<Infinisil>
But I'd suggest using the nixpkgs.overlays option instead of the stateful script in mozillas overlay
<mellowmaroon>
Infinisil: Do you have a link for how to use that instead?
<Infinisil>
mellowmaroon: Hmm, hold on, I'll try it myself now
<qmake>
the overlay is best in this case, but if you ever have that you want to use something from unstable whilst on stable, you could also do something like this: you can do something like this: unstable = import <nixpkgs-unstable> {}; (e.g. in you nixpkgs packageOverrides) where nixpkgs-unstable is defined in your NIX_PATH, or just by directly supplying a path to it
<qmake>
just know that you then can get a lot of multiple versions of packages, so I only use it for a select few
<c74d>
oh, whoops, for some reason I was thinking that using unstable packages on stable would require building them from source, but now I realize that it could use the same binary substitutes as I do on nixos-unstable
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<mellowmaroon>
Interesting
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<mellowmaroon>
I have another small issue I'm working on: for Android Studio on Gnome+GDM, I can't start it unless I run `xhost local` first
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<Infinisil>
Well I don't know how you'd put nixpkgs-mozilla in nixpkgs.overlays..
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<Infinisil>
I don't think it's possible actually
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<Infinisil>
Yeah it's impossible, you can't evaluate a nix expression (the rust overlay) which only is there at runtime
<mellowmaroon>
Anyway, thank you all for the help :) Need to sign off now. See you all later!
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<Infinisil>
You can however clone the nixpkgs-mozilla repo, then link to it with nixpkgs.overlays = [ (import path/to/mozilla/overlay/rust-overlay.nix) ];
<Infinisil>
Maaan, that means my whole idea with my config templating doesn't work either
<Infinisil>
Oh wait maybe it does
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<manveru>
just specify the unstable channel in your shell.nix/default.nix and use it, doesn't need to be the whole system :)
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<Infinisil>
Argh, the nix manual lied to me, `import ./file.nix` is *not* "completely equivalent" to just inserting the file at that point
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<Infinisil>
E.g. The file with contents ''hello ${test}'' can't be imported because "test" is not known, even if it might be declared in the importing expression
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<clever>
the import statement will return the top-level value of the named file
<rodarmor>
Can anyone recommend a good graphical file browser to use on NixOS? I like Gnome Nautilus, but I'm not running Gnome as my desktop environment, so something lighter and more standalone would be great. If it has a dotfile for configuration, that would be extra awesome.
<clever>
it wont add any values into the global or local scope
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<pxc>
does `nix-store -q --tree` print build-time dependencies in the tree even if they're not actually part of a package's closure for installaiton purposes?
<pxc>
I'm trying to figure out how big the closure for the fish shell is and it looks like it includes all of perl just because perl is a nativeBuildInput of groff
<pxc>
clever: when I examine it with `nix-store --tree (realpath (which fish))`, I see that perl is pulled in by groff, which is a propagatedBuildInput of fish
<clever>
groff is usualy involved in generating man pages
<clever>
i'm guessing somebody put it in the wrong field of fish
<pxc>
clever: but in the groff package, I see that perl is only a nativeBuildInput... so how does it end up in fish's closure
<clever>
if its in the $out of groff, its in the closure of groff
<clever>
all runtime stuff is based on what paths are in $out, not the nix expressions
<pxc>
clever: I thought nativeBuildInputs didn't get put there. but something in groff maybe referneces it?
<clever>
nativeBuildInputs just means it has to be from the host, not the target
<pxc>
clever: what notion of 'in' are we using here? like one of the files contains the path as evidenced by running `strings` on it?
<clever>
more like grep
<pxc>
clever: so it's only run on scripts or plaintext?
<Infinisil>
Maybe you could try running it with groff only in buildInputs
<pxc>
clever: okay, so the dependency on groff for fish is ineliminable, I think (unless we use another implementation for nroff). But how can I stop perl from getting pulled in for groff's closure?
<clever>
we need to grep the groff storepath for the perl path
<pxc>
Infinisil: I will try that. It still seems like a problem that perl is getting pulled in by groff, though
<clever>
pxc: nearly every script in groff is using a perl #!
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<pxc>
clever: yea I was just looking at that now. I'm a bit surprised, because I thought it was a C++ project
<clever>
pxc: it seems to be a mix of perl and elf
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<pxc>
clever: maybe we can switch fish to old nroff or something? let's see what roffery we've got in nixpkgs lol
<Infinisil>
pxc: Why would you want to do that?
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<pxc>
Infinisil: because if there's any version of roff which doesn't pull in perl, installing fish can take 50M less space to download and install
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<clever>
pxc: but perl is probably being pulled in by other things
<Infinisil>
pxc: As I said before, perl is in coreutils
<Infinisil>
And you can't get rid of coreutils
<clever>
at least on nixos
<pxc>
Infinisil: oh, I'm sorry I missed that. so it'll be everywhere that Nix is
<clever>
i see 62 things refering to perl on my nixos machine
<pxc>
clever, Infinisil: I want fish to be smaller so that using nix-shell shebangs which wrap fish is less obnoxious
<pxc>
I want it to be nice on macOS and non-NixOS Linux, too
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<Infinisil>
pxc: What do you mean by smaller? Are you referring to files being downloaded when fish is installed the first time when running the script?
<pxc>
Infinisil: yes
<pxc>
Infinisil: but I see fish depends on coreutils right?
<Infinisil>
pxc: Yeah
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<Infinisil>
fish is going to take at least 10 seconds to install, which is too much time for a script without any output
<Infinisil>
Ah
<Infinisil>
Never mind that
<Infinisil>
But basically you can't make it much faster
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<pxc>
Infinisil: fish is a really great shell for scripting, though, so this is a shame. :-(
<pxc>
and maybe I can do something about the dependency on coreutils if fish doesn't use all of it?
<pxc>
perl's not in coreutils afaict, I'm looking right now
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<pxc>
clever, Infinisil: this means that if we can get perl into a separate output for groff and have fish not depend on it we can get perl out of fis's closure, right: http://termbin.com/peiq
<Infinisil>
pxc: Ohh, sorry
<Infinisil>
I misinterpreted the output of a command
<pxc>
Infinisil: no worries! :-) but does it look like I'm in better shape now?
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<Infinisil>
Hmm
<pxc>
okay, so here's another question, maybe a bit harder. Hopefully not malformed, though: can we use multiple-output derivations to represent optional dependencies? I'd like to have some way of installing fish which doesn't depend on python. Python is only needed by fish for the fish_config webserver and generating manpage completions. If I can get a version of fish without python, I'd like to have it so that
<pxc>
when installing python support one doesn't need an entirely new fish package, so the space for fish itself can be reused. Is that feasible?
<pxc>
becuase the naive approach is to have something like: modify pkgs/shells/fish/default.nix so that it can be built with or without python, then add an attribute like fish.tiny and another like fish.interactive in pkgs/top-level.nix and have them just be made with passing different arguments to callPackage
<pxc>
but that will make it so that if you have the small one installed, you still have to recompile fish to get the interactive one
<Infinisil>
pxc: Sure, you can just have an argument { withPython ? true, ...} to it
<Infinisil>
Then optionally include buildInputs or whatever with it
<Infinisil>
You just need to make sure it builds
<pxc>
Infinisil: right, so that'll give me two fish packages, so to speak, one with python and one without. But they won't know about each other. I think space will be shared through hard linking, but there won't be dedplication in the packages, right?
<pxc>
unless the one with python was actually just a wrapper for the one without it
<Infinisil>
They're not hard links, just soft links, which are used all over nix
<Infinisil>
pxc: There totally will de "deduplication", that's one of the benefits of hashed store paths
<Infinisil>
python can be shared by all things that require python
<pxc>
Infinisil: I mean for the fish components. I know the python will be reused between fish and other packages
<Infinisil>
pxc: For example?
<pxc>
Infinisil: what I'm saying is that when you make two different invocations of callPackage to the same package function, for all Nix can tell tehy are totally separate packages
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<Infinisil>
pxc: Yeah, but when something is already existant in the store it gets it from there, for example the fish source code won't be downloaded twice
<pxc>
Infinisil: so if I have one that includes { withPython = false; } and then go to install one with { withPython = pythonPackages.python; }, Nix is going to begin rebuilding fish
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<pxc>
Infinisil: that's true. Nix is pretty good at deduplication all by itself. But what I'm trying to figure out is a way to refactor the fish package so that its pythonfull version and pythonless version can share dependencies in such a way that the pythonfull version isn't actually its own build of fish
<Infinisil>
pxc: If you make hydra build both python enabled and disabled packages, then you can download both from the nixos cache
<pxc>
Infinisil: that's true, and fish itself is only a small part of the closure. But that's still ~11M redundancy and unnecessary rebuilds for me during development
<pxc>
Infinisil: indulge me in the exercise of thinking how to organize this? for example with vim_customizable, because customized vims are just wrapper scripts around vim binaries, you can install tons of different customized vims without ever rebuilding vim
<Infinisil>
pxc: Oh, so you mean that Make or whatever builds fish can reuse all the parts that were built with other options?
<pxc>
Infinisil: yeah. I know that some kind of wrapper script trick will do it. I can think of one right now: give fish a fake python binary which reads an environment variable like __fish_python_runtime to find python and wraps it, then make fishWithPython a wrapper script that sets that variable or something
<Infinisil>
Hmm
<pxc>
Infinisil: but it seems like maybe some kind of multi-output trickery would be less hackish
<pxc>
but idk much about how multi-output works
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<Infinisil>
So you pretty much just don't want python as a propagatedBuildInput?
<Infinisil>
Hmm
<pxc>
this is I guess related to the groff question: I want to do multi-output for groff so that I can make perl a dep only of groff-perl or groff.perl or whatever
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<pxc>
and I want to be able to do the same thing with fish and python, except I don't think there will be any contents in the fish-python output
<pxc>
whereas the groff-base/groff-perl split actually involves putting certain files in groff-perl because they're the ones that depend on perl
<pxc>
the fish one might, too, I just don't know if there's a clean way to separate them yet because I'm still trying to configure out the right way to split packages like this
<Infinisil>
Have you tried just removing python from the fish package?
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<Infinisil>
Because it might not even change the store path
<pxc>
Infinisil: let's give it a shot :-)
<pxc>
Infinisil: nope, it definitely changed it. after the change, `nix-build -A fish` triggered a rebuild
<pxc>
not sure why these propagatedBuildInputs besides python need to be in propagatedBuildInputs, though, because fish's calls to them in the source code are patched in the fish package to point to the ones it is built with
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<pxc>
things which depend on fish don't need those things on the PATH then
<Infinisil>
Alright another idea: remove python and create another package which is basically is just buildEnv { name = "fish-with-python"; paths = [ fish ]; }
<Infinisil>
Wait
<pxc>
Infinisil: I like that one, I was thinking maybe something along those lines. Does one of the other paths need to be python?
<Infinisil>
buildEnv { name = "fish-with-python"; paths = [ fish ]; buildInputs = [ python ]; }
<Infinisil>
Which other paths?
<pxc>
oh, buildEnvs are derivations with buildInputs too huh? I thought they only had paths
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<Infinisil>
I'm not sure if that's exactly what you want, but at least it would reuse the present fish
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<pxc>
Infinisil: I think it's close to what I want. I've been using something similar in some other fish experiments. Idk why it wasn't my first thought to use it here
<Infinisil>
And you could add python to the fish executables PATH with makeWrapper
<Infinisil>
if it needs it, dunno
<pxc>
Infinisil: I think it just came to me! So fish uses python in exactly two files (except for completions). Those files can go in a separate output, an the rest in something which for the purposes of the discussion I'll call fish-core
<pxc>
and then the other two can be built into fish-python which takes python as a buildInput and patches te source files to point to that specific python binary
<pxc>
Infinisil: then the fish for end-users can be a buildEnv which includes fish-core and fish-python as paths
<pxc>
and it'll just merge the two together
<pxc>
then you can even change which python your fish depends on without rebuilding fish :-D
<pxc>
what do you think?
<Infinisil>
That could work :D
<pxc>
thanks so much for helping me think this through
<Infinisil>
No problem
<pxc>
is Infinisil your github username? I'll make a note to tag you in the PR so you can see how it comes out
<Infinisil>
Yup it is, nice
<pxc>
good. I made the note. that'll motivate me to finish this, too haha. I'm almost done for the day I think. Sick of typing away at the computer for now
<Infinisil>
Yeah, me too soon
<pxc>
clever: are you going to NixCon 2017?
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<clever>
pxc: not currently planning on it
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<Infinisil>
I'm usually very antisocial, partly because I don't have any common interests with people, that's why I'm very interested in NixCon
<Infinisil>
Also it's basically right next door, only about 4 hours with the train
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<slabity>
So I have "nixpkgs.config.firefox.enableAdobeFlash = true;" in my config, but I don't have flash installed in firefox. How do you install flash in nixos?
<slabity>
Nevermind, it appears to be working now.
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<>
changed the topic of #nixos to: Topic set by gchristensen!~gchristen@unaffiliated/grahamc on 2017-04-26 15:31:22 UTC
<>
changed the topic of #nixos to: Channel #nixos created on 2008-04-25 12:32:07 UTC
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<hyper_ch>
clever: ping
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<clever>
hyper_ch: pong
<hyper_ch>
clever: why you use lz4 compression? and do you make 3 "subpools" in the zfs pool?
<hyper_ch>
or how to understand the mountpoint=legacy /root, /home, /nix
<Mic92>
hyper_ch: you want legacy mountpoints, so you can let systemd mount the datasets. This is cleaner as they become mount targets and can be properly ordered.
<Mic92>
otherwise your ssd gets slow down by you usb hdd
<hyper_ch>
--add --write-mostly
<sphalerite>
hyper_ch: I use zfs but I definitely don't have a strong zfs-fu :D
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<Infinisil>
I'd say I know about 7/10 things about using zfs
<Infinisil>
Have spent a bit of time on it
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<hyper_ch>
:)
<hyper_ch>
so, gotta get going
<Infinisil>
See ya
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<raunov>
hey
<raunov>
a question: can disnix be used to manage configs of multiple nixos machines also or just for services on them?
<raunov>
my scenario: i have a server rack with 4 bays, each having nixos and would like to manage their config together
<dash>
raunov: i believe this is what nixops is for.
<raunov>
yes i know that nixops can manage configs also but doesn't it require to create the infra first ? or is there a way to create deployment from existing machines ?
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<ikwildrpepper>
raunov: you can use the 'none' backend (default) to manage any nixos machine that is accessible via ssh
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<ikwildrpepper>
raunov: nixops won't do anything related to provisioning then (or any automagical hardware config additions)
<ikwildrpepper>
just need to make sure you are able to ssh as root to the machines
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<raunov>
ah nice, that was exactly the hint i was looking for, thx ikwildrpepper
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<ikwildrpepper>
raunov: we do the same for part of the hydra.nixos.org infrastructure
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<clever>
hyper_ch: i use 3 filesystems, so /nix and /home can optionaly have different options
<clever>
hyper_ch: for example, i can turn snapshots off in /nix, but leave it on in / and /home
<clever>
hyper_ch: i didnt do that on some systems, and now there is a multi-month delay on any nix-collect-garbage
<clever>
hyper_ch: or i have to manualy delete the snapshots
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<tommyangelo[m]>
So I'm confused: I upgraded my system, and now /run/current-system/sw/bin/thunderbird points to /nix/store/4xqv2dxm9qa8vnfridc6fxynqqc41qj2-thunderbird-52.2.1/bin/thunderbird, but /nix/var/nix/profiles/default/bin/thunderbird points to /nix/store/mvm7f8wkl8lr8acfbzhn8aji1jxllpd6-thunderbird-45.5.1/bin/thunderbird How can I get rid of the old version?
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<clever>
telotortium: you installed it in both nix-env and systemPackages
<clever>
tommyangelo[m]: you need to uninstall the version in roots nix-env
<clever>
check nix-env -q and read the man page for the -e flag
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<tommyangelo[m]>
clever: thanks!
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<ikwildrpepper>
raunov: the *full* config you would use as /etc/nixos/configuration.nix
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<raunov>
okay, thx
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<ikwildrpepper>
so yes, including hardware config etc. nixops none backend makes you responsible for everything
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<ikwildrpepper>
it will assume your machine is reachable with the 'mymachine' name (in my example). you can use ssh config for that, or you can set an IP address with some option targetHost (see docs)
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<NickHu>
I'm getting this error when trying to build a nix derivation of a haskell package from a local directory:LICENSE: copyFile: does not exist (No such file or directory) - any ideas?
<NickHu>
Okay so it turns out that nix doesn't like symlinked license files
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] rcherrueau opened pull request #26896: haskell-packages: use older version of apply-refact with ghc-8.0.x (master...fix-apply-refact-w/-ghc802) https://git.io/vQZuE
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] layus opened pull request #26897: terminfo: symlink terminfo to /etc for ncurses (master...nixos-terminfo) https://git.io/vQZur
<goibhniu>
Isorkin: did you check if there were any relevant changes between these revisions?
<Isorkin>
not check
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<Isorkin>
goibhniu: found an error - incorrect revision indicated
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<lukego>
Sorry if this is a really basic question... Suppose I have derivations 'a' and 'b' that each create an output in $out/lib/mydir/. Then I have a derivation 'c' which inputs 'a' and 'b': Can 'c' see a 'mydir' directory containing the union of 'a' and 'b' outputs?
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<manveru>
is there some way to modify the stdenv.mkDerivation afterwards? i'd like to add an env var for nix-shell
<gchristensen>
manveru: will .overrideAttrs do that?
<manveru>
but if i call it, it's too late, and i can't call override on the function
<manveru>
hmm
<gchristensen>
wait, you want to override _all_ mkDerivations?
<manveru>
no, just one :)
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<manveru>
drv = stdenv.mkDerivation { name = "foo"; A = "hi"; }; drv.overrideAttrs { B = "there"; } >> error: attempt to call something which is not a function but a set,
<LnL>
foo.overrideAttrs (drv: { ... })
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<manveru>
ooh
<LnL>
:)
<manveru>
thanks a ton
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<cmacrae>
LnL: Yo! o/ What's the alternative of `nixos-rebuild switch --upgrade` for nix-darwin? :)
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<manveru>
cmacrae: darwin-rebuild switch
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<manveru>
we're now like... 3 people using it :D
<cmacrae>
manveru: note the '--upgrade' option
<manveru>
oh
<cmacrae>
:p
<manveru>
the channel update?
<manveru>
don't think there's an option yet
<cmacrae>
Ah, damn, okay
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<manveru>
it's in nix-channel --list, so you can just nix-channel --update first
<manveru>
tbh i don't use --upgrade even on nixos ^^;
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] qknight pushed 6 new commits to release-17.03: https://git.io/vQZPU
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/release-17.03 8c0620f Niklas Hambüchen: glusterfs: Remove no longer needed subsitutions of DESTDIR....
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/release-17.03 fef914c Niklas Hambüchen: glusterfs: Use github instead of download.gluster.org to obtain source....
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/release-17.03 c061e50 Niklas Hambüchen: glusterfs: Make commands that gluster calls work. Fixes #25620....
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<cmacrae>
Cool, yeah I'll just use that
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<qknight>
i've just cherry-picked a few glusterfs commits and pushed it into 'release-17.03'
<gchristensen>
manveru: I use it, it is excellent
<qknight>
could someone please review if i did everything correctly?
<qknight>
i've compiled that branch locally and it works btw
<pie_>
the little dialog that i presume would come up in firefox for the gamepad doesnt come up, and even if theres no dialog, nothing happens if i press stuff on the gamepad
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<kuznero>
I can see that `nix-env -f "<nixpkgs>" -qaP -A haskellPackages | grep ghc-syb` gives another version now: 0.2.3.2. How can I make `ghc-mod` use that new one in my shell.nix file?
<manveru>
should be the hash from nix-prefetch-url right?
<FRidh>
is the nix daemon running unstable as well?
<FRidh>
read carefully, it says you have to use --unpack ;)
<manveru>
oh :)
<manveru>
all i see is xml man :P
<FRidh>
still need to have a section in the Nixpkgs manual with all the different fetchers
<FRidh>
haha
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<manveru>
that sure is slow
<FRidh>
slow?
<manveru>
yeah took like 3 minutes
<manveru>
but it works!
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<manveru>
is there some way to make this work with both nix versions?
<manveru>
maybe with builtins.nixVersion parsing
<joehh>
so then, what is the meaning of <nixpkgs>? Is it the "version" of nixpkgs coming from whereever then channels you are subscribed to at the time?
<symphorien>
it means the value of the key nixpkgs in NIX_PATH
<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] ivan-tkatchev opened pull request #26903: boost-build: update to version 2016.03 (master...pullrequest4) https://git.io/vQZdO
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<pie_>
anyone know how to fix this? err:module:load_builtin_dll failed to load .so lib for builtin L"winebus.sys": libcap.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<pie_>
this is from wine
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<Guest473925>
Is xinitrc supported in nix?
<pie_>
Fuuzetsu, ping? nixpkgs says you are the maintainer for xboxdrv, maybe you can help me with some gamepad problems?
<srhb>
Is there something like pythonWithPackages (like ghcWithPackages)?
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] Ma27 opened pull request #26904: geogebra: make `language` configurable (master...geogebra/make-language-configurable) https://git.io/vQZxZ
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<srk>
hm, I'm trying to use nixops with "none" backend and I can't get past waiting for SSH... altough nixops ssh <machine> works
<srk>
tried disabling socket activation and still nothing
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<the-kenny>
srk: It likely tries to use a ssh key with a passphrase (via ssh-agent). Iirc that isn't supported and you need to use a key without a passphrase.
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<srk>
how do I tell nixops to use my new key?
<srk>
ah, deployment.keyPair
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<srk>
the-kenny: Infinisil, not really. it generates key pair as the first step, I guess I first need to deploy keys generated by nixops for it to work correctly
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] zagy opened pull request #26906: doc / go building: improve (master...fix/doc-gobuild-dependency-note) https://git.io/vQnJH
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<manveru>
i'm having a strange problem with nix-copy-closure... it exits with "error: unexpected end-of-file"
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<manveru>
any idea how to debug this?
<manveru>
tried stracing it... but it's not clear what it's trying to do
<LnL>
I think that happens if part of the closure doesn't exist on the source
<qknight>
manveru: are you using nix-copy-closure directly?
<manveru>
yeah
<manveru>
i'm using --use-substitutes for that case...
<qknight>
manveru: then my command does not help, try:
<qknight>
manveru: strace -f -e open yourcommand
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<GlennS>
I'm trying to use Nix to package a Maven project. I've found mvn2nix, and used it to generate a project-info.json. I've also found build-maven.nix https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/blob/master/pkgs/build-support/build-maven.nix, but it's not clear how I actually get access to this function. Do I need to import it, or is there some sort of attribute path leading to it, or something else?
<manveru>
hm
<qknight>
GlennS: you don't understand how to use the generated nix file, right?
<GlennS>
Generated nix file? I don't have a generated nix file.
<GlennS>
I don't understand how to get access to the function to call it.
<manveru>
maybe the ld.so.cache?
<qknight>
manveru: interestinly i had the same error message with nixops on mac os x
<qknight>
manveru: also doing nix-copy-closure
<LnL>
I think you want to strace the process on the other machine
<manveru>
this is actually from a nix docker container based on LnLs one
<manveru>
i upgrade nix there to unstable... which might've caused that
<manveru>
made sure both sides use the exact same nix version and nixpkgs... yet it fails this way
<manveru>
and since this seems to be C++ my debugging skills are nonexistent
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<GlennS>
I suppose what I'm trying to find out is, given a file in the Nixpkgs repository, is there a way to figure out what it's attribute path will be
<manveru>
even --dry-run fails :P
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<manveru>
ah, maybe the import/export helps
<manveru>
that says some drv is invalid
<manveru>
"error: path ‘/nix/store/0n7kbnl9v1v6jhkj1qhzp8fjqrhl17wf-gnugrep-3.0.drv’ is not valid"
<manveru>
whatever that means
<manveru>
tried to nix-store --verify --repair --check-contents but that didn't help either
<hodapp>
so, looking at OpenCV... if I enable Tesseract in this build, then enableContrib must be true. What's the normal way to force this? Replace "enableContrib ? false" with "enableContrib ? enableTesseract"?
<hlavaty>
hi hostname -f doesn't give me the domain, how can i fix it? the domain is in /etc/resolv.conf correct
<hodapp>
or just tell the user that enableTesseract does nothing if enableContrib is false?
<hlavaty>
domainname works, but hostname -f doesnt
<manveru>
hlavaty: you use nettools or inetutils?
<hlavaty>
manveru: i thought it should work without doing anything extra
<hlavaty>
i can use HOST="$(hostname).$(domainname)" but HOST=$(hostname -f) would be nicer
<manveru>
well, it depends on which package you installed for the hostname command
<manveru>
or if it's just busybox
* hodapp
solemnly walks over to the "It's been __ days since hodapp rebuilt OpenCV" sign and flips the number to 0.
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<Ankhers>
Is it possible to associate a message with a failed assertion?
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<Infinisil>
Umm, what's the default password for virtualbox nixops thing? I did the thing in the nixops introduction with a webserver, but there is no mention on how to log in
<Ankhers>
Infinisil: And that works with `assert`?
<Infinisil>
Ankhers: Ah you mean assert, hmm
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<Ankhers>
I just think it would be nice to say why the assertion failed, instead of just saying that it failed and to point to the code to make the user figure out why it failed.
<LnL>
use builtins.throw then
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<Infinisil>
Yeah, something like if (condition) then <the thing> else throw "message"
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<manveru>
damn i'm pretty stuck now :(
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<Ankhers>
That would make it kinda ugly. if (condifition) then <a big derivation> else throw "..."
<Ankhers>
I was hoping to not have to wrap the entire derivation for this.
<goibhniu1>
it's a nice idea to have a guide like that, but I suspect it would be pretty obvious stuff
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<goibhniu>
don't hardcode FHS paths in your build scripts etc.
<Infinisil>
Yeah, point 3 of chapter 2 has some good packages to have a look at on how its done
<goibhniu>
"don't download dependencies in your build script" would be another one
<goibhniu>
safinaskar: why do you ask?
<safinaskar>
i just creating upstream package not related to any distro. i just want it to be easily ported to many distros. where should i look for config files for my program, say, "foo"? $PREFIX/etc , right? i tried to ask in debian channels, they said they don't care about packages with non-/usr prefixes. so, i decided to go here, to nixos chanell, because i know you don't use /usr prefix
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<goibhniu>
wonderful!
* goibhniu
doesn't have a helpful answer though
<Infinisil>
safinaskar: I think first preference should be ~/.config/<name>/config and you can provide a default one in $out/etc/<name>/config
<Infinisil>
As a convention
<dash>
safinaskar: what does your program do
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<7GHABAO0J>
[nixpkgs] LnL7 closed pull request #26772: v8_3_16_14: fix OS X build by passing deployment version (master...fix-v8) https://git.io/vQtMI
<safinaskar>
so, nix packages store their configs inside nix-store, right?
<disasm>
Ankhers: haha, I think it comes down to defining "go nix". I installed nix on my desktop in the office a couple years ago, but went back and forth over and over again. It wasn't until I took the time to learn nix and how to write packages that it clicked and I can't envision a computer no longer running nixos :)
<safinaskar>
Infinisil: :)
<safinaskar>
Infinisil: can i install nix package manager to windows?
<Infinisil>
safinaskar: Not necessarily, just optionally a default one. packages should always prefer configs in the user path (~/.config/<name>/config)
<disasm>
which taking the jump and putting it on my laptop as my daily driver really fueled the learning and adoption :) Now all my new stuff in the cloud is nix as well (nixops).
<Ankhers>
disasm: I'm currently in the middle of that process. I have been tinkering with Nix for a couple years. I have finally found an area of nixpkgs that I can help with (BEAM / erlang). My knowledge has skyrocketed in the last couple weeks because of it.
<Infinisil>
You can't modify the nix store, that's why it doesn't make sense to use it as a packages config, as it would never change
<Infinisil>
Ankhers: I too have really been getting into nix the past few weeks
<safinaskar>
(value_ptr doesn't have configs. but some my future programs probably will, so i'm asking :))
<Ankhers>
I'm also somewhat in the process of looking for a new laptop. I was planning on installing NixOS on it.
<Ankhers>
I was sold on Nix a couple years ago after hearing about it from the Haskell ecosystem. So many companies I have worked at had outdated information on how to properly setup a machine for working with their product(s).
<safinaskar>
Infinisil: ??? is user (i. e. end user, not program itself) allowed to modify config stored in nix-store? if no, then where system wide configs modifiable by root user are stored in nixos?!
<disasm>
Ankhers: yeah? I keep thinking about getting one of these and putting nixos on it: https://puri.sm/shop/librem-13/ Currently, just have it on my work laptop (macbook pro)
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<Infinisil>
disasm: Hasn't windows support been abandonned a while ago? That document is from 2015
<Ankhers>
disasm: dual booted, or did you overwrite the main partition?
<disasm>
safinaskar: the nixbld users can write to /nix but they only write new packages, or garbage collect unused ones. They never *modify* the store. The store is immutable.
<safinaskar>
disasm: haha, i have librem purism laptop
<safinaskar>
disasm: if you have questions about it, ask
<disasm>
safinaskar: you like it? Less than having questions about it, and more of not wanting to spend money. When this laptop gets life cycled out in 3 years or so, I'd like to replace it with one of those.
<Ankhers>
safinaskar: How is the track pad?
<safinaskar>
disasm: okey, so where system wide modifiable config for some package is stored?
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<safinaskar>
disasm: well, generaly it is ok
<safinaskar>
disasm: i waited VERY LONG for it
<safinaskar>
disasm: about 1.5 years
<disasm>
safinaskar: for most packages, it doesn't exist. Your configs are defined in your nix expressions, and the service is hard-coded to launch that config.
<Infinisil>
safinaskar: The package itself must be usable without nixos, and nixos is the thing that provides the whole configuration business. You can additionally to your package add a nixos module where you can write a file to the nix store from a nix expression (the config), this file would then be in the directory the package expects or something like that
<disasm>
safinaskar: there are some exceptions though, like NetworkManager has some state in /etc
<safinaskar>
disasm: but there was somewhen near 2015, i think librem laptop was not manufactored yet
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<safinaskar>
disasm: i asked for russian keybord, but purism sent my english instead
<safinaskar>
disasm: also, i asked for cd bay, and i didn't get it
<safinaskar>
disasm: they paid me compensation for this, something about $50
<Infinisil>
I was just thinking of this today, I think packages should provide a function to write config files from nix expressions, so that also non-nixos users can use it
<safinaskar>
disasm: so, it seems only english keyboard is supported
<Infinisil>
All the stuff in nixos/modules/programs could be moved to the packages themselves
<safinaskar>
disasm: libram has mac-like touchpad without hardware buttons
<safinaskar>
disasm: it is not comfortable in my opinion
<safinaskar>
disasm: i often ocassionally close wrong windows etc
<safinaskar>
disasm: also, it seems hibernation doesn't work on my debian stretch
<safinaskar>
disasm: despite this is laptop designed for linux
<safinaskar>
disasm: laptop is fragile. if i slightly hit it, it will reboot
<disasm>
oh wow, thats no good
<disasm>
weak solder joint maybe?
<Infinisil>
Lol
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vQn8H
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master 725d25d Christian Zagrodnick: doc / go building: improve...
<srk>
so I've managed to patch nixops with https://github.com/NixOS/nixops/pull/486/files and it works (ipv6 seems to be the culprit) but only once as build result contains empty sshd_config
<safinaskar>
Ankhers: you mean touchpad? if yes, i already said about it
<simpson>
srk: Does ssh.run_command() perhaps affect the SSH config somehow? I don't know offhand what would do that. Thank you for testing; you are brave.
<Ankhers>
safinaskar: Yes. Thanks.
<srk>
simpson: seems like that resulting closure uploaded to machine contains empty file, wc /nix/store/ik4aakj94ad14wda2bj7qqzffv5j72ah-sshd_config
<cstrahan>
Has anyone used the zoom-us application? Trying to get it to work...
<srk>
simpson: heh, somehow now it fixed itself, when I've added allowSFTP = false to force yet another rebuild, with --show-trace I was able to verify that sshd_config is correct on both builder and target. weird
<simpson>
srk: Bizarre.
<srk>
and I've tried the same thing before with startWhenNeeded :D
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vQn0f
<Infinisil>
What does #nixos think of using Markdown for nixpkgs documentation instead of xml?
<knedlsepp>
Hey! I’m currently trying out nixos on EC2. I’m trying to increase the size of the root filesystem, but I’m stuck with my initial size. It seems there is some kind of `autoResize` option which should be active, but a reboot did not help.
<knedlsepp>
Does anybody have some experience with that?
<mdash>
Infinisil: why would that be good
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<bennofs>
Infinisil: some docs is actually md
<simpson>
Infinisil: Get a better text editor?
<bennofs>
Infinisil: for example, the part for python
<bennofs>
Infinisil: i think RST would be better
<Infinisil>
mdash: markdown can be read well on github, is much easier to write and widely known. I feel like using xml for docs is a major factor for nixpkgs having kinda bad docs
<bennofs>
Infinisil: i believe nixpkgs has the ability to use different markup langs for different chapters
<bennofs>
oh, at least the language-frameworks part
<bennofs>
hmm, introduction.md is markdown as well
<Infinisil>
bennofs: It already uses pandoc for conversion, would be pretty easy to use markdown instead
<mdash>
Maybe so but also consider: markdown is terrible
<Infinisil>
mdash: Why do you think so?
<bennofs>
Infinisil: well as I said, it actually does already. if you want, you can add a chapter to the manual and use markdown for it
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<bennofs>
so you don't need to write XML
<simpson>
Infinisil: It can only output to HTML.
<Infinisil>
bennofs: I'm more thinking of converting all docs to markdown
<bennofs>
Infinisil: markdown has less meta info than XML though
<simpson>
Infinisil: Every Markdown package which can output non-HTML does so at the expense of anything resembling standard Markdown.
<Infinisil>
simpson: Pandoc outputs to pretty much everything you can think of
<simpson>
Infinisil: Consider: Markdown says that embedded HTML is legal. Pandoc can output non-HTML. There is probably a little bit of magic guessing inside pandoc!
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] joachifm pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vQnir
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master d847b5c Maarten Hoogendoorn: mysql module: add option to bind to an address
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master 8791cad Joachim F: Merge pull request #26598 from moretea/mysql-add-bind-option...
<Infinisil>
bennofs: The having less metadata is a point though, but looking through the docs it appears to almost never use metadata
<bennofs>
Infinisil: there appears to be at least <filename> and <varname> though
<bennofs>
RST may be a better format
<bennofs>
Infinisil: but what's so bad about XML? Doesn't look too bad to me
<gchristensen>
the doc format is a regular discussion and every time the reminder that if you write docs in any format, someone will convert it to docbook for you.
<gchristensen>
there you go! even easier! don't even need to make a PR, just toss 'em in to an issue
<simpson>
Infinisil: "The raw HTML is passed through unchanged in HTML, S5, Slidy, Slideous, DZSlides, EPUB, Markdown, Emacs Org mode, and Textile output, and suppressed in other formats."
<simpson>
Infinisil: Pandoc documents that it will *throw away documentation* from Markdown documents, and I'm not willing to take bets on whether it does so silently.
<Infinisil>
simpson: What do you mean by "throw away"?
<simpson>
Infinisil: What do you think "suppressed" means?
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<sphalerite>
Oh boy, this discussion again
<gchristensen>
the greater point is the primary benefit of switching is "more people will write docs" and the ugly truth is IIRC I've only seen someone take advantage once or twice of the offer for someone else to make it in to docbook
<Infinisil>
simpson: "The raw HTML is passed through unchanged in HTML, S5, Slidy, Slideous, DZSlides, EPUB, Markdown, Emacs Org mode, and Textile output, and suppressed in other formats."
<simpson>
Infinisil: And this has been part of the Markdown philosophy ever since the beginning. https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/syntax#html "Markdown’s syntax is intended for one purpose: to be used as a format for writing for the web."
<Infinisil>
What do you expect? Some formats just aren't able to represent that data
<simpson>
Infinisil: Yes. This means that raw inline HTML will show up on HTML versions of the manual but not PDFs.
<simpson>
Infinisil: I expect that if I write docs, that I do not have magic disappearing sections of docs!
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<Infinisil>
simpson: Can you show me an example of the docs that's not possible in markdown and thus would need raw html?
<mdash>
Infinisil: anyway you can write docs in markdown
<gchristensen>
Infinisil: why does it matter?
<simpson>
Infinisil: Pandoc's manual has several examples in neighboring sections where it blatantly advises folks to write raw HTML.
<sphalerite>
We should move *all* the docs to doxygen
<gchristensen>
theory: we'd have better docs if it wasn't docbook. experiment: write docs in anything & someone else will convert it to docbook. result: nobody took advantage of it.
<Infinisil>
I just think xml is a limiting factor for good documentation, which nixpkgs needs
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<simpson>
Infinisil: I don't know how to get it across better; Markdown is *not* the format for writing technical manuals. It's a format for sugaring up HTML to the point where people can Just Write and they'll get HTML.
<Infinisil>
gchristensen: What's docbooks?
<bennofs>
Have you looked at ReStructuredText?
<simpson>
Infinisil: Get a better text editor. Most popular text editors have XML/HTML/SGML/etc. "tag" modes or "tag" commands.
<bennofs>
Infinisil: name of the xml syntax
<gchristensen>
Infinisil: our docs are written in Docbook
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<gchristensen>
which is a semantic markup language for technical documentation
<Infinisil>
Oh it's a xml dtd
<gchristensen>
IMO PHP's docs are the best in the land, and theirs are written in docbook. docbook is not the limiting factor here
<bennofs>
Infinisil: why do you dislike XML again? The only point I can understand so far is that Github doesn't pretty-print it
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<sphalerite>
Re the semantic information included by docbook; are there any tools that actually make use of this?
<gchristensen>
yeah
<gchristensen>
it can be very friendly to accessibility as well
<Infinisil>
bennofs: It's hard to write, and most people don't know how to manipulate xml efficiently, also code needs escaping for <>, applies to all strings in nix expressions too
<gchristensen>
Infinisil: so don't write it in docbook
<berce>
I 'm trying to write a nix expression for libacr38u. Based on hello/default.nix and "Quick Start to Adding a Package". The makefile contains "usbdropdir = /var/lib/pcsc/drivers", no "/nix/store/..." is added. What is the best way to modify that line?
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<Infinisil>
Well I guess I'm in the minority with this opinion in this room
<gchristensen>
you're not, it is just a tired argument and our experiment to see if it was worthwhile hasn't panned out
<Infinisil>
On last question: simpson: Why is Markdown not for technical manuals? What's the special requirement for technical documents that differentiates them from "normal" docs?
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: particularly for reference manuals, there's typically a lot of consistent structure that is helpful to mark up semantically
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: any examples?
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<gchristensen>
sphalerite: of cases docbook is better?
<simpson>
Infinisil: Markdown wasn't meant for docs; it was meant for *any* writing that was destined to be HTML.
<mdash>
Infinisil: is your only concern the GitHub preview?
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: of tools that make nice use of the semantic markup
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<gchristensen>
well like glossaries are cool and having good "Example n.n"s and the accessibility features that come with being able to determine something is a screen output vs. something you type vs. ...
<Infinisil>
gchristensen: simpson mdash: I'm pretty sure it wouldn't take much to adapt the docs (in markdown) to also export to pdf
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<disasm>
I'm with simpson and dash, markdown is great for quick README's, etc... But for actual documentation, it just doesn't have the structure. And sure, you could hack that structure in, for example, treat every # as a chapter and ## as a section, but you can't have any metadata on those sections.
<gchristensen>
Infinisil: there is zero upside as far as I can tell
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] vbgl pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vQnMg
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master b475d5f Vincent Laporte: ocamlPackages.atd: 1.1.2 -> 1.12.0
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<gchristensen>
Infinisil: if you will write docs only if it is in markdown, as I've said: write it in markdown
<simpson>
Infinisil: "Talk is cheap; show me the code."
<gchristensen>
the offer goes out far and wide to anyone who wants to write a sentence of docs, to a whole series of books: write it however you want, someone else will convert it to docbook
<Infinisil>
Funny quote from https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/1960: @edolstra: "We do already have a place where people can easily contribute, namely the wiki. Good Wiki articles should probably be added to the manual eventually"
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<gchristensen>
yeah, that was 2 years before the wiki was shut down
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] joachifm pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vQnD8
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master 8dda321 Joachim F: Merge pull request #26724 from schneefux/pkg.shaarli...
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<Infinisil>
I'm reading through that issue now, and if I'm motivated enough I'll try to write on a persisting bidirectional docbook <-> pandoc markdown thing
<Infinisil>
To see what problems I get
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: that doesn't seem feasible. Docbook -> markdown will destroy information.
<gchristensen>
to quote the captain, make it so
<dash>
Infinisil: why do it at all?
<dash>
Infinisil: why not just write some docs?
<sphalerite>
^
<Infinisil>
heh
<sphalerite>
because writing software is more fun than writing docs
<Infinisil>
^
<sphalerite>
I think that's much more of a problem than docbook :)
<dash>
Infinisil: write a game instead ;)
<gchristensen>
I guess then nobody will write docs in markdown either
<Infinisil>
I used to code some stuff with Metal on iPhone and macOS
<Infinisil>
gchristensen: At least you admit that docs are sparse
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<Mateon1>
So much for ABI compatibility. My journalctl is filled with "xsession[2576]: kioslave: ####### CRASH ######" "Cannot mix incompatible Qt library (version 0x50701) with this library (version 0x50800)", and I am unable to use the Dolphin file manager
<gchristensen>
Infinisil: yeah of course they are, we all do, that isn't the problem
<Infinisil>
Maybe a combination of markdown + a doc string tool for expressions + <???> will get more people to document
<Infinisil>
Or maybe something
<Infinisil>
else
<gchristensen>
no
<Infinisil>
Alright but come on, docstrings are needed
<dash>
Infinisil: maybe documents will arrive via meteor from an alien civilization
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: no, for the same reason that you're trying to work something like that out rather than just writing documentation
<joachifm>
you could pay someone to write docs
<gchristensen>
!m sphalerite
<[0__0]>
You're doing good work, sphalerite!
<sphalerite>
Not really, I could be writing docs instead of arguing about it :/
<gchristensen>
I meant to say sphalerite++ :P
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<sphalerite>
Fun statistic: out of almost 110000 commits in nixpkgs, only 1179 (1%) affect docs/ or nixos/docs
<Infinisil>
Yeah yeah, but programming is about finding current problems and trying to fix it, make it more confortable to write, more automatic. Somebody once had to setup docstring because writing it like <how it was written before> got too tiresome
<simpson>
Infinisil: No amount of writing code can replace writing docs.
<sphalerite>
^
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<simpson>
...I say this as somebody with a half-done RPi doc branch that I'll probably never finish. :c
<catern>
hey #nixos
<catern>
so
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: you probably don't even need to write any code. Nix has C-style comments so you could probably just use doxygen on it directly
<catern>
say I have several repositories, and I would like to hack on both simultaneously
<catern>
compiling them against each other
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: I'm sure an experiment in that direction with some included docs would be welcome ;)
<catern>
and pulling all their other dependencies from the Nix store
<catern>
is there a way to do this in Nix?
<sphalerite>
catern: how do these repositories relate to each other?
<catern>
certainly I can "nix-shell" and get a dev environment for a *single* package
<catern>
but not for multiple packages?
<catern>
sphalerite: I suppose one of them depends on the other
<Infinisil>
Okay, but an example: I changed mkDerivation, where do I go for the docs? How can I effectively find which exact doc file for attribute X? There is in theory a 1-1 correspondance
<srhb>
(It does not give you a nix shell for both, but it brings in "the other" project as a dependency)
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: rg/ag/ack/grep/whatever you like to use
<catern>
srhb: hmm so I'd need one shell per project?
<catern>
hmmmmmmMMmmMMM
<sphalerite>
srhb: it depends quite heavily on how you want to use it.
<srhb>
Sure.
<sphalerite>
and the languages
<srhb>
Somewhat.
<catern>
I mean, I don't actually *want* a single shell for everything, I just want to be able to build package X against the version of Y I am currently hacking on
<catern>
and I guess... I really want incremental builds too?
<sphalerite>
sorry, meant to highlight catern not srhb
<srhb>
:)
<catern>
yeah, I picked it up :)
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<sphalerite>
catern: then I'd probably leave nix out of composing X and Y and only have it take care of Y's dependencies and the dpendencies of X that you're not actively working on
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] vbgl pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vQnS4
<sphalerite>
so have some expression that will build X that takes Y, and just override Y to null for your development and tell your build systme where your in-dev version of Y lives
<catern>
hmmm
<catern>
yeah
<catern>
that works for me, although I wish for a more generic solution
<sphalerite>
How is that not generic? :/
<catern>
I guess a more generic solution requires using Nix as a low-level build manager?
<catern>
sphalerite: "tell your build systme"
<catern>
it's language-specific
<sphalerite>
I suppose. Yes, I think using nix as a build system would be the solution to that. But I'm not sure even that would work with say python
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<catern>
hmm
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<catern>
I mean, I'm wondering what way Nix could be taught about all the build systems, so that this could work automatically
<catern>
and generically
<catern>
(inasmuch as that is possible, anyway)
<sphalerite>
Nix generator for cmake xD
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<catern>
ugh
<catern>
this whole RFC process is gross
<catern>
(sorry complete change of topic)
<catern>
why can't we just discuss things on the mailing list?
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<disasm>
sphalerite: doxygen docs + 1 :)
<disasm>
catern: cause e-mail is hard? :)
<sphalerite>
^ see the ongoing discussion on submitting patches by email x)
<sphalerite>
Also, I realised while writing that email that "Web 2.0" has fallen out of use
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] shlevy pushed 1 new commit to release-17.03: https://git.io/vQnH6
<disasm>
I have no problem with patches on the mailing list... I was kinda taken aback by the person that said thanks for your patch, but can you PR it on github instead.
<sphalerite>
same
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] shlevy pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vQnH1
<Infinisil>
Alright my little idea regarding doc(strings): In short, how about a doc shell, which lets you interactively edit documentation of every expression in (top level) nixpkgs
<bennofs>
does noone care about unicode in stdenv?
<bennofs>
Infinisil: that sounds... harder than just adding a docstring right where the thing is defined
<Infinisil>
bennofs: A complaint I heard in the GH issue is that docstrings would clutter the expressions too much
<catern>
bennofs: that seems like a tricky question, it could have subtle effects... can you make a branch of nixpkgs and see if everything builds on hydra with the change? (I don't know if that's possible)
<sphalerite>
bennofs: personally I agree that it would be useful but feel like I lack the knowledge to provide any useful input beyond a "+1"
<catern>
(it's awesome that nix allows such huge changes to be trivially tested)
<bennofs>
sphalerite, catern: well, lack of knowledge was exactly why I posted on the ML. I thought perhaps someone considered this when making the current stdenv
<Infinisil>
Docs could be hosted in a separate repository, where the doc shell edits a nix expression to reflect the entered commands
<berce>
The answer to my earlier question seems to be: preBuild = '' \ makeFlagsArray=(usbdropdir="$out/var/lib/pcsc/drivers"); \ '';
<bennofs>
Infinisil: i don't think docs would clutter expressions too much, tbh.
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<Infinisil>
bennofs: I feel like if we truly wanted good and extensive documentation, it totally would. the doc shell could allow you to add not only basic docs, but also examples, links to configurations which use it
<pie_>
anyone know why a gamepad may work at the os level but not in firefox?
<Infinisil>
Also, it would be possible to check if the expression changed and automatically mark documentation potentially outdated. Just an idea
<Infinisil>
Another idea that would be possible with separate docs: Instead of having to write in a single doc format, the writer could select the preferred format
<sphalerite>
pie_: yeah, doesn't work for me either. Does in chromium.
<sphalerite>
Infinisil: that's already the case. Someone else will translate it to docbook for you.
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<sphalerite>
Infinisil: again, writing docs is more useful than writing about docs
<Infinisil>
sphalerite: I'll remember that ;)
<Infinisil>
But I'd be interested to hear what other people think of this idea
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<pie_>
sphalerite, maybe firefox compiled wrong or permissions issue? i dont think itd be a perms issue though because the other apps do just fine
<manveru>
so... after starting from the base image from LnL again, nix-copy-closure finally works... god knows what went on but i think i messed up my image somehow with impure base
<pie_>
sphalerite, problem is i havent the faintest clue how to debug this
<Infinisil>
I'm still fairly young to nix, my C++ knowledge is minimal and I currently should be studying for exams, but if I ever get some time and motivation I might work on this idea, would complement the new nix command proposal nicely
<sphalerite>
pie_: I'm about to try with firefox-bin. Failing that I'm asking on #firefox@irc.mozilla.org :)
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<LnL>
manveru: strange, did you build your own baseimage?
<manveru>
LnL: yeah, was using a really old fork of your repo that i used in the past
<manveru>
but i like the new structure much better, awesome job as usual man :D
<pie_>
sphalerite, i didnt really get any answers, maybe youll have better luck :*
<pie_>
* :(
<sphalerite>
pie_: oh
<sphalerite>
did you try firefox-bin too?
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<pie_>
no
<LnL>
oh like before I used the dockerTools?
<pie_>
whats that
<manveru>
now i just have to customize a bit and finally have a build host with unstable nix
<LnL>
nice :)
<manveru>
yeah, i think so
<manveru>
it was all dockerfiles
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<sphalerite>
pie_: a package based on mozilla's official firefox binaries
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<LnL>
part of it still is, that's why you need to build with nix-shell --run true
<manveru>
yeah, i know
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<pie_>
sphalerite, oh crap...im not at my friends house anymore so i dont have a gamepad to test with *facepalm*
<LnL>
but it's all generated by nix now so that's definitely better
<sphalerite>
pie_: don't worry, I'm going to test it just as soon as it's finished downloading ;)
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<manveru>
LnL: you got any idea how i can adjust the created timestamp in buildImage?
<pie_>
sphalerite, ok :)
<pie_>
\o/
<manveru>
tried setting it in the config attribute, but no luck
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<LnL>
manveru: have you tried to copy the tar out of the store and set the current timestamp on it
<pie_>
sphalerite, actually, can you also reproduce with chrome?
<pie_>
crosscode runs on node-webkit
<pie_>
it worked on my friends machine on windows
<pie_>
i was running it in wine
<sphalerite>
pie_: I don't want to run chrome, but chromium worked as I mentioned earlier
<manveru>
i didn't test that PR at all... just edited on github ^^;
<pie_>
ah.
<manveru>
but i'll try it now
<pie_>
the thing is wine control joystick.ctl or whatsitcalled shows it fine, it was just the game in which it wasnt working
<pie_>
(wine issue?)
<sphalerite>
pie_: although chromium missed some of the axes (accelerometer and touchpad, it's a PS4 controller) in my gamepad
<hodapp>
my draftsight support was merged \o/
<noobly>
no pdflatex package?
<noobly>
just trying to compile latex via vim
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<katyucha>
joachifm: I don't see Volth comment ... and he fork my PR and work on .. so it seems no need my help now ..
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] knedlsepp opened pull request #26912: nixos: Force check the filesystem before resizing (master...fix-autoResize) https://git.io/vQnNx
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] vbgl pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vQnA3
<simpson>
noobly: It's hard to say for sure. The most customized Gentoos I've seen were not lightweight, but they did things like bundle an entire Chromium.
<MP2E>
In theory? yes. In practice? would require more work than Gentoo. For instance, systemd is currently required in NixOS so you can't abstract over that
<MP2E>
I hope this situation changes one day, pull requests accepted :P
<clever>
MP2E: not-os replaces the entire init system with runit, but systemd.services obviously doesnt work
<sphalerite>
noobly: also re your earlier question. pdflatex is in of the texlive.combined.scheme-*
<noobly>
what is the absolute easiest way to get vim to compile latex documents?
<MP2E>
neat! i'll take a look :)
<clever>
so nearly every service under services.foo is non-functional
<sphalerite>
noobly: in most* of
<clever>
MP2E: so you need to manualy write runit units for any service you want
<clever>
default.nix also has a shortcut to it, so nix-build -A runner
<sphalerite>
noobly: depending on which packages you want to use. You can also create customised sets using texlive.combine but usually just using one of the predefined schemes is simpler and the space saved by rolling your own is fairly immaterial
<pie_>
sphalerite, apparently wine doesnt actually support xinput at this point, though i couldve sworn that it did
<noobly>
sphalerite: thank you. All I'm trying to do is compile latex via vim in the most painless manner possible, is this what you would recommend if you were super duper dumb?
<noobly>
and I'm talking pants on head kinda dumb
<sphalerite>
pie_: I have no idea about wine, but I do know that windows has multiple gamepad/controller APIs. Maybe wine only supports some of them
<sphalerite>
noobly: nix-env -iA nixos.texlive.combined.scheme-small, and in vim I'm not really sure — I myself would use neomake (in neovim) but I don't know much about using vim's stock functionality for that sort of stuff (beyond being able to call external commands with :! but then the output is horrible)
<sphalerite>
noobly: for that sort of noob I'd also recommend writing markdown and using pandoc to turn it into pretty PDFs via latex ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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<catern>
hmmm! okay I did a lot of thinking about my GC roots thing
<sphalerite>
noobly: or using lyx instead of vim :p
<catern>
I think the current support is sufficient as it is
<catern>
I was too focused on permanent roots
<catern>
but permanent roots are just an optimization
<catern>
temporary roots should be sufficient for all use cases
<pie_>
i didnt have a whole lot of trouble with lyx in my experience
<sphalerite>
pie_: on nixos specifically, I'm sure it's fine on debian and such
<pie_>
it was more having trouble with the stuff i was trying to do with latex in general :/
<pie_>
oh. i see.
<manveru>
LnL: that does sound neat
<manveru>
how do you know so much stuff man :P
<manveru>
maybe i should read the manpages top to bottom someday too...
<avn>
pie_: lyx was best expirience, when I want to be "silly" and want a paper ;)
<LnL>
you can do something similar for a git server so people can only push and not run random commands
<noobly>
Can someone explain to me like I'm an idiot where NixOS diverges from Gnu/Linux and/or UNIX?
<noobly>
in terms of philosophy mainly, as I can understand that :-)
<avn>
noobly: no FHS, at all
<avn>
only /bin/sh and /usr/bin/env in standard places (by posix/susv3)
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<noobly>
FHS?
<avn>
so completely different layout of filesystem
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<noobly>
Also, what kind of bad habits might I accumulate as a lazy Debian user? I hear people referencing nix-env being "frowned upon", but in my noob mind I've set nix-env -i = sudo apt-get install
<noobly>
avn: what does FHS stand for?
<avn>
fhs == filesystem hierarchy standard
<avn>
noobly: partually yes, `nix-env -i` is similiar
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<avn>
but install to user context, not system wide (and I personally suggest this way as ad-hoc)
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<sphalerite>
Anyone know any packages in nixpkgs that are nice and simple but have a few deps and maybe use cmake? Looking for a nice example to put in my talk :p
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] siddharthist opened pull request #26914: django-polymorphic: init at 1.2 (master...django-polymorphism) https://git.io/vQcUF
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<sphalerite>
noobly: You're free to do what you want. The problem with using nix-env to wantonly install packages is that it makes it harder to reproduce your environment, but that's no different from debian
<sphalerite>
noobly: you can still do it of course and still have the benefit of unprivileged package management! You're just losing out on some of the potential nix has
<sphalerite>
noobly: if you put all the software you use and its config together in a nix expression, you can copy that e.g. to a new computer and install it right away there
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<sphalerite>
noobly: that can be as simple as writing a nix file with the contents with import <nixpkgs> {}; { inherit (pkgs) vim tmux; tex = texlive.combined.scheme-small; } or as complex as https://github.com/lheckemann/dotfiles/blob/master/default.nix
<sphalerite>
noobly: either way you can install that with nix-env -ir -f default.nix (the -r flag removes everything else that's installed before installing it, and makes the resulting environment easier to reproduce)
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<bennofs>
Ugh, python wheel's metadata.json does not specify setup-requires? :/
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<noobly_>
So in attempting to install LaTeX, I searched the packages but didn't really find anything that directly corresponded to what I was looking for. I'm trying to set up latex compilation for vim so instead I installed vimplugin-vim-latex-live-preview-2016-03-16 and vimplugin-vim-latex-live-preview-2016-03-16, might that be sufficient for compiling latex via vim?
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<noobly_>
Also, no latexmk?
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<sphalerite>
noobly_: adding vim plugins is a bit more complex than just installing them unfortunately. Also unfortunately, the manual section on the topic seems to be pretty broken >_>
<sphalerite>
noobly_: latexmk is in nixos.texlive.latexmk
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<sphalerite>
noobly_: but the basic idea is: instead of vim, install vim.override {configure = {vam.pluginDictionaries = [{names = ["latex-live-preview" "vim-nix" "other-plugins-you-might-want"];}]}}
<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] cstrahan pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vQc34
<NixOS_GitHub>
nixpkgs/master 8e73afb Charles Strahan: zoom-us: don't add mesa to the LD_LIBRARY_PATH...
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<gchristensen>
Mic92: I got my test to pass!
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<noobly_>
sphalerite: ok, thanks.
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<NixOS_GitHub>
[nixpkgs] grahamc opened pull request #26917: nixos: installer.nix test: test ZFS install use case (master...zfs-installer-test) https://git.io/vQcWN