable trackers https://github.com/abathur/commandeer/blob/main/ci.nix, CI run @ https://github.com/abathur/commandeer/actions/runs/294286402
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<abathur> this doesn't have "cmdcat" building correctly yet; the linux build fails because of this, and the macOS run completes because I excluded it there; hoping to find a minimal set of changes to get cmdcat building on Linux but I'm not familiar here
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<abathur> I did cudgel it into working on macOS, but its output wasn't correct (not sure if I broke it, or if it needs more cross-compatibility work); I'm hoping to find some help getting its expression working on Linux to verify whether it works and have a lodestar for revisiting it on macOS
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<waleee-cl> kernel memory module?
<waleee-cl> ehm s/kernel/core
<waleee-cl> (the irccloud twitter preview wasn't big enough to read the board text)
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<gchristensen> yikes: polkit-agent-helper-1: pam_authenticate failed: Authentication failureSegmentation fault (core dumped)