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<ashkitten>
hmmmmm
<ashkitten>
so i'm looking at alternatives to my current mopidy+icecast for just streaming to my devices
<ashkitten>
and i came across mopidy-mpris and rygel
<ashkitten>
which might work, i'm not sure
<ashkitten>
but using dlna would mean 1) having a upnp renderer on the devices i want to listen with, and 2) having functional upnp on my vpn
<ashkitten>
tinc actually supports multicast which in theory should be the only thing i need to make upnp work
<ashkitten>
but only in switch mode
<ashkitten>
i'm not sure what impact switch mode would have for my phone's battery life since it also has to handle arp updates and all then
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<pie_>
well, the scanning repl is finally taking shape after a lot of fiddling but now the annoying thing is apparently the qr scanner has no feature to just poke URLs in the background
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<ashkitten>
ugh, websites that dont have an rss feed
<ashkitten>
ah yes, "All Operating Systems (OSX, Windows)"
<srhb>
Helpful.
<ashkitten>
All Operating Systems (BSD, OpenSolaris)
<ashkitten>
All Operating Systems (GNU)
<pie_>
current irritation: feh and sxiv wont open thumbnail mode if a directory is empty
<pie_>
who writes the stuff
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<sphalerite>
ashkitten: what do you want from it that you don't have with icecast?
<ashkitten>
latency, mostly
<ashkitten>
i'd really like to not have 2.5 seconds of latency
<sphalerite>
aah
<sphalerite>
is that not something that can be adjusted?
<ashkitten>
er, not really
<sphalerite>
because 2.5 seconds sounds like encoding latency, that's too big for network latency (I hope :P )
<ashkitten>
it's reencoding on the fly, to fixed bitrate opus, so the latency doesnt fluctuate
<ashkitten>
it's not exactly encoding latency
<ashkitten>
i mean
<ashkitten>
okay, so the client has buffers and the server has buffers and everything has buffers
<sphalerite>
can you trade higher bandwidth for lower latency?
<ashkitten>
maybe, but i don't necessarily want to
<ashkitten>
it's also by no means a perfect solution
<sphalerite>
oh ok, default frame size is 20ms, and it can only go up to 120ms. So that's probably not contributing too much and wouldn't be that helpful to adjust
<ashkitten>
using something like dlna would let me not have to reencode and worry about keeping the stream latency stable even when there's nothing playing
<sphalerite>
ah, that sounds good
<sphalerite>
or you could pre-encode everything :p
<ashkitten>
oh hmmm
<ashkitten>
maybe snapcast is a thing
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<ashkitten>
er, it might be a bad idea to run that on my server since it kinda expects to have low latency
<ashkitten>
like, local latency
<ashkitten>
it's okay, i can run it on my server after i move :)
<ashkitten>
3ms latency babeyyyy
<ashkitten>
(i will probably run it on my desktop anyway)
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<philipp[m]>
You are moving into a data center?
<ashkitten>
philipp[m]: no but i have 3ms ping to the place my server will be racked
<ashkitten>
(in a datacenter downtown)
<philipp[m]>
Nice!
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<philipp[m]>
rsnapshot is really nice and all but moving it to another filesystem is really a pain.
<eyJhb>
ashkitten: that is teasing us with no access to that!
<eyJhb>
:(
<philipp[m]>
My buddy once had sub 5ms rtts to the rocket league servers back when he was in amsterdam university network. I was so jealous.
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<eyJhb>
Yay, just got my pi zero w/ wifi/bt
<eyJhb>
It is so small
<eyJhb>
I love it
<eyJhb>
philipp[m]: The only thing I have a low latency to is dotsrc.org
<eyJhb>
Asd as of git, I don't really use it
<eyJhb>
s/git/nixos/
<eyJhb>
Damn it
<philipp[m]>
I never thought about how lucky we are that we rickroll each other and not megaupload song each other.
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<sphalerite>
philipp[m]: go team filesystem-level snapshots :p
<philipp[m]>
sphalerite: That is the plan and the architecture i'm building towards but I need to support legacy for a while now.
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<philipp[m]>
I'm moving to encrypted zfs dadasets, so I can just push them to a nas that can't read them.
<eyJhb>
philipp[m]: remember all the fun with ZFS datasets...
<eyJhb>
And encrypted things and stuff...
<philipp[m]>
What do you mean?
<eyJhb>
You cannot send `zfs send` from one encrypted dataset to another. And when using zfs send, it will not be encrypted on the receiver side, so you need some other kind of enc there like LUKS
<eyJhb>
AF far as I remember
<eyJhb>
elvishjerricco is the one for all that
<eyJhb>
Discussed it all at length
<elvishjerricco>
Soooort of
<elvishjerricco>
You can definitely send encrypted datasets raw to another pool so the other pool doesn't ever need the key loaded
<elvishjerricco>
There's just some edge cases with pre-existing datasets on the destination.
<elvishjerricco>
Basically you just can't `send --raw | receive -F`
<elvishjerricco>
So if you are trying to raw send to a root dataset, it's not possible. And if you're trying to use a zfs backup tool that works by doing `zfs create` on its own before doing `receive`, you can't have the sender using raw.
<elvishjerricco>
But so long as the destination dataset was *created* using `send --raw | receive`, you're good
<elvishjerricco>
And really for destination datasets, there's really no reason to create them any other way, since you can `-x` and `-o` your way to the desired set of properties
<philipp[m]>
-w, --raw For encrypted datasets, send data exactly as it exists on disk. This allows backups to be taken even if encryption keys are not currently loaded.
<eyJhb>
Well, depends if you will write the tools yourself, or use backtools for it
<eyJhb>
Because most will not work, or at least the one I use beacuse of enc fun
<eyJhb>
And that was 2-3 months ago
<eyJhb>
But might be yes :p
<eyJhb>
tazjin: you are enjoying this waay to much, aren't you? :p
<elvishjerricco>
philipp[m]: A lot of tools do the thing I said does not work
<tazjin>
eyJhb: ... maybe
<elvishjerricco>
Raw works fine but the destination has to be created by the receive command and you can't use receive -F at all
<elvishjerricco>
And a lot of tools do these things wrong
<elvishjerricco>
"Wrong"; they work fine for regular datasets
<philipp[m]>
I was planning an scripting the stuff myself anyway.
<eyJhb>
tazjin: you can debug some code for me instead!
<eyJhb>
I hate this website, they sell this one product which requires cassetts to work (?), but the ones they sell, and only ones, do not match the produkt. WTH...
<eyJhb>
Looks fine
<eyJhb>
Still better than most HS I have seen
<eyJhb>
<3
<eyJhb>
:D
<tazjin>
heh :p
<tazjin>
__curPos could be amazing if you manage to write some code that depends on its own current line, but sneakily
<eyJhb>
If you write any fucked up Nix code, and include a FLAG in it. I will inclue it at Aarhus CTF tazjin :p
<tazjin>
that's not a bad idea
<eyJhb>
You are also free to make it into easy, medium and fuck you
<eyJhb>
:p
<tazjin>
I'm cleaning up the Nix parser in our fork and discovering *all* the edge cases along the way so
<tazjin>
I could probably write a flag that uses every one of them
<tazjin>
hmm
<tazjin>
should probably do some actual work and not Nix stuff for a bit first :p
<eyJhb>
Not sure awyone can solve them, but up to you. :p
<pie_>
also geez xnview is fancy gui-wise but i can find nothing on scripting it, it doesnt have any visible cli flags or documentation for them, and the symbols are stripped so i cant try working around stuff with manual calls
<pie_>
neither feh nor sxiv will open an empty directory in thumbnail mode so the best i can do is a patch or a hack of adding a placeholder image in every directory
<pie_>
at least feh has a github issue tracker
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<philipp[m]>
You know what would be cool for backups? A zfs send wrapper that only allow for encrypted datasets to be sent raw.
<gchristensen>
that would be cool
<philipp[m]>
Shouldn't be too hard, I think I'll give it a shot when I have a bit of time.
<gchristensen>
I like that divio.com wrote a great blog post about docs and it turned in to A Whole Thing for them
<pie_>
fml, all the image viewers ive tried so far either have good guis and useless CLIs, or the CLI ones dont support proper refresh and thumbnails or something
<pie_>
feh has the interface for it but doesnt seem to reload the thumbnail view
<cole-h>
CLI... image viewer?
<samueldr>
CLI shouldn't mean text-mode :)
<__monty__>
pie_: sxiv maybe?
<cole-h>
samueldr: What else could it be?
<samueldr>
command-line interface, not text-user interface
<samueldr>
if you want to have good control over *the command-line* of a tool
<__monty__>
gchristensen: Ah, nice. I thought "A Whole Thing" meant drama.
<cole-h>
How would one display an image in the command-line?
<samueldr>
you could even start such tool from a script, or from a launcher like rofi!
<samueldr>
you don't
<samueldr>
or you might
<samueldr>
but it's not really in the command line
<philipp[m]>
cole-h: There is actually software that render to utf-8. For example gomuks (cli matrix client) suses it to preview images.
<samueldr>
a TUI would maybe use libcaca to transform it into color sequences and chars sequences to show in the text mode
<cole-h>
Maybe I'm lacking imagination, but I fail to see how a CLI image viewer would work (or even be desirable... when I look at my pictures, I want to see the picture, not blocks that resemble the picture)
<samueldr>
because you,re thinking about TUI :)
<__monty__>
cole-h: Terminology, kitty and iTerm2 support inline images. There's also slightly hackier options like w3mimgdisplay and ueberzug. Then there's libcaca-style ascii renderings.
<cole-h>
__monty__: Aren't those "inline images" just as hacky as ueberzug?
<__monty__>
No, the terminals natively support a protocol for image drawing.
<cole-h>
samueldr: Then, would you mind explaining to me how you imagine the interaction flow with a CLI image viewer works?
<cole-h>
I'm still failing to understand :x
<samueldr>
feh ./img.png -> opens an X11 (or wayland) window... or takes over the framebuffer if there's no windowing thingy
<samueldr>
depending on what's desired, the command may still be attached to the terminal, and accept keys, like mpv does
<cole-h>
Oh, I see.
<samueldr>
there is a big distinction to keep in mind between CLI and TUI
<cole-h>
It was so obvious I was overlooking it :D
<samueldr>
:)
<samueldr>
if you have an image viewer that has poor usability in CLI, maybe you can *only* select a file, and not let's say, --fulscreen it
<samueldr>
(that's my understanding of this at least)
<samueldr>
meanwhile, if you have something like less, tig, vim, those are TUI, they use text to present the user interface, generally into a terminal
<cole-h>
I see.
<cole-h>
So, if a TUI is the "opposite" of a GUI, what is the "opposite" of a CLI?
<__monty__>
And then there's ranger which mixes TUI with image displaying hacks.
<__monty__>
I wouldn't call TUI and GUI opposites. More like TUI is a GUI in a restricted environment.
<samueldr>
^ that exactly
<samueldr>
the GUI, while not strictly opposite, is an entirely different realm of user experience than a CLI
<samueldr>
but your GUI may be started by a CLI!
<samueldr>
in Linux, most of the time it is, transparently!
<samueldr>
(well, CL without I in some ways :))
<samueldr>
catch-22
<__monty__>
Just read some logs pointing at repology to compare the number of packages in brew (~5k) and nixpkgs (~62k). I wonder how many of those in nixpkgs are actually darwin-compatible though even if restricted to eval rather than actual testing on darwin.
<cole-h>
Anybody else having issues with GitHub, or is it just me? "Issues" being unable to make reviews on PRs, unable to request reviewers, unable to expand diffs, etc.
<cole-h>
Just tried in safe mode, so it's not a plugin. It's either the fact I'm running beta, or one of my many about:config changes.
<cole-h>
OK, it's a profile thing. Broken on nightly as well :( Don't really want to debug this...
<gchristensen>
which project's documentation is your favorite?
<samueldr>
ruby for the API
<samueldr>
though, weirdly enough, the easier-to-use interface is not the one that is under their domain
<samueldr>
same input, different output
<samueldr>
hmmm... no, finally I'm looking at them side-by-side and it's not really better, only less green and a bit bigger font
<ashkitten>
there is a lot of example code and explanations especially in module-level documentation in the rust std docs
<pie_>
*wont be any blocking bugs in upstream tools
<__monty__>
I don't have much experience with but always got the impression the Racket documentation is top-notch.
<pie_>
__monty__: i think you were the one that originally suggested feh
<pie_>
it works but as a workaround for the refresh, i kill the process every time i need a refresh...
<samueldr>
right, looks like it's still like it was. the rust book is totally isolated from the rust by examples, which is from the "std" docs
<samueldr>
no cross-linking
<samueldr>
not terrible, but maybe at least linking to the std function docs from functions would be nice
<samueldr>
there's not even like a "top-level" navigation between what's on docs.rust-lang.org
<__monty__>
pie_: Maybe look at document viewers that support "synctex?" Those should have a reliable way to refresh. (I'm thinking of zathura, which would definitely do jpegs if backed by mupdf.)
<ashkitten>
yeah
<ashkitten>
it's a bit rough to go between them
<pie_>
__monty__: does it do thumbnails for a directory?
<__monty__>
pie_: Or keep on trucking, of course : )
<pie_>
__monty__: bzt thats an ieda i suppose
<samueldr>
(well, I'll be told "there's the rust-lang.org/learn page", but I meant as a navigation element)
<ashkitten>
i definitely wish the rust book linked to std docs, i thought it did
<samueldr>
still, the verbiage is top-notch in their docs
<__monty__>
pie_: Don't remember a gallery view, no.
<ashkitten>
__monty__: i'm not surprised that racket, hyped to me as a literate programming language, has good docs :p
<__monty__>
ashkitten: Marketing I've seen was usually "It's a programming language programming language."
<gchristensen>
I guess "erase your darlings" wouldn't be an appropriate talk for the OpenZFS developer summit
<pie_>
next steps are i guess to make the thumbnails more of a bar, and to start adding git-annex integration or something
<samueldr>
gchristensen: how come?
<samueldr>
it's using a specific feature set of ZFS to make this easier
<samueldr>
you could present the limitations of doing the same without zfs?
<gchristensen>
seems off topic for a developer summit
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<samueldr>
ah, maybe, but if you don't submit they surely won't tell you if it is or isn't :)
<infinisil>
Thunderbird now with built-in OpenPGP support!
<infinisil>
And dark mode!!
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<infinisil>
"As of the Thunderbird 78.0 release, the OpenPGP functionality is experimental, and disabled by default.It is hoped to be stable in 78.2 - until then Enigmail users should not attempt to update to 78 until an automatic update occurs. "
<infinisil>
Not quite there yet apparently, but very soon
<gchristensen>
wow
<malik>
infinisil: nice
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<Valodim>
...hoping for the best
<Valodim>
I'm glad they chose not to use gnupg as a backend
<cole-h>
tfw it gets dark mode sooner than Firefox lol
<gchristensen>
they didn't use gnupg? nice
<__monty__>
Are they going with sequoia pgp?
<Valodim>
sadly, no. sequoia is gpl licensed for... reasons
<__monty__>
cole-h: Are you sure? I've had dark firefox for years.
<Valodim>
I talked to the guy who's responsible for the feature a couple times. He's a fairly traditional openpgp user and not as aware of "ux" as a thing that's relevant for development as I would have hoped
<__monty__>
Wait so a custom pgp implementation and everyone's cheering about it?
<infinisil>
I hope this bug is fixed in future thunderbird versions
<infinisil>
(you can find this when you rightclick a mailbox -> Properties)
<srhb>
eyJhb: still not my job!
<eyJhb>
DAMN IT srhb
<eyJhb>
It is the other way around..
<eyJhb>
Then, get me some books for the weather!
<philipp[m]>
eyJhb: What do you need?
<philipp[m]>
Just a word of waring: I'm friends with a lot of meteorologists and I have yet to experience a bbq with them without a ton of rain.
<cole-h>
zzz getting unicorns again
<cole-h>
And now nouveau is getting read faults when starting Firefox. Guess it's time to reboot.
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<eyJhb>
philipp[m]: nicer weather! But actually not any books, just trying to tease srhb , but it is hard when your memory is shit apparntly. I need to prepare exams.. So convex optimisation :p
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<pie_>
erlang seems to be on to something with whatever the supervision trees stuff is, im probably reinventing some of it in python right now
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<ashkitten>
i want better weather...
<ashkitten>
it's too hot
<ashkitten>
i need it to be cold and wet
<gchristensen>
same
<adisbladis>
ashkitten: We can exchange weather
<adisbladis>
You can take the rainy cold and I can take the hot
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: its rainy and cold in Germany?
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: I'm in sweden
<ashkitten>
lmao, that reminds me of every time a trans guy has told me we should just exchange body parts
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: what part?
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: Stockholm.
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: funny how the little stretch of baltic between us makes a diff
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: its pretty warm and sunny in Helsinki today
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: I didn't know you were finnish! Jumalauta!
* adisbladis
only speaks a few words of finnish
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: I'm not
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: are you Swedish?
<adisbladis>
Yeah
<ixxie_>
Jette bra
<adisbladis>
Jätte*
<ixxie_>
transliterated; no umlauts on my keyboard :D
<ixxie_>
well, that's my excuse anyway
<ixxie_>
Stockholm native?
<adisbladis>
Yes, but I haven't spent much time here in the last ~6 years
<adisbladis>
Only got stuck here because of border closures
<ixxie_>
aha, where do you normally live?
<adisbladis>
Umm, that's a complicated question
<adisbladis>
I was living in the UK, on my way to move to NZ
<ixxie_>
hah
<adisbladis>
But I was only living in the UK for a bit over a yea
<adisbladis>
r
<adisbladis>
Before that I was living in Hong Kong
<adisbladis>
So.. Complicated question :P
<samueldr>
the UK is quite a detour, from HK to NZ ;)
<ixxie_>
so to simplify we can just say you live around the common wealth
<adisbladis>
Yeah... Quite a detour, quite a mistake.
<ixxie_>
although not sure if HK counts anymore
<adisbladis>
Culturally I'd say so
<adisbladis>
Legally & judically not so much
<adisbladis>
I really miss that place every day regardless
<abathur>
best of all worlds, here; rained off and on most of the day and kept our high down to a downright tolerable 86 with a heat-index of 97ish
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<abathur>
how long were you in HK?
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<adisbladis>
About 4 years
<samueldr>
dunno, but I think my day at ~26° high, ~23°C at 19:37 and low (49%) humidity is pretty spiffy
<samueldr>
much better than the 90%+ of the last few days
<samueldr>
adisbladis: you know that means that, next, you'll have to experience the commonwealth in north america ;)
<abathur>
oof
<adisbladis>
samueldr: I hope not :P
<adisbladis>
Though canada seems pretty nice
<samueldr>
why "I hope not"? :)
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<samueldr>
I may be biased in saying that, at least the bit I live in is pretty nice :D
<ixxie_>
which bit is that samueldr?
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<samueldr>
Québec
<adisbladis>
samueldr: Nothing against it, just want to stay on course.
<ixxie_>
aha
<ixxie_>
samueldr: I think honestly Canada is one of the few places in the world left where I may want to live
<samueldr>
though, adisbladis, I did mean *after* your stint in NZ :)
<ixxie_>
samueldr: my only worry there is that the US seems super unstable atm and even though it seems unlikely to spill over to Canada, you never know
<samueldr>
also, canada is vast, and the people, regions, climate, culture, it's way different wherever you go
<samueldr>
spilling over is unlikely, it's not like the border has any big cities next to it for most of it
<samueldr>
and, thankfully, our cultures and values are not totally intertwined in a way where it would happen
<ixxie_>
Well, I am not talking about the unrest spilling over
<adisbladis>
samueldr: I'm hoping to settle somewhere and stop moving around
<adisbladis>
It's pretty tiring
<ixxie_>
more like, nuclear fallout?
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: know that feeling
<abathur>
until the caravans of dirty americans start fleeing towards the border
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: I decided on Finland after living in a couple of other places too
<gchristensen>
I feel really happy about moving to a small rural-ish town
<samueldr>
uh, nuclear fallout is pretty grim, and unlikely to be a canada-only situation
<abathur>
crossing the great lakes in overcrowded boats
<gchristensen>
I never would have moved here if I didn't have a brother move here for a job, but I'm incredibly glad I did
<ixxie_>
true samueldr
<samueldr>
at that point we'll build the wall, abathur, and mak them pay ;)
<adisbladis>
Just wanna live a stable, normal life now..
<adisbladis>
Get a house, have kids & all that jazz
<ixxie_>
I wanna have a stable life, in a serene ecovillage full of hackers, with orgies every Tuesday and Friday
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: You're not asking for much, are you? ;)
<ixxie_>
Doable I think
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<adisbladis>
gchristensen: I can totally get that
<ixxie_>
not easy at the moment, since there aren't many hacker ecovilleges, but yeah
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<ixxie_>
gchristensen: so you just having a remote career right?
<adisbladis>
I've wanted to live in big cities for some time, but with my priorites shifted it's the exact opposite
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: Finland is pretty great :)
<ixxie_>
yeah its nice
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: I'm wondering if we can have our cake and eat it in a decade or two
<gchristensen>
ixxie_: for as long as I can, yeah. I might try to start a company if I couldn't get a job and needed one
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: party in the city, passout in a selfdriving electric minivan that drives you back to your village
<adisbladis>
What do you mean?
<ixxie_>
gchristensen: I would be very curious what kind of company you would make
<adisbladis>
Sounds like my life in HK :P (except there was a taxi driver)
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: nice :D
<adisbladis>
It's really too bad the CCP is ruining it
<adisbladis>
I would have loved to stay
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: I'm gonna try and get that hacker ecovillage going somewhere in Europe, and my main candidates atm are Finland or Bavaria
<adisbladis>
But it's no place to build a future
<ixxie_>
I'm planning to be 1-1.5h from a large city, and establish a minibus going directly to the city to make it easy to half a life in the city
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: Whereabouts are you from originally? I'm always surprised to see people move to scandinavia.
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: Dutch/Israeli
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: lived in Israel, Netherlands, Austria and short stints in US/Sweden (Lund)
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: ended up here because a friend from my studies in Vienna had hooked me up with a research position in Helsinki
<abathur>
that seems so far out to me, but I suppose an ecovillage must be
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: money ran out, but I liked it so I stayed
<adisbladis>
ixxie_: Ohh :) I visited Israel last year
<ixxie_>
abathur: the distance is not designed for a daily commute but rather for travelling a few times a week to the city at most typically
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: Israel is whack yeah :D Finland is like the opposite in so many ways
<ixxie_>
adisbladis: which is one of the things I like here