<gchristensen>
"The server must use legacy BIOS (not UEFI) boot. Do not create a UEFI system partition." "The disk uses MBR partitioning and has a separate boot partition, marked bootable in the partition table." bummer
<samueldr>
huh
<samueldr>
is it true or is it "support doesn't want to deal with bullshit"?
<gchristensen>
haha
<samueldr>
"let the customer deal with bullshit instead"
<samueldr>
"we can't be arsed to change the only way it always worked"
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<gchristensen>
well it is qemu probably so, maybe
<samueldr>
oh, if it's qemu then it's probably configured for seabios
<gchristensen>
I'm like 90% sure vultr is a thin wrapper around ceph and qemu
<gchristensen>
or libvirtd I guess :P
<samueldr>
ah, vultr, makes sense
<samueldr>
yeah, it's a real limitation by their design choice I assume
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<eyJhb>
Who killed all the staff?
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<V>
grumble, assuming no impersonation is going on
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<eyJhb>
Reading the link provided by julm , it just reads as a huge mess when you don't know what exactly is going on. Is freenode getting bought out?
<qyliss>
clever: which of those mentions a gag order?
<clever>
qyliss: from what ive read so far, "freenode limited" wasnt supposed to have any control over freenode (the irc network), until one day, the owner decided he did have control
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<hexa->
>> Given the millions I have injected into freenode thus far
<hexa->
lmao
<philipp>
Millions of lines of shitposts?
<V>
the millions which he's laundered through freenode, I assume he means
<V>
Can't really fault the guy, I don't think English is his first language
<philipp>
Wait, we arrived at money laundering now?
<qyliss>
philipp: what else do you do with millions in a company you own that doesn't do anything apart from own a domain name and run a conference once
<philipp>
You could also be wasting an inheritance. Sounds really shady though.
<qyliss>
what do you spend the money on, though?
<__monty__>
Convincing people you're legit?
<philipp>
Apparently hundreds of thousands of cash prizes for irc gamig.
<MichaelRaskin>
Hm, what country is Freenode Limited incorporated in?
<joepie91>
qyliss: philipp: the story gets more interesting when you realize that Andrew Lee employs Mark Karpeles, the slimy fuck who ran Mt. Gox, a Bitcoin exchange that got 'hacked' and 'lost its funds to the hacker'
<joepie91>
a story which was always shaky and people wondered where the money went
<philipp>
That is indeed very intereting
<sorear>
was he involved before or exclusively after MtG OX pivoted to bitcoin?
<joepie91>
Mark Karpeles ran the place during its time as a Bitcoin exchange
<joepie91>
Andrew Lee just appears to be someone who was part of the early adopter crowd around Bitcoin
<joepie91>
or so he's told me
<hodapp>
:|
<f0x>
joepie91: holy shit
<talyz>
whoa
<gchristensen>
rip, that is where my btc went
<eyJhb>
gchristensen: Did you actually loose any on the MTGox thing?
<gchristensen>
yeah
<eyJhb>
If so, how much?
<gchristensen>
all of them :)
<eyJhb>
Wondering in terms of 0.0001 BTC :D IF you are willing to state that
<eyJhb>
Just curious
<gchristensen>
oh I think it was between 3 and 20 btc
<f0x>
F
<eyJhb>
F
<eyJhb>
> DKK 4677356
<{^_^}>
"16207085313.560001 VND"
<eyJhb>
^ That's a lot of VND
<eyJhb>
#freenode is a shitshow atm. the network will be split..
<philipp>
And there will be at least fifteen different chat in the blockchain projects.
<eyJhb>
philipp: fifteen?! That's looow :D
<philipp>
Fifteen that last more than a week?
<ajs124>
let's all just switch to Chat Over IMAP
<qyliss>
delta.chat!
<MichaelRaskin>
DeltaChat!
<eyJhb>
Smoke signals anyone?
<philipp>
deltachat is really cool.
<ajs124>
If/When freenode goes down, I'll only communicate via morse code at 17.2 kHz
<ajs124>
Now, where to get the equipment and permission to use it…
<f0x>
still a 104 on libera.chat :(
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<dotlambda>
Yay, delta.chat!!
<MichaelRaskin>
Best case: sponsors pull support, support libera.chat, servers are not even rebooted.
<etu>
jess: :o
<f0x>
all the staffers re-cloaking..
<dotlambda>
I just packaged kdeltachat, so we don't have to use any electron bullshit
<f0x>
well, ex-staffers
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<eyJhb>
THere are so many staff that lurk in NixOS. I love it. Or.. ex-staff?
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<eyJhb>
Ehmm.. How close is "soon"?
<philipp>
Doesn't sound like they know.
<f0x>
#freenode_#nixos-chat:pixie.town will keep working :PP
<Synthetica>
(I was on irccloud where the free plan only allows one network at a time)
<hodapp>
ooh, looking
<hexa->
we even have a module for convos :D
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<Synthetica>
ooh
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<Synthetica>
I run it on docker on synology tho
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<etu>
libera.chat seems to be lagging now :o
<qyliss>
I got disconnected
<andi->
"lagging" as in defunct
<f0x>
> whois request timed out
<{^_^}>
undefined variable 'request' at (string):494:7
<f0x>
damn
* etu
is up to 330s lag
<etu>
Probably disconnected any moment now
<joepie91>
I dropped also
<eyJhb>
Not disconnected *so far*
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<f0x>
just dropped
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<gchristensen>
We've setup a nixos.org matrix server, and a new main channel at #nix:nixos.org -- registration on nixos.org isn't open, but it is open federation of course. Please join us there :)
<f0x>
:D
<__monty__>
Is this the new permanent home or may #nix* move to Libera.chat?
<f0x>
I guess they might get bridged
<siraben>
connection issues on libera?
<siraben>
hmm erc isn't getting through
<qyliss>
yep
<siraben>
hm what's the nickserv equivalent
<qyliss>
nickserv
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<siraben>
hmm trying again, either something's blocking my connection or it's not working
<Synthetica>
yup, sway is permanently moving (they have a bot that says "oi, move to libera")
<siraben>
Synthetica: I wonder who decided that, ugh
<siraben>
I should've checked the logs
<Synthetica>
I think emersion
<Synthetica>
no wait, he said drew runs it
<Synthetica>
so I guess drew?
<siraben>
yeah, looks like drew organized the move
<siraben>
hmm
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<FireFly>
libera uses the same services package (atheme) afaik, so services (nickserv, chanserv, memoserv) should be the same
<FireFly>
and a related but slightly more modern descendant ircd-wise
<FireFly>
so things ought to be quite similar/familiar on that front
<siraben>
Lol I have not been able to connect to libera in the last 10 mins
<hodapp>
it should be back up
<siraben>
oh huh it's back
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<ehmry>
I'd prefer to go to OFTC since the admins there seem capable of avoiding these problems
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<siraben>
well, cloaks aren't being given in #libera over there
<siraben>
OPs are overloaded
<siraben>
"As it is now known, the freenode IRC network has been taken over by a narcissistic Trumpian wannabe korean royalty bitcoins millionaire" o.O
<FireFly>
there's some minor differences in the syntax, I think for legacy/compat reasons (bit like ps having two styles)
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<FireFly>
also for whatever reason in some cases (I don't think I ever knew quite when) you can use one but not the other to view the list, dunno if that's changed though
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<hyperfekt>
i looked into the matrix state resolution protocol and it's a trip
<hyperfekt>
basically the original room creator can arbitrarily rewrite all history if i got it right
<hodapp>
whaaat
<f0x>
hyperfekt: no?
<f0x>
the other servers in the room would never agree
<cransom>
i suppose i now have to figure out why my main matrix server doesn't like to participate in federation
<philipp>
f0x: I guess new servers would take the history from the original creator? Don't see that as a particularly nasty downside though.
<hyperfekt>
f0x: they have to i think. since the original server can just create an event that's dated earlier and send that to the other servers
<f0x>
philipp: depends through which other server they join
<f0x>
hyperfekt: there's a signed DAG from the initial room creation event
<hyperfekt>
right. but what's stopping the server from producing two conflicting ones
<f0x>
hyperfekt: well another server that then joins the room would have to get sent only one
<f0x>
can't get switched out after
<hyperfekt>
why not
<f0x>
because it's already built it's own chain based on that first-received one
<hyperfekt>
and? that's invalidated, too
<f0x>
the second server wouldn't accept that incoming backdated event
<hyperfekt>
if servers would listen to the one they receive first there would be no certain way to achieve consensus about room state throughout the network.
<hyperfekt>
you have two choices basically if you don't want to have to solve the double spend problem: no consensus, or no limit to rewriting history
<hyperfekt>
f0x: it has to accept it according to the state resolution rules. if it didn't accept backdated events the network would fork
<hyperfekt>
since another server could very well have learned of the other DAG first
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<f0x>
hm you're probably better off asking this in #matrix then, I don't know all the details
<hyperfekt>
i'm not really asking ^^
<hyperfekt>
i'm stating :b
<f0x>
"stating it in #matrix" then lol
<hyperfekt>
well it shouldn't be news to people in #matrix
<hyperfekt>
like this isn't a vulnerability it's just how the thing is meant to work
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<f0x>
it still sounds a bit odd to me :)
<hyperfekt>
i guess that also explains why room IDs include the server domain they're created on
<hyperfekt>
because that one ultimately controls them
<f0x>
that's a namespacing thing
<hyperfekt>
well not just
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<hyperfekt>
i mean that's how it's put. but if one wanted to one could just have used guids. there isn't really any need to namespace a random id
<hyperfekt>
but this way the resolution knows which server to trust for the room creation event
<f0x>
"The domain is used only for namespacing to avoid the risk of clashes of identifiers between different homeservers. There is no implication that the room or event in question is still available at the corresponding homeserver."
<waleee-cl>
Is there a way to emulate the matrix<->irc-bridge's usage of image urls in elements? Turning previews off didn't have that effect
<f0x>
joepie91: has a better understanding of the state res I think
<hyperfekt>
f0x: i read the spec. they're trying to say that a server doesn't host a room. this doesn't mean that it doesn't control it
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<joepie91>
actually hostnames are planned to be removed from room IDs
<joepie91>
and the spec disallows using it for anything
<hyperfekt>
then what happens if two rooms have the same id?
<hyperfekt>
do servers just trust the one that says it created it earlier?
<hyperfekt>
or is there no consensus for room creation events and a server holds on to the one it jears about first?
<hyperfekt>
*hears
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<f0x>
that sounds correct
<gchristensen>
a given room can have many names
<hyperfekt>
a given room has one name and a number of aliases
<gchristensen>
sounds like you know more than I do
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<hyperfekt>
hmm, a directory server (which hosts the aliases) also suggests servers to retrieve the state from
<hyperfekt>
apparently the only way to hear about a room creation is trying to join it, which means that it isn't a problem if there isn't any consensus about room creation events
<hyperfekt>
just don't expect the same room id to always refer to the same room, because any malicious directory servers can well have forked with matrix network with respect to that room
<samueldr>
>> until the initial rush of new users has died down
<samueldr>
?
<elvishjerricco>
I'm assuming matrix is getting flooded with freenode users jumping ship
<elvishjerricco>
A) Crowding channels with discussions about matrix itself, and B) Putting a heavy load on the server (causing connectivity issues)
<f0x>
eh probably just matrix.org
<samueldr>
right, I was wondering whether it was A or B
<supersandro2000>
matrix.org is always under heavy load
<supersandro2000>
or most of the time
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<aleph->
Alright matrix sucks.
<aleph->
Sigh
<aleph->
I need to get my synapse server up
<abathur>
yeah, I've basically failed to customize the interface into anything that doesn't feel like I have a confetti cannon pointed at me and failed to make weechat-matrix work correctly so far
<gchristensen>
you missed the actual confetti cannon
<abathur>
I've wasted far too much of my day on it so far; I'll live in limbo until I feel a little less enraged by it
<abathur>
I literally disabled that option :)
<aleph->
^
<Baughn>
A NixOS config for running such a server might be nice.
<abathur>
I'm seeing the same Baughn, but I'd give it a fresh try in a few days in case it's just overloaded today
<Baughn>
Mebbe. We'll see.
<f0x>
You could try fairydust.space, matrix.org is probably getting a huuuge influx rn
<Baughn>
I'm already on the nixos discord server. Might just stick to that.
<andi->
discord O.O
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<andi->
Aren't those the folks that are hostile against 3rd party clients
<__monty__>
Matrix.org is always under heavy load from what I've heard.
<gchristensen>
extremely hostile yea
<Baughn>
Yeah, but the first-party client is far better than the Matrix one I looked at. :P
<andi->
Just run your own HS with serviceConfig.Restart="always"; 10/10 would recommend :D
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<f0x>
__monty__: it's general situation has improved a lot, I heard
<__monty__>
I'm holding out hope for Dendrite or the other implementation.
<Baughn>
The basic design seems... unfortunate.
* andi-
is on the dendrite train already
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<andi->
conduit has a nice warning in their readme
<__monty__>
andi-: And you still have to restart it regularly?
<f0x>
conduit.rs is looking better imo :)
<andi->
Something like: Do not join public servers yet as you might break them.
<andi->
__monty__: usually it just runs out of memory a few times a day.
<andi->
but recovers after a restart..
<__monty__>
: (
<elvishjerricco>
I had figured the performance problems are because there are thousands of users. Would a home server for a small number of people still have perf problems?
<__monty__>
I thought Dendrite was supposed to fix that?
<andi->
so thought I
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<f0x>
elvishjerricco: if you only participate in rooms with not so many users, yes
<f0x>
eh, yes = no perf problems, oops
<__monty__>
elvishjerricco: It's more about the size of the rooms you synchronise with.
<eyJhb>
__monty__: but that's still in beta? right?
<__monty__>
Your server has to synchronize with every room any of your users joins afaiui.
<elvishjerricco>
f0x: Well I'd figured that having to route thousands of messages to thousands of users is a way harder problem than thousands of messages to a small number of users
<Baughn>
"We do not know whether Conduit is safe for general use yet, so you should assume there is some chance that it breaks rooms permanently for all participating users."
<__monty__>
eyJhb: Yes. Hence, holding out hope.
<f0x>
#matrix:matrix.org is notoriosly hard on servers because it has to do a looot of room state with a looot of other servers
<Baughn>
And that apparently can happen just... by connecting to the federated system?
<Baughn>
Such robustness. Much confidence.
<andi->
I gave up trying to join #matrix:matrix.org after many weeks.
<andi->
I tried over and over and over again
<f0x>
elvishjerricco: the complexity is mostly on a room level, not users, until you scale very big
<andi->
it just would never join
<joepie91>
Baughn: that's an "abundance of caution" type warning
<Baughn>
joepie91: Ok, but my imagination immediately goes to *deliberately faulty* clients.
<SumnerEvans[m]>
There is work to fix that. The latest TWIM had a video discussing what they are currently doing to improve that.
<ashkitten>
andi-: they're working on fixing the memory spikes of joining large rooms in the next version of synapse
<eyJhb>
f0x: So... That pixietown you got?
<eyJhb>
:D
<Baughn>
Honestly think we'd be better off with Libera.
<Baughn>
Never mind. I'll check back in a few days and see how it's settled.
<elvishjerricco>
what's libera?
<joepie91>
Baughn: the thing is more that federation is hard, and essentially implementing a decentralized database is REALLY hard, and largely unexplored territory, and so it's preferable to test and potentially break things in a controlled manner rather than having people run around with an experimental server implementation and possibly breaking things at impractical times :)
<ashkitten>
elvishjerricco: libera is where the freenode staff and everything is moving
<Baughn>
elvishjerricco: Freenode, on a different domain name.
<SumnerEvans[m]>
We don't need another centralized point of failure.
<Baughn>
Same hardware, same people, different name.
<Baughn>
'cause they lost the name.
<qyliss>
different hardware, actually
<qyliss>
i believe
<joepie91>
yeah
<joepie91>
though that's likely mostly a technicality
<eyJhb>
qyliss: better hardware?
<f0x>
Baughn: otoh there have been rather bad-faith ecosystem participants so I guess the attack-bugs are ironed out :')
<joepie91>
For Legal Reasons(tm)
<ashkitten>
SumnerEvans[m]: i trust the people running libera, because they've proven themselves to the community. i wouldn't trust many other centralized chat platforms.
<Baughn>
ashkitten: This is an excellent point, and Matrix strikes me as something trying to find a path towards profit.
<Baughn>
Which is never a good thing to rely on.
<__monty__>
What?
<__monty__>
What about it strikes you that way?
<SumnerEvans[m]>
I never trust any centralized system, no matter how "trustworthy" they are.
<__monty__>
Especially considering you don't mind Discord.
<Baughn>
__monty__: The advertisements for for-pay versions on its homepage.
<ashkitten>
Baughn: i don't think that's true. element is a for-profit company, but the matrix foundation isn't.
<Baughn>
Discord I'm fine with, because they're allowing me to pay them for the service.
<__monty__>
...
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<__monty__>
You're fine with Discord doing it but you take offense at ELement offering you the opportunity to pay for the service?
<Baughn>
What scares me isn't a for-profit service. It's a service where the profitability, and way to reach that point, is still in question.
<ashkitten>
Baughn: the "for-pay" versions are an easy way to get a hosted homeserver under your control. they directly support element and its employees, and in turn the further development of matrix
<f0x>
it's managed hosting
<Baughn>
Ok, but what actually happened is I tried to login, timed out, and got dumped on an advertising page explaining how a hosted homeserver would fix timeout issues.
<__monty__>
I believe the Matrix Foundation also has a contract with the French government. So there's a somewhat steady source of income.
<Baughn>
That is, hmm, a little concerning.
<zgrep>
Baughn: I would be surprised is Discord can be self-sustaining based off of user payments alone, I thought most of their funding came from elsewhere.
<zgrep>
if Discord*
<Baughn>
...anyhow, I said I'm going to reserve judgement. The above is at the level of a hunch, nothing solid.
<Baughn>
So I'll stop trying to explain it.
<ashkitten>
Baughn: matrix.org is overloaded especially probably right now with what's happening to freenode, so yeah
<ashkitten>
i've self-hosted for a long time so idk what matrix.org is like nowadays
<ashkitten>
it used to be that it was barely functional under the load and would often go down for many hours
<ashkitten>
i know they've invested a lot of development time into making synapse horizontally scalable
<elvishjerricco>
Each device says "hey I'm here" to the tailscale central login server, and the login server tells all the devices how to talk to each other directly. Requires lots of NAT and firewall subversions, but it works well.
<elvishjerricco>
Sometimes you end up having to go through a relay though, but all the traffic is end to end encrypted
<__monty__>
elvishjerricco: But it doesn't connect you to other homeservers on the internet?
<f0x>
it does not, no
<__monty__>
It's just a LAN-over-internet.
<__monty__>
I use tailscale btw, as a backup to toxvpn. I'm not trying to slander it. Just pointing out that it doesn't help with the problem eyJhb raised.
<eyJhb>
__monty__: My problem is just somewhat weird.. I am not trying to hide as such, but just announcing my IP like that seems weird.
<f0x>
eyJhb: same here
<__monty__>
I understand. Might open you up to spammers.
<f0x>
like if you really wanted my ip just send me a link and tell me it's a cat picture..
<colemickens>
headscale is an open source tailscale admin server
<colemickens>
(no experience, but I package it in my nixcfg for some future use)
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<eyJhb>
Blaahaj! <3 I need to get Elsa a shark cave :D
<eyJhb>
Name stealing/channel stealing on Libera is a annoying issue.
<qyliss>
staff should help you out I think
<f0x>
yeah, wild west :p
<eyJhb>
Glad to see V got the name
<eyJhb>
qyliss: but isn't it semi-hard to prove? ie. would they then PM you on Freenode?
<eyJhb>
f0x: I got #ranger on Libera!
<__monty__>
That's just how IRC works. Whoever creates a channel by joining it first gets to be op.
<eyJhb>
And then gave op to the original owner, which promptly went offline when the spam started.
<__monty__>
eyJhb: Libera.Chat, as do most networks have a process to gain control of a project channel.
<eyJhb>
__monty__: You're just mad that #ranger is forever tainted by me :D :D \s
<qyliss>
eyJhb: I don't know the specifics
<eyJhb>
But yes. I just took it to ensure no one else did :)
<f0x>
for nicks it's probably more difficult unless the other person is hoarding multiple
<__monty__>
They probably ask to prove you control some of the related project infra.
<f0x>
but channels it's still projects priority so
<__monty__>
eyJhb: I'm not mad about anything. Who cares who joined an IRC channel first?
<eyJhb>
Just saying
<eyJhb>
But FIRST
<__monty__>
Phrasing.
<eyJhb>
butt first
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<andi->
Ok, I give up on weechat matrix for now.. This python packaging is madness...
<__monty__>
Do you have wee-slack set up?
<__monty__>
Because I just heard they can't currently be used together.
<andi->
I removed that
<andi->
but when weechat loads the plugin it can't find some cffi stuff that is in the lookup path
<andi->
when I run python against the patched script it just works (until it tries to access weechat internal, as expected)
<abathur>
andi- it sounded from a bit of what I see in matrix like hexa- might have gotten weechat-matrix set up successfully; I gave up when I kept getting auth failures with the same credentials that were working on web
<andi->
well I have this custom plugin system on top of weechat that is likely to blame..
<andi->
I manage all my weechat plujgins with it
<andi->
I have all of the available ones mapped into my expressions from their repo
<abathur>
ah
<abathur>
I, on the otherhand, have added nothing previously and have dutifully ignored the 'python: unable to parse file "/Users/abathur/.weechat/python/autoload/autoconnect.py"' error I get every startup
<abathur>
:]
<aleph->
You're all using home manager for weechat right?
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<Irenes>
oh hey andi- would you like to talk about how far you got?
<Irenes>
I'm working on packaging weechat-matrix-rs
<andi->
well I didn't package the rs thing
<andi->
I only did the python thing
<Irenes>
hm okay
<aleph->
Nifty, shouldn't be hard for rs.
<abathur>
I'm not using a module
<aleph->
Rust is easier to do now
<andi->
It is probably easier!
<abathur>
just nix-darwin
<Irenes>
the rs thing is the one with a future, due to API limitations in the scripting
<aleph->
Yeah I just made my own sorta home manager module
<Irenes>
haha aleph- yeah I did that too
<aleph->
I still want that nix expr one to get merged in for weechat finally
<andi->
Irenes: Is it more than buildRUstPackage with eventually weechat as an input?
<Irenes>
I don't know yet!
<Irenes>
I hope not :)
<Irenes>
there are no existing packages for weechat *plugins*, only for weechat *scripts*
<andi->
It is similar
<andi->
if you look at the wrapper script there is a list of plugins that will be loaded on startup
<Irenes>
ohhh
<Irenes>
I see
<Irenes>
thanks, perfect
<Irenes>
hmmm it's unfortunate that this isn't set up to be configurable from the system config
<andi->
what specifically?
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<Irenes>
the plugins
<Irenes>
I don't feel it's correct to always load the Matrix plugin, especially since it introduces a dependency on Rust
<andi->
ahh
<Irenes>
I'll worry about making the package work, first, though, heh
<Irenes>
oh hmmm
<Irenes>
okay, maybe there is a hook actually
<andi->
you can do it
<Irenes>
thanks!
<andi->
pass that configure function
<Irenes>
hmmm yes
<andi->
And then add your plugin in addition to whatever you select from the inputs
<aleph->
Fuck, cardio is evil
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<drakonis>
i was exercising earlier today
<drakonis>
i feel like i have the soggiest noodle limbs
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<andi->
I haven't exercised at all yet I feel exhausted from just watching what happened today
<Irenes>
no kidding
<Irenes>
you seem like someone who knows this, but just to say it anyway
<Irenes>
it is okay to have feelings
<Irenes>
one of the few certainties in life is that you WILL have feelings
<Irenes>
it's important to take time to feel them
<aleph->
drakonis: Full hour of cardio x3 a week
<aleph->
It has been... interesting
<aleph->
Yeah anyone have a synapse config using remote pg I can look over?
<Irenes>
cc ashkitten
<ashkitten>
remote what
<aleph->
postgres
<ashkitten>
oh, no
<aleph->
Ah there we go, a host param
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