gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
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<drakonis> sushi has been had
<drakonis> so good
<infinisil> And I've just had some very spicy ramen, so good too!
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<infinisil> Looks like a major outage is happening rn
<infinisil> Youtube is affected
<samueldr> seems to work fine here
<infinisil> Well, videos don't play at least, and it's very slow
<samueldr> videos are likely served as-extremely-locally as possible
<infinisil> Usually I'd link to https://www.isitdownrightnow.com/, but that's down right now :)
<samueldr> right, I didn't check a video
<pie_> someone said youtube is getting outages
<samueldr> pie_: yes, infinisil did
<pie_> no i mean other places too
<samueldr> good thing I started youtube-dl'ing all my subscriptions in advance rather than using mpv (which uses youtube-dl)
<infinisil> Nice
<samueldr> (manually)
<infinisil> Oh, not as nice
<infinisil> That wouldn't be feasible for the amount of subs I have
<samueldr> maybe some day
<Ashy> haha
<worldofpeace> anyone have any idea why nixos discourse says it's in read only mode?
<abathur> updating? it wasn't last time I looked, though I'm not sure when that was
<hexa-> yeahm likely updating
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<worldofpeace> sounds about right. thx
<gchristensen> 21 hours battery life ... must be a fluke.
<samueldr> maybe not, things are getting quite exciting in some ways with energy use
<energizer> what's the use case for 21 hours? it's too long for a day's work, not long enough for a weekend getaway
<infinisil> "21 hours" might be 21 hours of doing text editing. It might be only 8 hours of compiling stuff
<energizer> true that
<samueldr> 21 hours of computer use during a week-end getaway isn't getting away!
<samueldr> at that point it's less about a use case, but rather they have the max capacity allowable on a plane, and that's how it ends up being used
<samueldr> they can't really cram more battery in there, usually
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<elvishjerricco> Wait what computer is claiming 21 hours of battery life?
<gchristensen> my xps
<elvishjerricco> Huh. That's an intel cpu, right? Intel is not known for great power efficiency...
<gchristensen> I said a fluke!
<gchristensen> now it is claiming just 19
<gchristensen> elvishjerricco: aes-256-gcm is the good stuff in 0.8.x, right?
<elvishjerricco> gchristensen: After a certain minor release number, yes. I forget which one
<gchristensen> the one we have certainly
<elvishjerricco> I *think* it was 0.8.4
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: more inscrutable details https://twitter.com/never_released/status/1326603687742087169
<infinisil> elvishjerricco: What was the problem with it before that?
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: That tweet contains confusing wording so I'm not sure what they're saying :P
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: inscrutable I said
<elvishjerricco> infinisil: Couple of things. Primarily, it lacked simd acceleration. But it also used ccm by default if you just set encryption=on, which performs worse
<elvishjerricco> All because the kernel GPL'd the FPU functions
<samueldr> I think they meant that `csrutil` is going to be how you'd "bless" something to boot, rather than using the lower level `bputil`
<infinisil> I see
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: Ah, interesting
<elvishjerricco> Of course it won't matter if we can't make GPU driver for these things
<samueldr> people eventually will
<samueldr> but even without gpu driver, you can get by with a simple framebuffer driver I would bet, like you can on iPhone
<samueldr> as long as the firmware initialized it
<samueldr> though, you say "it won't matter", I think it will if you can run bare-metal KVM to *then* launch macOS
<samueldr> (without graphics)
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: That's a fair point. There's gchristensen's cool stuff for booting macos over a Linux ZFS volume.
<elvishjerricco> Which of course may require a driver for that custom SSD controller...
<samueldr> exactly what I'm thinking about; hydra builders
<abathur> my 2013 macbook air would estimate over 21h with wifi off and ST3 and a few terminals open
<__red__> Should an updage to glibc for nixos-20.09 go into staging or staging-next?
<__red__> for 20.09
<gchristensen> -dev :) too off (on) topic for this chanel
<gchristensen> hmmm this nixos iso doesn't see the wifi adapter
<samueldr> new_kernel?
<samueldr> dmesg | grep -i firmware # or maybe fw
<gchristensen> I just fetched whatever I got from the website
<samueldr> so, no
<gchristensen> :D
<gchristensen> no big deal, I was going to erase the disk anyway
<samueldr> y'all should stick with ~2014 era laptops, works just fine here
<gchristensen> lol
<__red__> hah - okay :-P
<infinisil> Hm, would it possible to hold lockdowns every other week to slow it down, but not drive everybody insane
<samueldr> it takes around 2 weeks for an "event" to show its full potential in the community, COVID-19-wise
<samueldr> so e.g. you do lock down, it will take at least two weeks until the new cases _stop rising_
<samueldr> so it's not really a realistical thing to hope for, it might slow down, but keep climbing exponentially :(
<infinisil> Like, holding weekly lockdowns should at least help
<infinisil> (assuming social distancing is still done in the other week)
<infinisil> In comparison to just social distancing all the time
<infinisil> s/weekly/other-weekly
<infinisil> And it's a state that might be maintainable over a long period of time
<infinisil> In comparison to e.g. a single 6 week lockdown
<samueldr> but when a lockdown is in place, at least here, it's because social distancing is not cutting it
<samueldr> because there is no situation where there is no social distancing
<infinisil> I guess the main point I'm making: full lockdown is too harsh, but only social distancing doesn't really cut it, so how about a middle ground
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<samueldr> there is no middle ground :/
<infinisil> I just proposed a middle ground..?
<gchristensen> anyone else have a knowing chuckle when they typo nix-hell?
<samueldr> AFAIUI your proposal will give the same results as no lockdown, but later
<samueldr> yeah, things suck, they might and will get worse, then they'll get better
<infinisil> samueldr: Suppose somebody gets infected in the non-lockdown week but they don't realize it yet. During the lockdown week they do, which leads them to stay inside for that week and the following ones
<infinisil> I can imagine that this would happen a lot
<cole-h> What if they don't realize they're infected until after the next non-lockdown week
<cole-h> Now they've infected everybody they came into contact with, no?
<cole-h> Or risk doing so, anyways
<samueldr> I don't know when the infectious phase of this virus is, is it before or after symptoms start?
<infinisil> That also happens with no lockdown anyways. I'm saying that you can at least prevent a portion of people realizing it earlier, before spreading it more
<samueldr> my gut feeling really is that any saving it does, the equivalent opposite effect is likely to happen a week later or earlier :/
<samueldr> you've said it, that's going to happen with no lockdown anyways, which is why there is a lockdown
<infinisil> I mean, from a purely mathematical perspective, the lockdown <-> no lockdown is a spectrum, and the spread of the virus is pretty much continuous along that line
<samueldr> so yeah, it's going to _slow_ down propagation, but it's still going to propagate
<infinisil> So assuming no human strategizing is in play (which in reality we can't ignore), having other-weekly lockdowns *has* to help
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: Slower propagation is valuable
<elvishjerricco> Lessening the stress on the healthcare system is important
<samueldr> yes
<infinisil> samueldr: Yeah, but we just need to keep the R_0 or whatever it's called as low as possible
<samueldr> but as far as my gut tells me, the only thing the proposal does is delay the same end-result
<elvishjerricco> infinisil: Never seen the term R_0. What is that?
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: which is still useful
<elvishjerricco> Delaying eases stress on healthcare
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: yes, but I don't think you get where I'm coming from
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: the proposal from infinisil is to do lockdown one week in alternance
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: of which I think: that's just delaying things that will happen, probably not enough to matter; the full lockdown is the way
<infinisil> Of course a full lockdown would be best to prevent spread. But economy and the psychology can't handle that
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: Yea I don't have the knowledge to argue the matter. But I would be surprised if the alternating plan would slow the spread measurably
<samueldr> elvishjerricco: so I think we agree
<infinisil> I think this calls for a simulation!
<elvishjerricco> Would not* sorry
<infinisil> Hehe
<samueldr> my uneducated gut feeling also thinks this would not slow the spread as much as anyone would hope
<samueldr> uh
<pie_> i need more ram...i cant migrate tabs to my wiki fast enough...
<elvishjerricco> I'll copy and fix my message to be clear :P
<elvishjerricco> 9:44 PM <elvishjerricco> samueldr: Yea I don't have the knowledge to argue the matter. But I would not be surprised if the alternating plan would slow the spread measurably
<infinisil> I'd like to summon 3blue1brown for simulating this
<samueldr> my gut feeling tells me it'd give you about a week in offset
<elvishjerricco> Yea I don't have the knowledge to make a claim about it
<samueldr> coming from the fact that things are definitely not instant
<pie_> i summon the fifth piece of exodia and activate my blue eyes white dragon in trap mode
<pie_> check mate gandalf
<elvishjerricco> Lol
<samueldr> where I'm from, things got heated in a day, and it took two weeks until we hit the tip of the spike in new daily cases, from basically about one bad instance of ~50 cases in a day
<pie_> pikachu never saw it coming
<samueldr> that's with "red zone" measures in place
<samueldr> not total lockdown, but basically no gatherings at all
<infinisil> "The researchers also estimate that the mean incubation period for SARS-CoV-2 was 5.1 days." source: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/how-long-does-it-take-for-covid-19-symptoms-to-appear#transmission
<infinisil> 5 days until symptoms after exposure
<infinisil> (mean)
<pie_> what i dont get
<pie_> is why is curfew a thing
<pie_> like, how does that help
<samueldr> 5 weeks after those measures started, we are _just_ about to get back to the numbers from that moment
<samueldr> pie_: bars
<pie_> samueldr: you can close the bars separately
<abathur> kids, parties
<samueldr> that's what is used here
<samueldr> uh, not what is used
<samueldr> but that's the reason I understood from that
<pie_> abathur: hmmm well ok i was going to say they can do that anyway but yeahhh i guess youre right
<samueldr> but yeah, curfew doesn't, in my mind, seem to be a good solution
<samueldr> only if it's in a no-lockdown and gatherings allowed situation maybe
<abathur> they can, but if you've got a curfew you don't have to play games with asking why they're out
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: curfew is better than nothing
<elvishjerricco> Not great though yea
<abathur> and them lying to you about how they're going to get some soda
<pie_> well
<infinisil> Oh also, with a low number of infections left, other-weekly lockdowns probably make contact tracing a lot more effective
<samueldr> I think it's useless if you're in a situation where you can't have gatherings anyway
<pie_> people run into eachother during the day anyway so
<pie_> like, curfew but not full lockdown
<samueldr> I wonder if anywhere else they have the measures we have here
<elvishjerricco> samueldr: Well those infected appear to be twice as likely as others to have gone to bars and restaurants.
<samueldr> yep
<elvishjerricco> So a curfew would quell the bars
<samueldr> yes
<pie_> i live in a dorm
<samueldr> but e.g., here, we're in a "red zone", there is no bars open, no restaurants
<pie_> there is no way they ar enot massive spread centers lol
<samueldr> no gathering
<samueldr> no visits either
<samueldr> but not a lockdown either, as shops are open, takeout is possible
<pie_> but yeah hungary is just now extending measures again
<samueldr> you're free to stroll along outside, but not gather
<pie_> dorms emptying, uni is going remote
<samueldr> and that, I think, is better than a curfew, actually forbidding _at all time_ those activities targeted by a curfew
<pie_> im confused because they seem to be doing both here
<samueldr> we tried making bars close earlier
<abathur> probably
<abathur> it depends on how you are able/trying to enforce it I think
<samueldr> and that's where most of our new cases started from anyway
<samueldr> in superspreader events :(
<abathur> i.e., if you can't legally close the bars, you might have to do a curfew to try and limit how many people risk going
<samueldr> here, there is nothing more enforceable in a curfew than just disallowing gatherings
<pie_> on the upside i can now sit naked in the dorm room all day because my roommate moved home
<pie_> :(
<abathur> you might also have jurisdictional overlap, where one entity can close the bars, and does so
<abathur> and another entity can impose a curfew but not close bars, and does so to make sure it's obvious they're doing something :)
<samueldr> yeah, luckily here it's all on the same level, without that many fine-grained levels anyway
<samueldr> the provinces are given full authority, and there is no cities, "counties" or regions that have jurisdiction that matter here
<abathur> we've had a lot of jurisdictional stuff here
<samueldr> technically a city could have a mandate for _some_ activity sectors that goes further than the provincial government, but thankfully the provincial government "is doing too much" [according to some people]
<infinisil> I wish i was on my computer still so i can run that
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<samueldr> don't IRC in bed!
<infinisil> Damn, is it so obvious that the only non-computer place i go to is my bed lol
<infinisil> Nice
<drakonis> beautiful.
<drakonis> i'll take five
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<ashkitten> gchristensen: you should make it run the fire animation while it's starting up the nix-shell
<gchristensen> it does!
<ashkitten> it seems to exit the fire animation while it builds the nix-shell environment
<gchristensen> ahhh right yeah
* energizer is already in nix-hell without the animation :(
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<drakonis> try to do the doom psx fire
<drakonis> for effect
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* colemickens has broken golang debugging in vscodium under a nix-shell :(
<colemickens> something about /nix/store/rmywhz9886y0x0mxkdb0qib2nmh1pfk4-glibc-2.32-dev/include/features.h:397:4: error: #warning _FORTIFY_SOURCE requires compiling with optimization (-O) [-Werror=cpp]
<colemickens> I guess `dlv debug .` is enough to trigger it in a nix-shell. I don't get google hits but I'm sure someone else has hit and solved this?
<colemickens> You can type three paragraphs out but you can't make the damn horse actually read it.
<colemickens> also, I sitll have absolutely no idea how to get gpg-agent to recreate it's socket files under /run/user, if, for example, you replace them while sshed.
<colemickens> okay, you can manually stop and then start the sockets, I guess that works.
<__red__> Just checking
<__red__> 19.09 is EOL right?
<__red__> We don't have any crazy LTS releases or anything
<etu> Yes
<etu> We don't do LTS
<__red__> thanks
<__red__> didn't think we did
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<eyJhb> srhb: 18GB left now. Think it is time to cleanup/rethink my folder structure + backup plan
<eyJhb> Atm. I have backups of random stuff, that I move into my project folder and then delete again (e.g. 20 GB of data from a simulation for B.A.T.M.A.N. V)
<eyJhb> etu: you use fish right? How do you deal with having fish history persistent? Atm. I use the persistence module, but hm wants to write to the history file as well...
<etu> eyJhb: I symlink .local/share/fish to a filesystem
<eyJhb> etu: Hmm, yeah, that might be better. I only do it with the one file
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<eyJhb> WELL! Okay, now I have 0 disk space left
<ashkitten> hm, at some point i'm gonna have to figure out how to move away from protonmail
<ashkitten> nextcloud has a nice email frontend and having that integration especially with the new nextcloud dashboard would be very good
<eyJhb> I am getting so screwed over atm. by my ZFS
<eyJhb> Tried to mv from one dataset to another, and I ran out of disk space
<eyJhb> Which somewhat makes sense, but... :(
<tilpner> eyJhb: Yeah, I just walked into spa_slop_shift reserving 232.64GB again
<tilpner> (You could check how much it reserves for you, and whether that would make a difference, and then figure out exactly why you would not want to adjust it)
<eyJhb> tilpner: For some reason `rpool/safe/persistent 13.7G 29.8G 3.14G legacy`, so it uses 13.7, but the real size of the dir is 2GB
<tilpner> I need the headers
<tilpner> Ahh, pass -o space to zfs list
<eyJhb> tilpner: Is there any way, I can nuke all snapshots en rpool?
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<tilpner> Did the output confirm that it's mostly snapshots?
<eyJhb> Yeah
<eyJhb> Sorry!
<eyJhb> `zfs list -t snapshot -o name | grep -E '^rpool/safe/persistent' | xargs -n 1 sudo zfs destroy -r`
<eyJhb> Got the job done
<eyJhb> Do you have any good way/fast way of mv'ing tilpner?
<tilpner> No, not really
<eyJhb> RIP space :(
<tilpner> zfs destroy -nvr 'rpool/safe/persistent@%'
<eyJhb> In doubt if I should use rsync or mv
<tilpner> That has no string processing
<eyJhb> Seems a lot cleaner than grepping etc.
<tilpner> Did you manually set that refreservation on dropbox?
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<JJJollyjim> does anyone know of a way to apply a patch series from lkml to a kernel?
<JJJollyjim> not sure if i need to manually copy the urls of all 17 patches from the archive or if theres a better way
<eyJhb> tilpner: Yeah I did, as it needs to be a ext4 volume for Dropbox to work.... :p
<tilpner> Huh
<eyJhb> It will not work on zfs tilpner , it has some build in stuff, to detect that...
<sphalerite> JJJollyjim: probably if you're on the list and have the patches in a mailbox :p
<sphalerite> other than that I'm not aware of a way, though maybe the patch author has their git repo public somewhere?
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<eyJhb> Any good screen recorders for x11?
<eyJhb> Just for a single screen, I am using i3
<JJJollyjim> sphalerite: i do, what next?
<sphalerite> JJJollyjim: git am
<JJJollyjim> oh, i meant in a nixpkgs stdenv.mkderivation
<sphalerite> ooooh
<tilpner> eyJhb: nixpkgs.obs-studio
<JJJollyjim> i'm not sure how ordering works? is it only defined by the subject lines? does git am sort by that?
<sphalerite> me neither
<eyJhb> JJJollyjim: you could just have a list, that you split and give to git am ind a mkDerivation
<eyJhb> Else, if you give patches inside a mkDerivation, it is ordered by .. the list
<sphalerite> you could git am, then use git diff to fold the whole series into one patch, but then you lose all the metadata
<eyJhb> tilpner: Will try :D
<JJJollyjim> git am will need the sources to be a git repo right?
<JJJollyjim> (the thing im patching)
<eyJhb> tilpner: After I have deleted all the empty dirs
<eyJhb> Apparantly I have 2.8 GB of empty dirs
<tilpner> How many did you have?
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<JJJollyjim> i need someone who advocates for mailinglist-based development to point to the tools they use to actually make it manageable
<JJJollyjim> cos it feels pretty hellish to me
<eyJhb> tilpner: 55997 directories, 0 files atm. I think we were at ... 200000 before
<tilpner> Sure, who doesn't have 200k empty directories... >.>
<JJJollyjim> "Note, some patches are also depend to the code from GPIO fixes / for-next repositories. Unfortunately there is no one repository which contains all up to date for-next changes against GPIO subsystem. That's why I have merged Bart's for-current followed by Linus' fixes followed by Bart's for-next followed by Linus' for-next branches as prerequisites to the series."
<JJJollyjim> screaming
<eyJhb> tilpner: rsync will not remove the dirs, only the files :p
<JJJollyjim> (there are also multiple linuses involved and i never know which one they mean)
<eyJhb> Might be a indication of, htat I need to cleanup
<eyJhb> etu: `Error installing file '.local/share/fish/home-manager_generated_completions' outside $HOME` I guess was the reason for not doing the entire fish folder
<eyJhb> tilpner: Well I have the fun https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/94315 issue, so OBS will not work
<{^_^}> #94315 (by balsoft, 14 weeks ago, closed): MESA-LOADER: failed to open $driver
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<etu> eyJhb: I see
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<eyJhb> tilpner: I got obs to work, it uses channels when i nix-shell, so the versions differ, and therefore will not work
<eyJhb> srhb: Fun fact, if you start jupyter lab when there is a 3
<eyJhb> srhb: Fun fact, if you start jupyter lab when there is a 3-4 GB .tar.gz docker image, then it will crash because it will apparantly try to read the file/parse it
<eyJhb> Sorry for dup
<gchristensen> ,chanel
<{^_^}> gchristensen: Did you mean channels?
<{^_^}> Largest Nix channels: #nixos, #nixos-dev, #nixos-chat, #nixos-aarch64, #nixos-security, #nixcon, #nixos-officehours, #nixops, #haskell.nix, #nix-darwin, #nixos-de, #nixos-emacs, #nixos-on-your-router, #nixos-nur, #nix-lang, #nixos-fr, #nixos-systemd, #nixos-borg, #nixos-wiki
<gchristensen> hehe
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<FireFly> ,chanters
<{^_^}> Largest Nix channels: #nixos, #nixos-dev, #nixos-chat, #nixos-aarch64, #nixos-security, #nixcon, #nixos-officehours, #nixops, #haskell.nix, #nix-darwin, #nixos-de, #nixos-emacs, #nixos-on-your-router, #nixos-nur, #nix-lang, #nixos-fr, #nixos-systemd, #nixos-borg, #nixos-wiki
<{^_^}> FireFly: Did you mean channels?
<averell> i'm guessing aarch64 has some growth ahead/recently?
<aminechikhaoui> anyone remembers when wireguard was merged into linux ? I guess I wouldn't need boot.extraModulePackages = [ config.boot.kernelPackages.wireguard ]; for Linux 5.4.x ?
<aminechikhaoui> gchristensen oh so only on >= 5.6.x
<sphalerite> I feel like having logs.nix.samueldr.com on the first page of duckduckgo results for a non-nix-related search query might not be a good sign.
<gchristensen> uh oh
<joepie91> lol
<sphalerite> (anyone here using journalbeat and have any idea why it's exiting immediately for me?)
<sphalerite> (there it goes up the list of search results)
<joepie91> you're making it worse!
<sphalerite> I know!
<sphalerite> OK, let me make it better! It works now that I defined journalbeat.inputs.
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<jtojnar> someone actually made a CMake fork that allows functions to return values :-O
<gchristensen> oh god
<jtojnar> that would make the language from extremely horrible to just annoying
<gchristensen> fair enough :P
<pie_> time to write doom in it
<eyJhb> `Someone has already added that SSH key.` arghhh!
<sphalerite> eyJhb: ooh I like this DoS vector.
<eyJhb> sphalerite: How come ? :p
<eyJhb> Slow process?
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* etu noticed that his blog was linked from the nixos.wiki about ZFS today
* etu is a bit surprised but happy that people found it helpful :)
<aleph-> Okay stupid question because I can't remember. PHP app running over nginx + php-fpm, as a plain cli scipt takes about 18-20s to run like I want. Takes more like 1-2min~ over the local network which I assume is due to the amount of text the service is spitting out. Think increasing data buffers in nginx would help?
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<aleph-> sphalerite: I've fiddled a bit, can help yah later today assuming this isn't work. :)
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<eyJhb> I think etu is the PHP expert :D Not sure if that includes configuration
<etu> eyJhb: I sure know a lot of PHP, but this doesn't really feel like a PHP question
<eyJhb> Maybe you were a nginx+php guru!
<eyJhb> I never know what you are up to! :p
<eyJhb> Btw. etu , ever seen the 0e1234... bug in practice? https://www.whitehatsec.com/blog/magic-hashes/
<etu> eyJhb: yes
<etu> :D
<eyJhb> Uhhhh, your own system?
<etu> yes
<etu> We had a cut down hash at some place that we returned to the clients, and somewhere we triggered some typecasting by accident so we got an integer overflow.
<eyJhb> That sounds like a fun thing to debug! :p
<etu> And yeah, as you can expect the hash was something like 0e14123
<eyJhb> Of course :p
<etu> It's a bit stupid how it tries to auto typecast... to fail... overflow... return 500 server error rather than just... having it as a string.
<eyJhb> etu: Yeah, but there are quite some things, that are stupid :p
<eyJhb> Do you have any fun secfails that you see in PHP often?
<jtojnar> hmm, so much for return values in CMake https://discourse.cmake.org/t/why-cmake-functions-cant-return-value/1710
<etu> eyJhb: Most "security flaws" that people experience in PHP are easily avoided... such as prepared statements, don't deserialize data you don't trust, etc
<etu> eyJhb: don't use eval
<etu> etc
<gchristensen> so many of the problems are just as common in other languages at this point
<eyJhb> etu: but even when they are basic, people still do them! And they are nice
<eyJhb> <?php include($_GET['page']); ?>
* colemickens feels like he's stuck on "babies first socket app today
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<eyJhb> I still loved the, magic_espace_quotes or something like that, and then use it as $query = 'SELECT * FROM ... WHERE $var';, well.. I don't need to escape your quotes if you omit them
<gchristensen> lol
<etu> eyJhb: yes, don't do that :D
<gchristensen> I feel like I'm back in 205
<gchristensen> 2005*
<etu> gchristensen: People just love pointing out flaws of past PHP somehow
<eyJhb> You should just do some google dorks for ?id=, and then have fun gchristensen ! (I do not recommend anyone do this)
<gchristensen> I mean, I know
<eyJhb> etu: I say that less than a year ago
<gchristensen> but people still use pickle
<eyJhb> The problem is, that PHP is easy to get into, and most pay for a design. So you get some designer, whe knows shit about code, making a barely working website that does very weird stuff
<eyJhb> ANd then you end up with things that should be 2000 bugs, but are a 2020 bug
<gchristensen> I'm sorry PHP is so successful
<eyJhb> I saw* damn it
<eyJhb> But I wish I was pointing out old bugs etu :( I fucking wish
<eyJhb> A place I know had a SQLi on their card system, that made it possible to grant your access card rights to EVERYTHING
<etu> eyJhb: Yes, but you can't always blame the language for people writing bad code.
<eyJhb> No no, I don't blame PHP
<eyJhb> I blame the people, but PHP is just popular
<eyJhb> ANd easy to get into, etc.
<eyJhb> I see stupid shit in Python as well :p
<eyJhb> PHP is basically fun, because it is so popular like gchristensen also pointed out. You should know by now, that I love PHP as it was my first real true love <3
<gchristensen> samj
<gchristensen> e
<eyJhb> I remember my first Paypayl IPN integration. Good thing people did not figure out the path to that thing.
<eyJhb> `Ohh this curl thing here? That seems advanced, why do I need to make a request back to Paypals servers?`
* eyJhb <-- was part of the problem
<eyJhb> But everything sec related that people see commonly and maybe less common in some langs, that pose risks etc. I would fucking love snippets of that. Just saying!
<NinjaTrappeur> I was about going to say that without php and easyphp, I wouldn't be reading this channel. These tools have been a superb all-in-one coding introduction for a lot of 2000s kids. But then I just realized easyphp is a very local French thingie that do not even have a English wikipedia page oO
<samueldr> (it crossed the ocean in Québec at least)
<samueldr> I think for me it might be PHP, maybe mirc scripting that got me hooked at first...
<samueldr> oh, and the games factory and RPG maker
<gchristensen> php then gamemaker for me
<srhb> cole-h: Ha! The honor!
<sphalerite> for me it was hypercard, then later my dad got me a C++ book.
<sphalerite> Somewhere along the way I got pretty into PHP too
<sphalerite> hypercard was well before anything else though, I didn't realise I was programming and it was quite a few years later that I asked my dad how programs are made
<pie_> is facebook chat being broken for anyone else
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<waleee-cl> the site is a massive cpu hog, but the chat works
<pie_> nvm turns out it was my local network being very weird
<cirno-999> thought nixos-chat might appreciate my awesome github avatar https://ptpimg.me/fm7d0s.png
<gchristensen> great color matching!
<hexa-> ptp :D
<eyJhb> I did a lot of PHP and SourcePawn for Counter-Strike Source! (sourcemod), and whatever the hell es addons was coded in... :D Hell I miss doing SourcePawn!
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<cole-h> Aw yiss, my Rhythm of War signed copy will be "shipped out by the publication date of 11/17" :DDDD
<colemickens> drakonis: the wait is killing ,e
<colemickens> me*
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<aleph-> Alright promises are annoying
<aleph-> I'd rather be doing PHP >_>