gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
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<manveru> i feel evil now :D
<gchristensen> oh dear :)
<manveru> so now i can map all the attributes of my CI inputs to their name and output path, then i can store their stdout/stderr/metadata alongside as well :)
<manveru> i'm sure there's some super simple way to do this... but that was quite fun anyway
<gchristensen> :D
<samueldr> only cynics would use ciNix
<manveru> ;)
<manveru> happy accidents
<manveru> i was looking for a way to get sets into the shell for almost 2 hours...
<manveru> and even __structuredAttrs is only used once in nixpkgs
<manveru> anw, gotta get at least some sleep, cya
<gchristensen> w00t my heavily hacked nixops managed to deploy a thing
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<samueldr> delete-the-code... what a great name :)
<samueldr> 10 additions and 30,213 deletions
<samueldr> I like those kind of numbers
<gchristensen> :)
<gchristensen> half the added lines are already in a PR: https://github.com/NixOS/nixops/pull/980/files
<gchristensen> man I am excited for this PR
<gchristensen> nixops already feels more manageable
<gchristensen> less than 13kloc!
<samueldr> is the end-goal to get everything away from the core of nixops?
<gchristensen> :) that is the idea I'm experimenting with
<gchristensen> https://github.com/NixOS/nixops/pulls what if all these provider specific PRs could be merged by people who (imagine) knew that provider? :)
<samueldr> that would be awesome I guess
<gchristensen> "I guess" doesn't seem so enthusiastic :P what do you think?
<samueldr> if I managed nixops, I'd be stoked to be able to delegate specific knowledge to someone else or somewhere else
<samueldr> (somewhere, assuming plugins can come from outside the main repo)
<samueldr> but I know next to nothing about nixops!
<gchristensen> I'm imagining a nixopsWithPlugins
<infinisil> gchristensen: Wait, where did all the functionality go with this much deletions?
<gchristensen> thus far? away
<samueldr> though, I also imagine this makes it easier to understand how to add a provider?
<gchristensen> it can still deploy to "none" hosts and do all its stuff with "none" hosts
<samueldr> if virtualbox, digitalocean and $proviers are all separate, makes it easier to "feel" what's required
<samueldr> $providers*
<gchristensen> yeah! exactly!
<infinisil> Sooo, how do you hook in a new provider?
<gchristensen> infinisil: right now? you don't
<samueldr> `nixopsWithPlugins [ (nixops-terraform { provider = "something?"; }) ];`?
<gchristensen> maybe
<samueldr> (know almost as much about terraform :))
<infinisil> Oh heh
<infinisil> Well the removing part is the easy one
<infinisil> Probably
<samueldr> looks like it's already bearing fruits though :)
<samueldr> fixing bugs is good
<infinisil> I like the idea
<gchristensen> easy for you to say, you didn't spend like 1hr debugging https://github.com/NixOS/nixops/pull/980 :P
<{^_^}> nixops#980 (by grahamc, open): deployment.py: handle checking DiffStateEngineResourceState
<gchristensen> I'm hoping the turning them in to plugins step can be largely mechanical
<gchristensen> oops wrong link
<samueldr> github's interface really isn't happy with that
<infinisil> Is that link supposed to link to a specific line? Or just the eval-machine-info.nix file??
<gchristensen> yeah the file
<infinisil> Hmm
<infinisil> The putting together of all available options?
<infinisil> Sorry I haven't looked into it as deeply as you :)
<gchristensen> its ok
<gchristensen> yeah like (deleted) lines 352-357 are weird!
<gchristensen> 333-334 are weir
<infinisil> Maybe it would be easier to explicitly not be backwards compatible
<gchristensen> probably so
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<gchristensen> infinisil, samueldr https://github.com/grahamc/nixops-aws
<samueldr> that's it excised of anything non-aws?
<gchristensen> yeah
* samueldr spots nix/templates/virtualbox.nix
<gchristensen> ehh
<samueldr> :)
<gchristensen> this is a coarse-grained project :P
<gchristensen> "what does it even look like?" before "could this actually merge?"
<infinisil> Oh also this means it wouldn't be limited to python only!
<infinisil> Oh
<samueldr> finally, well-formed posix shell scripts to the rescue
<infinisil> Or it might still
<gchristensen> definetly still a python thing
<infinisil> Damnit
<gchristensen> I mean one step at a time now
<infinisil> Yea, it's definitely in the same direction as multi-lang support
* samueldr wipes brow
<samueldr> almost ready to shave the yak
<gchristensen> btw nobody knows I'm doing this or has asked me to do this
<gchristensen> other than whoever is here, of course :)
<samueldr> still cool to try stuff
<gchristensen> I guess what I'm saying is this could die tonight, but I think it is, indeed, cool to try :)
<samueldr> (that yak shave comment wasn't directed to someone, it's my yak, my shave)
<gchristensen> which yak?
<samueldr> hmm, hard to explain without spoiling much, it's not anything you'll be using directly
<samueldr> it's some kind of authoring software
<gchristensen> neat!
<pie_> inb4 docstrings
<samueldr> hahaha
<pie_> (pls)
<samueldr> not even remotely close
<samueldr> authoring for GFX stuff
<pie_> fug :p
<pie_> huh? graphics? i cant even fathom to guess then.
<samueldr> :)
<pie_> oh i thought this was nixos-dev oops xD
<pie_> didnt really read scroll either x)
<samueldr> it did smell like it a couple minutes ago :D
<samueldr> my project is only tangentially related to nix
<gchristensen> I wouldn't sully nixos/nixos-dev with such shenanigans :)
<gchristensen> hello
<samueldr> I started monday looking at GFX composition stuff for nixcon, I wanted to one-up myself from last year
<samueldr> no tool fit the bill, so I wrote a hacky thing
<gchristensen> so cool
<infinisil> samueldr: What.. is that?
<samueldr> that's what my commits ask too :/
<gchristensen> haha
<infinisil> First instinct: Some 3D stereoscopic thing lol
<samueldr> ah no, "programmer art" for a test
<infinisil> (I love cross-view stereoscopic things btw)
<samueldr> I had strict requirements for this project
<samueldr> you see, I have a bunch of skills normally found within designers/gfx people
<samueldr> but being a programmer makes it hard since I CAN'T PROGRAM A DAMN THING
<samueldr> (or well, it's not as native as it could be in some tools)
<samueldr> but basically, it's an animation "abomination", this'll be open-sourced obviously
<samueldr> this is used to author animations, think "like adobe animate, but with SVG and more programming"
<infinisil> neat!
<infinisil> Reminds me of that guy that coded a gif
<samueldr> yeah, close to this lol
<samueldr> (a bit less meta though)
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<gchristensen> oh man I hate to get my hopes up that this could work
<gchristensen> motherofgod
<samueldr> she did what now?
<gchristensen> it didn't _not_ work
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<gchristensen> ok well it is way past my bedtime
<gchristensen> but it almost works?
<gchristensen> like, really almost works:
<gchristensen> [nix-shell:~/projects/personal]$ ../nixops/result/bin/nixops deploy
<gchristensen> my-key-pair.> uploading EC2 key pair ‘charon-40acc6ee-ab85-11e7-aa88-9cb6d0dc0ef3-my-key-pair’...
<gchristensen> error: 'module' object has no attribute 'ec2_keypair'
<gchristensen> good night!
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<sphalerite> elvishjerricco: screenshot? :D
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<manveru> good stuff, i really think it should be easier to add custom nixops plugins... last time i dug into it was a mess
<manveru> wrote my own "nixops" in like 100 lines of crystal using just `nixos-rebuild --target-host`
<srk> manveru: heh, yeah, I've started with something like that as well in haskell
<srk> as that python is quite messy :/
<manveru> :)
<srk> and you kind-of rely on it when you start using it which makes it even worse when it breaks
<manveru> yeah, i try to only use tools that i can also fully understand/debug, otherwise i build my own
<manveru> unless there's no alternative
<srk> btw yesterday aither managed to solve secrets-out-of-world-readable-nix-store issue https://github.com/vpsfreecz/vpsadminos/commit/b0bd3e8ab8c8ad7d9fbf0d68966f0a463495fb6d - only downside is that it requires disabling sandbox so it can load the path from fs
<srk> there doesn't seem to be an easy way to disable sandbox for just nixops or just specific drv
<manveru> hmm
<srk> "i try to only use tools that i can also fully understand/debug, otherwise i build my own" pretty much :)
<manveru> can't you solving by adding the path via -I ?
<manveru> *solve it
<srk> possibly, will try
<manveru> that should make it available even in pure mode
<manveru> if you disable sandbox you of course can access everything...
<srk> yeah, but I need to that system-wide :(
<srk> another thing that gave us hard time was key exchange - sometimes even tho the keys looked alright nixops wasn't able to ssh to the machine
<srk> there even was a PR for passing options to ssh so you can at least ssh -v
<srk> to diagnost
<srk> e
<manveru> yeah...
<manveru> debugging nixops :|
<srk> sometimes it feels like it tries to do too much - great when it works, sucks to debug when it doesn't :)
<srk> I don't have much experience with terraform but there was a group of people who wanted to write binding to our cluster API for it
<manveru> using terraform would indeed be the coolest :)
<srk> but I need/want nixops backend so it's go or python /o\
<manveru> zimbatm: you still using that?
<zimbatm> manveru: graham is still using it, I haven't really had the need yet
<manveru> i haven't really played with terraform yet
<manveru> but might need to deploy some ec2 stuff soon
<manveru> he's got his operation today?
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<gchristensen> 24hrs :)
<gchristensen> andi-: you love2debug python right?
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<andi-> gchristensen: nooo, not really.. I can recommend webpdb tho..
<gchristensen> huh
<gchristensen> fwiw this issue should be pretty obvious to someone who has used python more recently than "several years ago"
<gchristensen> oh. and me too once I started rubber ducking you.
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<gchristensen> this is the most horrible error message, AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'resources'
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<andi-> ahh AttributeError's I love them....
<andi-> such great.. best thing on earth
* andi- bites the steel frame of the table
<gchristensen> apparently that error can happen due to circular imports, you'd think it'd just ... warn about circular imports
<andi-> thats probably not the classic circular import issue
<andi-> usually ist just shows an ImportError that tells you something doesn't exist while it clearly does..
* andi- is on war with pythons module system insanity
<andi-> at least I am paid to work on opensource (python) software.. thats like 42x times more amazing then the previous job ;)
<gchristensen> :)
<andi-> thats the classic recursive import issue for py2..
<andi-> gchristensen: not sure if a relative import (just the "local" part) would work there any better.. e.g. import `ec2_comon` instead of the full path
<gchristensen> I think that is it, I hate this crap
<andi-> hrhr
<andi-> I am fighting an AttributeError on a stable release that happens when you combine two features and then suddenly wrong type -,-
<gchristensen> incredible
<gchristensen> O.o
<andi-> yes.. It's so great.. and people are starting become a bit annoyed by my cries for language that at least encourages type annotations and checks those..
<gchristensen> hot diggity dog! I just provisioned an AWS VPC and a bunch of other AWS resources + deployed to a new EC2 node with my hacks
<andi-> what are you even trying to do with poor nixops?
<andi-> those commit messages are great... I can only guess you want an AWSonly nixops?
<gchristensen> really, it is just an experiment
<gchristensen> but imagine if all the digitalocean PRs to nixops could be merged by someone who actually cared about DO, and nixops' upstream didn't have to be paranoid about DO stuff breaking it, because only people who want DO have to import the DO stuff
<LnL> gchristensen: from __future__ import absolute_import
<LnL> gchristensen: I add that to every python2 file I touch :)
<gchristensen> ooh!
<LnL> the default import behaviour is madness
<gchristensen> yes
<gchristensen> before I send my PR I'm going to replace my hard-coding paths with some plugin stuff with pluggy, and then it should be pretty much ready to go (minus, of course, all the stuff I didn't delete, and all the other stuff like docs)
<andi-> gchristensen: port to python3
<gchristensen> lol
<andi-> gchristensen: you are smart, you can do it ;)
<gchristensen> well now that nixops is 1/3 the original size, sure
<gchristensen> I'm sure you could d oit
<gchristensen> I feel like I'm taking crazy-pills trying to import this thing which is obviously there but isn't sufficiently there
<gchristensen> and no circular imports either :P
<LnL> stil having problems?
<gchristensen> it was nix's fetchgit not including untracked files in the source
<andi-> tztztz
<manveru> isn't there some script to automatically convert to python3?
<etu> 2to3?
<manveru> jup, that was it :)
<manveru> never use python, so i forgot
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<andi-> "never use python" sounds like a great advice :)
<srk> +1
<srk> gchristensen: delete-the-code is cool - we can start over from that :D
<joepie91> surprisingly easy
<andi-> as long as you guys keep the hetzner support :P
<srk> btw I've hit a similar headscratching issue with python and nixops repo when testing key/value PR - there was like state.py which the PR made into state/ dir but a leftover state.pyc caused it to fail horribly while importing stuff from state.*
<srk> took me a while to notice that
<gchristensen> ooOOooo
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<sphalerite> joepie91: the guy in the air fryer video looks truly ecstatic about it
<joepie91> sphalerite: ... that video is actually of the exact model that I have, which differs slightly from the one on the pictures, lol
<joepie91> I wonder if they just used Lidl's promo video
<joepie91> sphalerite: yes, yes they did: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfCW6eEw7_w
<joepie91> also, to be fair, it *is* a really good airfryer :P
<joepie91> so the ecstasy is somewhat justified
<joepie91> lol
<andi-> posts like https://security.googleblog.com/2018/07/mitigating-spectre-with-site-isolation.html make me reconsider my switch to firefox...
<gchristensen> I thought ff already did that?
<andi-> not entirely sure
<andi-> they do multiprocess now (which they started in '08?)
<andi-> I have 6 firefox prcosses running for at least 25 tabs..
<gchristensen> ah
<gchristensen> well, I wouldn't expect them to be far behind
<gchristensen> and probably ahead in other ways
<andi-> sure. It would just be good to read more about that
<gchristensen> yeah
* andi- searches for a mozillas planet
<gchristensen> for sure! that is great stuff
<gchristensen> maybe try #firefox-dev on mozilla's irc
<andi-> I gave up on that.. I am still being redirected regarding questions with the firefox 61 glibc-unix-io dependency that was introduced without being reflected in the buildsystem...
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<gchristensen> ouch
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<infinisil> Whoa, my memory display just showed (88% used (888MB))
<infinisil> Amazing
<andi-> 888MB used? Thats amazing? o.O
<infinisil> Haha nah, that's the cache I think
<infinisil> I have 8GB RAM
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<joepie91> heads up: Online.net (owner of Scaleway) is raising prices rather unexpectedly: https://www.lowendtalk.com/discussion/149120/online-net-overnight-price-increase
<gchristensen> cc sphalerite
<sphalerite> :(
<gchristensen> you'll just have to finally make that other machine work :P
<samueldr> doesn't look like it affects scaleway... yet
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<infinisil> Since some time I stopped receiving IRC notifications on my phone and didn't know why
<infinisil> Turns out iOS automatically disables notifications of apps you haven't used in a while.. and of course prowl (my notification app) applied to that..
<infinisil> So stupid
<andi-> lol
<clever> and thats why i have pagerduty configured to both page the app and send an sms
<clever> so if something breaks, it doesnt break
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<LnL> urgh, I really want to get rid of all this PYTHONPATH stuff
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<sphalerite> gchristensen: all the best for your surgery tomorrow, hope it goes well and helps with your issues!
<samueldr> make sure to follow doctor's orders, and not compensate by over-using the other hand if it's not done on both
<gchristensen> thanks, sphalerite!
<gchristensen> I won't be computering at all for a few days, I think, samueldr
<samueldr> that's probably for the best :)
<infinisil> gchristensen: Good luck! What's the surgery called? What's being done?
<samueldr> they're installing the tubules, to assimilate other races
<gchristensen> cubital tunnel release, but don't look it up the internet describes something way worse
<gchristensen> basically they're cutting the thing which contains the ulnar nerve ("funny bone") in the elbow to give it more wiggle room
<gchristensen> the horrible thing the internet describes is a cubital tunnel transposition and takes like 3mo to recover
* samueldr couldn't find a way to make a joke about "deeper humour"
<gchristensen> lol
<infinisil> I see
<infinisil> It's amazing what medicine and surgery can do today
<infinisil> When people had hand pain when using their laptops in medieval times they just had to get a different job!
* samueldr doubts
<gchristensen> so true infinisil
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<gchristensen> and its fast!
* samueldr has strong sentiments about how the word brutalism is becoming buzzwordy
<gchristensen> yes. tbc I don't think my blog is "brutal"?
<samueldr> oh, it's from "brut" as in "raw"
<samueldr> it looks almost as if what previously could have passed as "minimalism" is now described as "brutalism"
<samueldr> and then you add more colours and lines
<samueldr> I don't really have a horse in the game, but I'm wondering if it's not misapplied
<gchristensen> I remember seeing websites with this style: https://screenshotscdn.firefoxusercontent.com/images/1c01684e-3bae-4558-9d4e-25e85d58e858.png in ... 2008?
<samueldr> here's what I feel should be brutalism: https://popalot.net/
<samueldr> the contents is written in markdown
<samueldr> and renderd in html as it looks in markdown
<samueldr> (that's a site I made)
<infinisil> Haha
<gchristensen> haha cool
<samueldr> load it up in console browsers
<samueldr> the materials used are much more at show than on bloomberg (which is touted as brutalism, when it should be something else)
<samueldr> maybe something about naïve? raw essence instead of materials?
<gchristensen> yea
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