gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
<Church-> Ah the joys of gaming on nixos
* Church- grumbles
<Church-> Guess I'll need to run a Windows vm for this game
jasongrossman has joined #nixos-chat
<ldlework> Church-: Cataclysm is in Nixpkgs :)
<Church-> Heh but not FF14
* Church- needs his mmo's
<ashkitten> Church-: wine?
<ashkitten> Church-: i have ffxiv running near-perfectly in wine
<ashkitten> well, proton
<ashkitten> latest wine should work, but the launcher will crash if you click the button in the launcher instead of pressing enter
<ldlework> lol
<ashkitten> oh and you need to enable hide wine exports from staging, i forgot
<ldlework> My current cataclysm game, http://logos.ldlework.com/caps/2019-07-15-00-31-10.png
<ldlework> just smashed up a bunch of lockers and benches in this evac shelter for wood and metal
<ldlework> just finished fashioning together a metal-spiked spear, backpack, and makeshift crowbar
<ldlework> now I need to make a bunch of arrows and go scrounging around the near by city for some clean water
<ldlework> My current position on the map, http://logos.ldlework.com/caps/2019-07-15-00-32-47.png
<Church-> ashkitten: Yeah it just goes to a black screen on the launcher for me
<Church-> Proton 4.2.9?
<Church-> Also tried 4.2-local from a gdrive link on protondb
<ashkitten> Church-: yes, that was my build
<Church-> Yeah neither worked
<Church-> Former just a black screen
<ldlework> some reproducable OS
<ashkitten> Church-: if you're using proton you need a custom build because upstream doesn't have the right patches
<ashkitten> ldlework: not helpful
<ldlework> oh come on
<Church-> Ahhh. Where would I get it?
<ashkitten> Church-: hangon
<Church-> kk
<ashkitten> Church-: it should work normally including if you click the button
<ashkitten> (tricks the launcher into using libcef instead of mshtml)
<Church-> Cool, let me try this out.
<ashkitten> though if my -local build didn't help i'm not sure this will either
<ashkitten> unless you haven't actually selected to use the build
<Church-> Oh that's your local build? Heh
<ashkitten> yes
<Church-> And nope, getting "A system error has occurred: -21 https error"
<Church-> Bother
<ashkitten> Church-: try again
<ashkitten> that happens randomly to my girlfriend sometimes
<Church-> Tried a few times already
<Church-> Maybe it's from using nvidia?
<ashkitten> else try deleting .steam/root/steamapps/compatdata/39210/pfx/drive_c/users/steamuser/My\ Documents/My\ Games/FINAL\ FANTASY\ XIV\ -\ A\ Realm\ Reborn/web
<Church-> So it doesn't actually generate a My Games dir for me
<ashkitten> Church-: did you replace "steamuser" with your username
<drakonis1> ah ff14
<drakonis1> a beaut
<ashkitten> Church-: if so, don't
<ashkitten> enter the path exactly as i said
<Church-> ashkitten: Nope, I checked under stamuser/My\ Documents/
<Church-> Nada
<ashkitten> okay
<ashkitten> uh
<ashkitten> give me your proton log
<Church-> Where's that located?
<Church-> Odd that this worked better on my xps13 then on my gaming laptop. heh
<Church-> Course I couldn't play it there because it errored out unless I tried using directx11
<ashkitten> set the steam launch command to PROTON_LOG=1 %command%
<ashkitten> then launch the game
<Church-> Huh so after a reboot it's working now.
<Church-> Sigh
<Church-> Or well I can make it to the launcher at least
<Church-> We'll see if I can play once the game is downloaed
<ashkitten> Church-: the game may give you a license error
<ashkitten> in that case i have a command to run
<Church-> Just shoot it to me now
<Church-> Gonna take like 2 hours to dl
<ashkitten> WINEPREFIX=$HOME/.steam/root/steamapps/compatdata/39210/pfx winetricks hidewineexports=enable
<ashkitten> (was making sure that was correct)
<aanderse> steam proton talk eh
<ashkitten> it *should* work oob if you are using gloriouseggroll's build, since it includes some scripts to set things up properly
<Church-> Nod nod
<ldlework> some cata gameplay
<Church-> Hmm and it errored out again. Couldn't complete launcher update.
<Church-> So let me just copy over the game data from my other laptop then
LnL has quit [Quit: exit 1]
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
das_j has quit [Quit: "Bye!";]
Drakonis has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
<Church-> And -21 error is back. Fun
<drakonis1> no lutris here?
<Church-> And it works after a reboot
<Church-> But now my mouse is borked
<Church-> It's detecting far below where it actually points...
<Church-> Odd, only works on a first boot. Hmm
<ashkitten> Church-: are you using a tiling wm?
<Church-> ashkitten: Yep, i3
<Church-> Common issue?
<ashkitten> fix the screen resolution
<Church-> Ah, to what? Just using default I think
<ashkitten> to your screen resolution?
<Church-> And do you mean in the game?
<ashkitten> yes
<ashkitten> if it doesn't match the actual size of the window, mouse scaling gets weird
<Church-> Nod
<Church-> Can I set that outside the game?
<Church-> Or does it need to be after launched?
<ashkitten> after launch
<Church-> Kk
<ashkitten> tbh it's hilarious to me that even though it gives inconsistent results for modern games, people actually use wine on windows (via cygwin) to play older games because it works better than windows itself
<drakonis1> the real irony is that wine's architecture is better suite for running older software than windows these days
<drakonis1> suited
<ashkitten> yeah
<ashkitten> which is probably a good thing, since windows has forever been held back by the past
<clever> ashkitten: lol, dang
<drakonis1> microsoft's about to gut compatibility with a bunch of older stuff when the year ends
<drakonis1> see win7
<ashkitten> it'll be good for them, i think
<ashkitten> though knowing the types of programs a lot of their users have to run....
<ashkitten> a lot of software for capture cards and other nonstandard peripherals iirc are written for extremely old windows versions
<ashkitten> and many older programs don't have modern versions or replacements, since users keep running the originals even once they hadn't been maintained for yeacs
<ashkitten> nobody can update those programs because the source code isn't open
<clever> ashkitten: sim city has been over-analyzed to death, with people disassembling it, and rewritting a functionally identical c implementation
<clever> ashkitten: the lack of source is never a total blocker :P
<ashkitten> sure
<ashkitten> but that's not always true
<ashkitten> from what i've seen of the windows software ecosystem, it's full of developers that don't care about their users, and so many scrappy hotfixes passed from user to user when they're desperate to keep the software they use working
<clever> ive also heard, that some of the windows api functions are buggy
<clever> and applications rely on those bugs being present
<ashkitten> sometimes
<clever> so when wine implements things correctly, it breaks games
<clever> so, wine is forced to reproduce the bugs
<drakonis1> lol
<drakonis1> fuckin welp
<drakonis1> THANKS WINDOWS
<ashkitten> wine also breaks games by exporting functions in the wrong order, because *apparently* windows dll functions can be accessed by ordinal instead of name due to ~legacy reasons~
<clever> *facepalm*
<drakonis1> microsoft please
<drakonis1> i wonder how terrible will reactos be like in the future
<drakonis1> if they have to obtain binary compatibility with all of windows
<ashkitten> iirc there's a thing in the os for loading them by ordinal with a hash check and name fallback but apparently not everything uses it
<ashkitten> thanks ms-dos
<clever> ashkitten: dos has done worse things
<ashkitten> sure
<ashkitten> at least i can write fun demos for dos
<clever> ashkitten: basically, there was an online game, that did self-updates, by downloading updater.exe from its website, and running it
<ashkitten> what can i do in windows? break the os by updating it
<clever> the game didnt check the http status code, so when it 404's, it just executes the html code
<clever> when you try to run html code in a .exe, windows assumes it must be a dos program
<clever> and the dos compat layer cant find any headers, so it must be a COM binary
<clever> so it just jmp's directly into the html, and runs it
<clever> by pure chance, the html formed opcodes that write to the LPT port
<clever> the dos compat layer then routes that garbage back to the real printer
<clever> which then freaked out, and caused physical damage to the printer
<clever> ashkitten: how many things had to go wrong for that to all happen? lol
<ashkitten> lmao
<ashkitten> thats great
<ashkitten> is this written about online?
<clever> yeah
<clever> but i cant remember which game it was
<clever> and google isnt finding it with more generic search terms
<ashkitten> ah, dang
<ashkitten> if you manage to find it tell me
<clever> ashkitten: i think the game had "life" in the title, what was it...
<ashkitten> nice
<clever> its something like 3 or 4 layers of failing to validate inputs
<clever> the game downloading updates didnt check for a code 200
<clever> windows (at many layers) didnt validate that an exe was an exe, and just fed html directly to the cpu
<clever> the printer drivers, and firmware didnt validate the input, and just did what it was told, causing physical damage
<ashkitten> to be fair, it's got no way to do that short of disassembling the program and checking for opcodes
<clever> a .exe file should have exe headers
<clever> i think its .com files are the only headerless ons
<ashkitten> often com files were named .exe
<ashkitten> especially during the transition to windows from dos
<clever> also, if the exe starts with <html>, its not an exe :P
<clever> also, ELF files still need SOME valid input, but this crazy got a 45 byte ELF file, that successfully runs
<ashkitten> i love that
<clever> its heavily abusing the fact that the kernel will set uninitialized fields to 0
<ashkitten> clever: have you seen my brainfuck interpreter? it's 194 bytes
<clever> and it will do that even if the file is too short to even contain those fields
<clever> and then putting opcodes within the elf header itself
<clever> and tweaking the values in the elf header, to make them valid opcodes
<clever> ashkitten: dont think ive seen it
<ashkitten> i feel i should tweak it so that it's usable in scripting, but not quite sure how
<clever> ashkitten: it lacks a .nix file, booo!!
<ashkitten> lol
<PyroLagus> lol
<ashkitten> oh hi PyroLagus
<PyroLagus> hi ashkitten o/
<ashkitten> PyroLagus has an assembly brainfuck interpreter too
<ashkitten> thanks
<clever> https://lwn.net/Articles/304105/ and another case of validate your inputs!?
<PyroLagus> no nix file either though
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
<PyroLagus> well, i'm going to bed now
<ashkitten> cya
<Church-> ashkitten: Yeah running under xfce works
<Church-> Guess I'll go register in the morning
* Church- sleeps
Myhlamaeus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<ashkitten> damn i just got so scared because i thought i accidentally sent out poll result notifications to the entire known fediverse 😓
<ashkitten> false alarm tho
drakonis1 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
endformationage has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
tokudan has quit [*.net *.split]
dtz has quit [*.net *.split]
joepie91[m] has quit [*.net *.split]
qyliss^work has quit [*.net *.split]
joepie91 has quit [*.net *.split]
yorick has quit [*.net *.split]
vdemeester has quit [*.net *.split]
makefu has quit [*.net *.split]
Jackneill has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis1 has joined #nixos-chat
vdemeester has joined #nixos-chat
makefu has joined #nixos-chat
tokudan has joined #nixos-chat
yorick has joined #nixos-chat
dtz has joined #nixos-chat
joepie91[m] has joined #nixos-chat
joepie91 has joined #nixos-chat
qyliss^work has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis1 has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.4]
vdemeester has quit [*.net *.split]
makefu has quit [*.net *.split]
tokudan has quit [*.net *.split]
dtz has quit [*.net *.split]
joepie91[m] has quit [*.net *.split]
qyliss^work has quit [*.net *.split]
joepie91 has quit [*.net *.split]
yorick has quit [*.net *.split]
pie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
dtz has joined #nixos-chat
vdemeester has joined #nixos-chat
yorick has joined #nixos-chat
yorick is now known as Guest39249
makefu has joined #nixos-chat
qyliss^work has joined #nixos-chat
joepie91[m] has joined #nixos-chat
Guest39249 is now known as yorick
das_j has joined #nixos-chat
<das_j> This is probably the right place to say this: I hate node and npm so much
<das_j> I just wanted to regenerate the package set (because I added a package). Gateway timeouts all over the place!
jackdk has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
jackdk has joined #nixos-chat
tilpner has joined #nixos-chat
__monty__ has joined #nixos-chat
noonien has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
<eyJhb> I tend not to talk about node, js, etc. anymore. I feel like I always start a debate/discussion das_j
<das_j> eyJhb: I'll shut up
<eyJhb> Haha, it is always up to the individual. I mostly just spark it and go AFK :p
<das_j> So (if I did everything correctly) me adding ONE package resulted in 4 changed files with 1,130 additions and 563 deletions.
<manveru> sounds about right :P
<das_j> oof
<manveru> now go audit every package...
<das_j> go audit: unknown command
<das_j> Run 'go help' for usage.
<manveru> hehe
<manveru> i wish sometimes package managers would make you read every line of code you're about to add to a project through dependencies...
<das_j> every time I see a is-* project, I cringe
<manveru> i know that's stupid, but there's no bound on stupidity atm
<das_j> That's what I was lookig for
<das_j> weekly downloads 24,050,165
<manveru> lol
<manveru> that file had one change but there are 9 releases...
<das_j> yeah stuff like sponsors
<das_j> why even sponsor that
<das_j> I'm actually surprised. My matrix-irc bridge (node) seems to work
<das_j> The node2nix is probably the best thing about node
<manveru> i'm on the yarn2nix side, but yeah
<das_j> oh right, there's yarn...
<manveru> hehe
<manveru> our company got cut off from npmjs.com because of too much traffic...
<yorick> das_j: programming is mainly about tying together dependencies as efficiently as possible nowadays
<manveru> we have zero caching of builds, so now we run our own registry instead, fun stuff
<das_j> both yorick and manveru: Why wasn't I born back when computers were great?
<manveru> they were never great...
<manveru> it's just that no matter what performance improvements come via hardware, are taken away through software immediately
<Taneb> They used to be great in the sense of "very big"
<Taneb> ;P
<manveru> :D
<manveru> we used to have a computer that took up half our basement just to do accounting back in the 80s
<manveru> now my phone could emulate a million of those boxes
<manveru> i guess people always stop working on performance if things seem "fast enough" for them
<manveru> or that adding a dependency magically absolves them from caring what it actually does or how
<yorick> das_j: because everything optimizes for development speed all the time
<yorick> you can throw together magical react apps with 4000 dependencies in a few days
<yorick> but you sacrifice any idea of what the dependencies are doing
<yorick> it turns out human time is way more valuable than hardware or even security
<manveru> also see "security vs ease-of-use"
pie_ has joined #nixos-chat
<jD91mZM2> What the... Randomly, it took forever to `git status` a directory. Then, `zfs scrub` did the same thing. Tried to reboot and got stuck at ZFS doing some shutdown job, and had to REISUB. Then, compton didn't work because systemd couldn't communicate using dbus. So, another, uninterupted reboot, and I'm almost back. Except Firefox refused to load any website unless I entered safe mode... Or cleaned my
<jD91mZM2> entire profile
<gchristensen> anything in dmesg?
<jD91mZM2> I am starting to wonder if this is the kind of madness that happens when your computer gets a power surge after a lightning strike, but I don't really feel like that makes much sense because I didn't see or hear any thunder. Maybe it's just cursed. Typical ghosts, always trying to crash ZFS.
<jD91mZM2> gchristensen: Yes, first time (before first reboot). It pointed out my shell prompt and screamed about some invalid register value
<yorick> jD91mZM2: disk broken?
<yorick> or memory broken
<jD91mZM2> yorick: Yeah I'm really confused. No scrubbing issues from ZFS, so disk is hopefully intact (it's also quite new)
<yorick> jD91mZM2: what does smartctl testing say?
<gchristensen> I've had that problem with ff before - it might very well be unrelated
<__monty__> jD91mZM2: Newness isn't usually a good thing™ with HDDs though. They usually fail either early or late, seldomn between those.
<gchristensen> ye olde bathtub curve
<jD91mZM2> __monty__: It's new because I recently switched to an SSD :D
<jD91mZM2> yorick: Sorry for the late response, I ran it now and it started a test... How do I see the output of it?
<__monty__> Ah, not sure but I suspect the same curve would apply? Maybe less severely?
<jD91mZM2> yorick: Never mind, "Short offline Completed without error"
<andi-> remote builders with flaky network would be great :-)
<clever> jD91mZM2: have you tried memtest yet?
<jD91mZM2> clever: Nope, will check. Thanks!
<jD91mZM2> clever: Is "memtester" enough? It says all OKs on a 16MB region (I wanted to try 1G but it reduced). I don't want to flash a USB stick for this, it's way more likely to just have been a one-time occurence, my computer isn't that old :)
<clever> jD91mZM2: boot.loader.grub.memtest86.enable = true; and then choose it from the boot menu
<jD91mZM2> Welp, another thing also broke: ~/.cargo/registry needed wiping to make rust programs build, it complained about "object not found - no match for id (commit hash)"
<jD91mZM2> My very uneducated opinion claims it's likely to just have been a small bug with the ZFS kernel module. I'll probably do a memtest later but now I just want to get on with things
<jD91mZM2> Thanks for all help though, very appreciated!
drakonis_ has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
LnL has joined #nixos-chat
<tilpner> jD91mZM2: Did you have a pool on removable media?
<tilpner> jD91mZM2: That might be working-as-intended, if failmode is set to wait (the default value)
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
<jD91mZM2> tilpner: I don't have anything ZFS-related on removable media, and only connection I have in is my power source and my mouse
endformationage has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis_ has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
<tilpner> jD91mZM2: It might also happen if zfs decided to fail a device for another reason, but those error counters were probably reset after reboot
joepie91 has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
<das_j> umm
<das_j> what timezone is the pretix server in?
<adisbladis> das_j: All times are presented in UTC.
<das_j> oh
<das_j> good to know, thanks
drakonis_ has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis1 has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
drakonis_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis1 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
Drakonis has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
jtojnar has joined #nixos-chat
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Myhlamaeus has joined #nixos-chat
jasongrossman has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
jtojnar has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<sphalerite> jD91mZM2: memtester won't be any good on 16MB. Try disabling zfs's ARC and running memtester again
<sphalerite> also kliling anything that you don't strictly need running
<sphalerite> jD91mZM2: or boot into a memory test program as clever says, which can then properly test _all_ the memory
<sphalerite> jD91mZM2: there's also a basic memory tester built into linux, which you can get by passing memtest=1 (or a bigger number for more passes, which is more likely to detect any errors there might be) on the kernel commandline
<colemickens> It annoys me so much that "flag" in Go uses single dash `-longarguments` and that people continue making new tools that use it.
<__monty__> Wow, sounds like a pretty major design flaw.
<__monty__> GHC is terrible for having single dash long arguments.
<gchristensen> that is BSD style I think?
<__monty__> But -aeun flag combination's so useful and risks being ambiguous in the presence of -longargs.
<gchristensen> definitely
<__monty__> Next hurdle is --long arg vs --long=arg.
<ashkitten> big brain strat is to go interchangeable
<gchristensen> just wait until I create a short arg flag named `=`, where `-foo=bar` is the options f, o, o, =, b, a, r
<ashkitten> gchristensen why
<ashkitten> why hast thou forsaken us
<ashkitten> ok but tbqh that sounds like exactly the sort of thing i and many of my friends would do
<gchristensen> because
<gchristensen> because
<ashkitten> yes?? speak to me
<gchristensen> just because
<ashkitten> yeah fair nuff
<ashkitten> lmao
<sphalerite> what about --param arg1 arg2 ? :D
<ashkitten> im dying
<__monty__> Oh, sorry, didn't realize I was in #evil-geniuses.
<sphalerite> *side-eye at nix's --option and --arg and --argstr*
<samueldr> wait until --foo bar is "-" "f" "o" "o" " " "b" "a" "r" (significant space
<sphalerite> but since the program can't differentiate between different amounts of unescaped space on the shell, it should always interpret an arg gap as space, newline *and* tab, just in case
<ashkitten> nix run -f '<nixpkgs>' foo bar helpimtrappedinanargumentfactory baz -c foobar ohno
<samueldr> treat --foo" "bar differently than --foo bar
<samueldr> and don't forget --foor\" \"bar
<samueldr> (-r)
<ashkitten> -c stands for C O N S U M E
<ashkitten> i'm extremely in a mood today
<ashkitten> trying to get answers on my zfs questions is a long waiting game for the wrong person to answer badly and then everyone else to assume that it's been answered
<gchristensen> try posting the wrong answer
<ashkitten> ah yes, the tried and true method to get ALL the right answers immediately
<ashkitten> mayhap i should try saying i liked sonic lost world, as well
<ashkitten> i just said mayhap, huh
<__monty__> Oh, and waterworld, and sandler movies.
<ashkitten> have i been playing too much final fantasy 14?
<tilpner> Are you referring to me, or the other person?
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis_ has joined #nixos-chat
<ashkitten> tilpner: it's just irc in general sometimes, but yesterday
Drakonis has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Drakonis has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis1 has joined #nixos-chat
drakonis_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
__monty__ has quit [Quit: leaving]
jasongrossman has joined #nixos-chat
jasongrossman has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
day|flip has joined #nixos-chat
<samueldr> oof, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpXy041BIlA this is something; the usual video from him :)