gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
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<infinisil> Oh no, my phone's touchscreen is breaking.. and I almost can't use it anymore because of that
<gchristensen> sometimes a screen protector will make it usable again
<infinisil> Lol, I can't turn off snooze like that, so the alarm goes off and off again
<andi-> infinisil: need a hammer? ;)
<infinisil> That would be *a* solution for sure..
<infinisil> Whoaa, you know what
<infinisil> I can use Siri! It's useful for once!
<Taneb> infinisil: you can also plug in a mouse with the right chain of adapters
<infinisil> Damn
<andi-> Technology. Amazing. :)
<adisbladis> I believe in andi-'s solution. It's a good general one.
<clever> infinisil: a bluetooth mouse also works
<clever> but yeah, you need a usb one to connect the bluetooth
<infinisil> It's an iPhone though..
<clever> your on your own then :P
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<samueldr> There's this one art piece by a bell labs engineer at the Tate
<sphalerite> oh?
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<sphalerite> Although there's also the https://www.samsung.com/us/computing/chromebooks/12-14/xe513c24-k01us-xe513c24-k01us/ which is basically the same internals but has a nicer screen
<gchristensen> wow yeah
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<andi-> if I just had a usecase for that nice hardware :/
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<drakonis1> __monty__: its really a matter of "i don't see where can guix go next"
<drakonis1> by going with guile they effectively walled themselves to just guile
<drakonis1> its not like we'll be seeing any other implementations of guix's spin on the whole thing
<drakonis1> i know there's a haskell nix and a rust nix right now
<drakonis1> but they exist within nix
<sphalerite> andi-: small light inexpensive laptop for travelling light? :)
<sphalerite> andi-: bringing forth the non-intel revolution?
<Ralith> non-intel, meh, gimme non-black-box
<andi-> sphalerite: the non-intel revolution yes.. light I doubt it :) My smaller thinkpad is just about 1kg
<andi-> and that is basically the point where I do not really care
<sphalerite> Ralith: well, you can run your own firmware on it
<drakonis1> random question: nix on fosdem/
<drakonis1> ?
<sphalerite> drakonis1: yes, at the very least we mayflower people will be hanging about the Distributions devroom
<Ralith> sphalerite: can I run my own firmware on whatever horrid backdoor chip is inevitably wired in?
<sphalerite> Ralith: not sure about that. There's someone working on doing exactly that though
<sphalerite> Ralith: the older ARMv7 one I had before this one didn't have such a chip
<drakonis1> mayflowers, heh
<__monty__> drakonis1: If the underlying .drv's are identical I really don't see the problem with guile. You could still use nix to generate your .drv's for guix.
<drakonis1> they are trying to get rid of nix vOv
<drakonis1> rather
<drakonis1> rewriting all their components with guile
<sphalerite> I think using guile over bash for building all the software isn't too awful an idea.
<drakonis1> would be nice, yes.
<drakonis1> but the derivations are written with the guile syntax now
<Ralith> what does that even mean
<sphalerite> that sounds more useful than ATerm tbh.
<drakonis1> have you ever written lisp?
<Ralith> I've written quite a lot of lisp; it's much more pleasant than writing nix :P
<drakonis1> its all lisp there
<drakonis1> but its only lisp
<drakonis1> can't use anything
<Ralith> nix and bash are both ad-hoc and archaic, originally built in a hurry without thinking about it too hard and then stuck by compatibility
<__monty__> Nothing prevents you from writing a little guile interpreter for nix.
<__monty__> Or use something like dhall-to-nix but nix-to-guile.
<drakonis1> ya
<drakonis1> well, nothing stops anyone from doing that and it is the nice thing
<drakonis1> which is why nix has the higher growth potential, ain't nothing like being the current cool distro
<drakonis1> speaking of dhall, what happened to it?
<drakonis1> does dhallpkgs exist yet?
<sphalerite> still alive
<drakonis1> neat.
<drakonis1> Ralith: strong words.
* Ralith shrug
<Ralith> if you look at bash and think "this looks like a perfect crystal of design," I don't think there's any saving you :P
<drakonis1> i didn't say that lol
<drakonis1> i think bash is very insane
<drakonis1> never use it for anything complex
<sphalerite> like stdenv? :D
<drakonis1> probably
<__monty__> drakonis1: Also, what are you going on about? Guix has "import nix /path/to/nix_expression"
<drakonis1> which requires installing nix for that
<drakonis1> its for converting nix derivations to guix derivations
<drakonis1> i haven't peeked into stdenv, but i suppose it must be an eye gouging experience
<drakonis1> can someone clarify hnix to me real quick?
<__monty__> Why does it matter if it converts the expression?
<__monty__> hnix is nix reimplemented in haskell afaik.
<drakonis1> its hnix in nix, yes, but what else?
<drakonis1> hnix in haskell, woops brain fart
<sphalerite> what more do you want?
<sphalerite> It's a library for parsing and evaluating nix.
<sphalerite> That's all there is.
<drakonis1> that's pretty much what i wanted to ask about
<drakonis1> that's alright
<sphalerite> There's some neat stuff built on top of it popping up
<__monty__> It's nothing else. Some people hope it'll lead to a typed nix. Don't think that's the goal though.
<drakonis1> the parsing would allow for some fun bits
<drakonis1> i'd like to see more of these reimplementations to pop up
<clever> i recently used hnix to generate some nix files, from haskell
<clever> parsing and evaluation end of it entirely ignored
<drakonis1> ah, welp.
<sphalerite> drakonis1: there's rnix, written in rust, also
<drakonis1> so i've heard.
<clever> i am curious about getting builtins.derivation support in one or both of those, and then benchmarking it with some of my slower nix expression
<clever> s
<clever> though those also involve IFD as well, so that would be another hurdle to get things over
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<infinisil> clever: hnix evaluation is like 5 times slower or so iirc
<clever> dang!
<clever> infinisil: but also, i have a record of making a nix expression that takes over 3 days to eval, and making it eval in under 30 sec :P
<infinisil> Hehe yeah
<{^_^}> hnix#200 (by jwiegley, 26 weeks ago, open): Close the performance gap for parsing and evaulating
<clever> subscribed!
<infinisil> Over 10 times slower in fact..
<clever> infinisil: part of what hnix could speed up, is parallism
<clever> if you have a map function, use mapConcurrently behind the scenes
<infinisil> or even pure parallelism
<infinisil> Well hnix is pure, so you need pure one
<infinisil> I think?
<infinisil> Yeah
<infinisil> Pure parallelism can be quite a head scratcher though!
<clever> infinisil: i think i also heard something about sparks when i was first getting into haskell
<clever> infinisil: one of the sticky points with snack in its current design, is that it involves ~800 IFD events, (one per haskell file in the build)
<clever> and nix evaluates in a single thread, and pauses the eval when it hits IFD
<infinisil> oh that's why it's so slow..
<clever> so its constantly having to stop the eval, and do async builds
<drakonis1> the nix roadmap talk has some nice proposals
<clever> that makes the 1st eval take minutes
<clever> after that, the evals are in the store, so it goes a lot faster
<clever> but IFD is likely still an overhead, since it has to ask nix-daemon if the paths exist
<clever> infinisil: oh, and snack somehow causes a stack overflow exception, lol
<clever> i have to bump ulimit -s to even eval it, in the current state
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<infinisil> Man, sometimes I sure am stupid
<infinisil> I wasted money on multiple occasions here in london now
<infinisil> 1. I didn't know that you couldn't bring big bottles on hand luggage and bad to pay extra for it being checked luggage
<clever> infinisil: i popped 20 pounds into an oyster card, spent 4 getting to the hotel, and i'm not sure i can even use it to get back to the airport
<infinisil> 2. I charged my oyster card with too much (although I think that's refundable)
<clever> infinisil: and it has to be <10 for an automated refund
<clever> i think if the card has >10, you have to talk to a person for the refund
<infinisil> 3. I just bought the "leave at 2pm" fee for my hotel, and now I realize that I need to leave at like 10-11am
<clever> and for extra fun, DST kicks in within 2 hours
<clever> have fun double-checking all your schedules
<infinisil> DST?
<clever> daylight savings time
<clever> clocks rolling back an hour
<infinisil> OHh really that's now..
<clever> 2018-10-27 20:20:56 < mrvn> 1:40 till TZ change. I think I will sleep through it.
<clever> a msg from ~5 mins ago
<infinisil> So at 2am London time it will suddenly be 1am again
<clever> i think so?
<clever> so you have an extra hour!, i think
<infinisil> At which point my time in switzerland will switch from 3am to 2am
<infinisil> Yeah!
<infinisil> Oh darn, I can't set my alarm because of the broken phone..
<infinisil> This just had to happen at the best time eh
<clever> and some random trivia, how to boot ios, in qemu
<clever> complete with how to patch qemu to actually support it!
<infinisil> Me: "My phone is broken", Siri: "You can always get help from apple support" *button to get to apple support appears*
<infinisil> "always"
<clever> lol
<clever> infinisil: have you seen louise rossman on youtube?
<ivan> Louis Rossmann
<infinisil> nope
<clever> i suck at spelling :P
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<infinisil> Ohhh yeah I've seen a couple videos
<clever> i also recently saw something big
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