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<thefloweringash> Linux Hackerman: I haven't looked into the sfp+ yet. I also only have eth0
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<colemickens> now that I've settled back into my thin-client workflow, the pinebook pro is actually pretty useful to me.
<colemickens> I've also come to appreciate how much the wifi makes the browser feel slower than it is
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<samueldr> yeah, the wifi of the pinebook pro is its achille's hill
<samueldr> too bad the wifi M.2 board seems to not be a thing that is being worked on
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<samueldr> colemickens: how's your thin client setup?
<samueldr> what does it consist of?
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<colemickens> I have a legacy free $150/month on Azure, and have nixos-azure working well enough to use. Azure has a new-ish feature where the OS disk is ephemeral (read: actually decently fast). So I basically upload my dev workstation as a disk image, I can boot it as an ephemeral spot VM for insanely cheap prices on the spot market.
<samueldr> everything I didn't want to know ;)
<samueldr> software-wise
<colemickens> otherwise, just neovim, I did take some time to add a few plugins, and I need to fixup a bit of LSP to get it working with Rust again, but it's okay.
<samueldr> ah, so no graphical thinning?
<colemickens> I'm hoping to package Theia for Nix. I think there is Big Potential there.
<colemickens> samueldr: I'm hoping to also play with sway headless and see what that looks like.... but I need to get a few other things done first
<colemickens> samueldr: I also want to play with booting a KVM guest and then... using SPICE to it? To see what that experience is like.
<samueldr> I'm using x2go to thin client to my headless workstation, and I really like the concept
<colemickens> Windows --(SPICE)-->local_linux_server->kvm_guest works really well.
<samueldr> x2go handles multiple displays transparently
<samueldr> (I don't know hwo spice would work)
<colemickens> x2go brings back unfond memories
<colemickens> but that was a decade ago
<samueldr> though, since I want all the cpu power of the machine... a VM is not the better option
* colemickens nods
* samueldr thinks about SPICE wayland composition
<colemickens> tbh I would like a good wayrdp to come into existence
<colemickens> MS may bless us with that though (whether it's actually network transparent is something I don't quite think is clear yet though)
<samueldr> imho it needs to support resizeable desktops (trivial I guess), but more importantly, dynamic heads
<samueldr> I should try that and see how it compares
<colemickens> wayvnc from windows to my server is more than usable. but no multi-mon without just running everything N times, I guess.
<colemickens> (just fired it up, with turbovnc and local pointer emulation it feels really quite ok)
<colemickens> well sway's at 480% cpu so maybe its not that fine
<colemickens> yeah, it's software rendering, which makes sense I guess
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<Ke> sphalerite: thefloweringash if you would remember everything from the discord by heart you would know the secret of the sfp+
<Ke> @JohnnyB what SFP+ modules are you using? I have tested with DAC, Fiber and Copper
<Ke> the SFP+ ports are dpmac 7,8,9,10
<Ke> there are a lot of lines like that, but sadly it's all unstructured and does not contain proper feature matrix, so it's kind of difficult to helpo you indirectly
<thefloweringash> I didn't know there was a discord until you mentioned it recently. I still haven't been there.
<Ke> note that solid-run doctrine does consider u-boot a second class citizen, while it's not strictly documented anywhere
<Ke> it may be that using u-boot will initialize fewer peripherals like it does on mcbin
<Ke> the preferred alternative being EFI
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<Ke> edk2 and edk2 platforms
<thefloweringash> sfp+ is my list of things to look at when I've actually got a use for it. still waiting for my isp to offer 10gb connections. should I expect to see anything without a module present?
<Ke> no idea I haven't had any use either
<Ke> now I could span 10g network at home between mcbin and honeycomb though
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<thefloweringash> I found some dual port 10gb sfp+ pci cards in a junk store for $3 each. haven't found the time to see if they work yet. I figure the longer I wait the cheaper things like switches get
<Ke> I am only trying to reduce the number of devices at home
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<thefloweringash> that requires constant vigilance. a few tiny accidents on the internet and suddenly you're drowning in computers :-(
<Ke> currently it's 3 phones, 5 laptops and 3 desktops and one nas-router, of which pretty much only 2 are in active use
<Ke> hmm 3
<Ke> though laptops can just be stacked so there is maximum fun, when one of them ignites
<samueldr> synergy
<samueldr> synergizing the batteries
<Ke> the problem is that I have a doctrine that I should not throw away still useful stuff, but it has no market value either
<Ke> I can give the items to another hoarder, or store them myself
<Ke> also I lose whole ISA accesses, if I give away my x86 or something
<Ke> giving away Talos2 would feel also bad, but I don't think there is really a market for it
<Ke> having power-3 isa access is almost of no value
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<LinuxHackerman> I want SFP+ in order to use an SFP VDSL2+ module, so that I can hopefully replace my router and my modem with the honeycomb
<LinuxHackerman> I have a switch with SFP ports, but they don't supply enough power for the module :(
<sphalerite> Ke: huh? I had the impression that u-boot is the primary supported firmware
<Ke> ~
<Ke> linus.heckemann: is vdsl SFP+ a pony we can get?
<LinuxHackerman> not much point, since VDSL doesn't support such high speeds
<LinuxHackerman> but I have an SFP modem module for it :)
<Ke> well vdsl2
<Ke> or + whatever
<Ke> point being, I thought the drivers were absolutely proprietary and absolutely b2b quality
<LinuxHackerman> It is unfortunately quite expensive so the only advantage over a fritzbox or whatever is that it takes up less space
<LinuxHackerman> there shouldn't be any drivers involved, just plug it in the SFP port and speak PPPoE over the interface or over a VLAN on the interface (however your ISP does it)
<LinuxHackerman> any drivers except for the NIC itself*
<cole-h> samueldr: OK, made some progress on my rock64 -- the ayufan SPI uboot thing was mucking with things. More experimentation tomorrow.
<Ke> do you have any idea, what sort of settings vdsl2 uses
<LinuxHackerman> the profiles? This device supports all of them
<Ke> is it just autoconfiguration all the way?
<LinuxHackerman> yeah
<Ke> ie. I don't need to know anything
<sphalerite> you need to know what your ISP is doing in terms of PPPoE and VLANs and stuff, but that's generally documented by the ISP
<sphalerite> as for the DSL parameters, yeah, nothing to thing about there
<Ke> if my ISP does dhcp config, do I need to know, what is PPPoe
<sphalerite> do you need login data for your internet connection?
<Ke> no
<LinuxHackerman> then probably not
<Ke> just socket on a wall, there is a ISP router in the basement
<Ke> they know, who I am
<Ke> based on where the signal physically comes from
<LinuxHackerman> wow such modern technology :p we don't have that here in Germany
<LinuxHackerman> then yeah, you should be able to plug in the modem and do DHCP on the interface. Though since I haven't got mine working yet take it with a grain of salt
<Ke> what about that vdsl2+
<Ke> it's not like our ipss love to document specifically what protocols they use
<Ke> not that buying that module makes sense for me, I have isp router that has wifi that absolves me from responsibility of having constant uptime with my own wifi networks
<Ke> rent is 1€/month
<Ke> I guess the electricity costs more
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<LinuxHackerman> Part of my internet service contract refers to the "Schnittstellenbeschreibung" (interface description) which describes quite precisely what the service is from a technical perspective
<Ke> there are modems that do not work everywhere here though
<Ke> and you really end up hoarding bunch of them too
<Ke> when the contracts end the isps normally do not want them back, except DNA that reuses their cable modems
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<pinpox> Can anyone share a minimal example of a working configuration to generate raspi4 sd card images? Mine failes to boot, because it doesn't find /dev/disk/by-label/NIXOS_SD and drops into an emergency shell. The partition with that name seems to exist though
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<Ke> sounds familiar
<pinpox> Ke: I'm using nixos-generators and found some blog posts on raspi images around the internet, but none of the examples seem to work for me, maybe I'm doing it wrong
<pinpox> and nixos-generate -f sd-aarch64 --system aarch64-linux -c sd-card.nix -I nixpkgs=/home/pinpox/Projects/nixpkgs
<Ke> ack, can't help you though, never owned any rpi and never did any nixos image builds
<Ke> I build tarballs and do filesystems on site
<pinpox> I see, well I'll continue trying. Maybe someone else here knows?
<pinpox> I bet there are quite some nixos users using pi's
<Ke> sure
<Ke> meanwhile can you access emergency shell and try to do the mount manually?
<pinpox> I'll try that next, just started flashing the card with a new image
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<pinpox> Hm, I changed something and can't get it to boot anymore. Not sure what I did, now it only displays that rainbow-colored raspi background image when I plug it in
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<rajivr> I just discovered Is there any information on how these derivations are built?
<rajivr> Specifically, I was wondering if I would get a hydra cache for
<rajivr> Sorry, meant to say - "if I could get hydra cache for..."
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<pinpox> In case anyone is interested: I created a simple template for raspi4 images. Just edit base-config as needed and run build script to get a ready baked image
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<LinuxHackerman> The patched kernel does indeed manage to read the initramfs, but fails… for other reasons
<Ke> heh
<Ke> I'll get the ram tomorrow probably or the day after
<LinuxHackerman> oh, you're waiting for RAM to arrive too?
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<Ke> also some cooling equipment
<LinuxHackerman> eh, you can run it with the stock fan until that arrives, just make sure not to be in the same room :p
<LinuxHackerman> (I ordered my replacement fan today as well…)
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<cole-h> Grr, USB disk doesn't work with my rock64 for whatever reason
<cole-h> but it works on my desktop
<cole-h> Not even detected in lsusb / nothing is printed in dmesg
<samueldr> cole-h: is your u-boot build supposed to support usb?
<samueldr> ah, linux
<cole-h> samueldr: I'm using an image from Mic92's
<samueldr> tried other usb devices?
<samueldr> tried other usb receptacles on the same device?
<cole-h> Keyboard works, but complains about power and frequently disconnects
<cole-h> and yes, same result
<cole-h> (The power shouldn't be a problem for the drive since it has an external power adapter)
<samueldr> IIRC Pine usually wires one to the "OTG" lanes to the CPU, and the other to the "Host" lanes
<samueldr> though the OTG receptacle should always work as well as host AFAIK
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<cole-h> I've got dwc2, ehci-platform, and ohci-platform showing up in dmesg
<cole-h> and none of the usb ports work for this disk
<samueldr> and they work for other disks (e.g. usb flash drive)?
<cole-h> yep
<samueldr> is this in stage-2?
<cole-h> I'm at a tty
<samueldr> yeah, but after initramfs started systemd from stage-2, right?
<cole-h> Yep
<samueldr> okay, then modules should be available so it's (probably) not an issue with modules not being available
<cole-h> e.g. I see the "Welcome to NixOS" message
<samueldr> unless *somehow* that usb drive uses some other weird mode for usb storage for which the module isn't built
<samueldr> check with lsmod on a linux computer where it works
<samueldr> I don't know how to make it list only the modules needed for that usb drive though
<samueldr> but if you paste (bin) the whole output it should be possible to figure it out with dependencies
<samueldr> then with cateee figure out which kernel config option enables that
<cole-h> This is what happens when I plug it into my desktop
<samueldr> *then* check for /proc/config
<samueldr> most likely CONFIG_USB_STORAGE, which you probably have enabled if other usb storage works :/
<samueldr> tried other cables?
<samueldr> (if it applies)
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<samueldr> CONFIG_SCSI is a requirement for CONFIG_USB_STORAGE so I wouldn't think it'd be missing
<samueldr> also, you only talked about ehci and ohci, I wonder if xhci would be used
<samueldr> check also for CONFIG_ENCLOSURE_SERVICES just in case
<cole-h> =m
<samueldr> I would *assume* raid and btrfs not being present wouldn't make the drive not show up
<samueldr> =m should be fine (check with lsmod on the rock64 that they did end up loading?)
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<cole-h> I modprobed ses, which required enclosure, so I think that's fine
<samueldr> yeah, ses is CONFIG_ENCLOSURE_SERVICES
<samueldr> >> [69468.699152] usb 4-4: new SuperSpeed Gen 1 USB device number 2 using xhci_hcd
<cole-h> This is a piDrive (very old) and has its own connector to the sata / power / whatever on the disk
<cole-h> so I can't easily check different cables
<samueldr> check again for xhci on the rock64
<samueldr> since that's at the "start" of your issue
<samueldr> right, so built-in
<samueldr> I don't know for sure, but my gut feeling is that if it doesn't start the usb stuff like that initially, things are going wrong with the usb side of things before the kernel can even be aware of it
<samueldr> cole-h: what about u-boot?
<samueldr> I don't know if your u-boot is built with usb support though
<samueldr> but it has some commands to scan usb
<samueldr> it's a different usb stack from the kernel
<samueldr> speaking of kernel
<samueldr> _latest?
<cole-h> Linux nixos 5.4.80 #1-NixOS SMP Tue Nov 24 12:29:24 UTC 2020 aarch64 GNU/Linux
<samueldr> try _latest
<cole-h> Don't know how to do that using the mic92's repo x)
* cole-h investigates
<samueldr> though unclear if it's extra config for that image builder thing
<samueldr> oh
<samueldr> cole-h: you won't really be able to
<samueldr> it's using the prebuilt image from hydra
<cole-h> ah, but there's a kernel_newer or whatever variant IIRC
<samueldr> well, we _are_ building a new kernel image variant too
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> but you could nixos-rebuild on device
<cole-h> I haven't even installed yet. Just booting from the sd image
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> the sd image is intended (but not forced) to be nixos-rebuilt
<samueldr> in-place
<cole-h> Oh, I see
<samueldr> this is useful, or required even, for systems where you can't boot from an external device!
<samueldr> and part of the pain for designing the initial install flow
<samueldr> (1) user may not be able to nix-build aarch64-linux native derivations
<samueldr> (2) user may not be able to install to another device (usb storage, internal storage) than the boot device (sd image)
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<cole-h> Ah, I see
<cole-h> So that's why the SD image had a ~Nix-FHS setup
<cole-h> samueldr: How do I expand my disk image? Do I have to insert the SD into my computer and resize the partition there?
<samueldr> you could do that
<samueldr> there was a bug (now fixed) introduced in the early boot scripts
<samueldr> it should have expanded... unless you are using one of those images, which you probably are
<samueldr> though yes, just plopping the SD card in your computer and resizing the partition/FS is fine
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<cole-h> OK, let's try with 5.9.11
<cole-h> Nada
<cole-h> Nothing in all 3 of the USB ports :(
<cole-h> OH WAIT
<cole-h> Got it!!
<cole-h> I had to replug the power cuz the drive was in sleep mode or something
<cole-h> I wonder if there's a way to disable that...
<cole-h> samueldr++ Thanks, I think the `linuxPackages_latest` thing did the trick.
<{^_^}> samueldr's karma got increased to 307, it's a crit!
<cole-h> samueldr: Do you know how I can continue to use the SD card as a boot device, but have nix installed to the hard disk?
<samueldr> yes
<samueldr> you could use it *solely* to store u-boot, if you wanted
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<samueldr> or you could make it hole the /boot partition, which would have the extlinux.conf file for u-boot, and kernels/stage-1 images
<samueldr> while rootfs is your external drive
<samueldr> in fact, if you install to anything else than ext, I think you're kinda forced into that kind of setup
<samueldr> (though that boot partition could be on the external device)
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<cole-h> samueldr: Oh, so I could just put the rock64 uboot on the SD card after I've installed everything (including /boot) to the external?
<samueldr> that's an option
<samueldr> or, in your case, remove the partitions from the sd card, and keep that u-boot
<cole-h> OK, that's on the list for tomorrow, then.
<cole-h> Thanks for your help thus far.
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