gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
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<aanderse> manveru: ah nice :)
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<samueldr> :/ looks like github is accidentally running instances of github that are indexed by google on subdomains
<gchristensen> uhh lol
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<pie_> (manveru, sidenote, linked page seems to say ubuntu wont be dropping 32 but support completely after all)
<pie_> aaaand the later part of the post seems to address that
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<eyJhb> Anybody have experience with setting up a local Gitlab CE from source?
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<gchristensen> I wonder how long it takes fastmail to import 1.1M messages
<eyJhb> gchristensen: read that as 1.1MB message to start with :p
<eyJhb> What is the progress?
<eyJhb> Currently running Docker, so that I can run Vagrant so that I can run Docker. Docker in Docker. IT is great!
<gchristensen> the progress is reported as "In progress"
<eyJhb> How much do you feel like it has imported then? ;)
<gchristensen> when the wind blows, it feels like all of it and none of it somehow. when the sun is hot, it feels there is still millions more. when in a shadow, I feel like it is already complete
<andi-> I am curious to hear how happy you'll be with fastmail :-)
<gchristensen> have you used it?
<andi-> no
<andi-> I have looked at many providers years ago and then decided to run yet another mailserver instead.
<gchristensen> I have a very, very hard time deciding I want to do that
<andi-> Most offerings either lack enough space (have about ~120GB right now) or they lack enough aliases or enough (sub)domains and multi-user support...
<gchristensen> ah
<gchristensen> my least favorite thing to do with mail is receive it
<gchristensen> oh, and send it
<andi-> read?
<gchristensen> oh man okay yeah that is even worse than receiving
<andi-> do you enjoy writing mails?
<gchristensen> sometimes
<andi-> deleting mails is my favorite mail related activity ;-)
<gchristensen> yes that one is good
<gchristensen> but deciding to delete? less fun
<andi-> <shift>-T .+ ;D$y
<andi-> or just having notmuch tag all new mails as deleted and then they will vanish on the next sync ;-)
<gchristensen> lol
<andi-> an INBOX ringbuffer without a size limit but they can only be received once
<gchristensen> lol yes
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<gchristensen> samueldr: the ninish background + terminal BG of #000000 and an opacity of 0.9 is really nice
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<kisik21> How was Nix built before Nix? When exactly did Nix start being self-hosting?
<gchristensen> it was built with ./configure and make
<gchristensen> Nix was used to build Nix before 2008
<kisik21> wow
<kisik21> old times
<kisik21> I mean, I wasn't even into Linux back then
<kisik21> I was a Windows person at that time
<kisik21> (didn't know where to get Linux)
<gchristensen> that was when release.nix was added to the nix repository. before then, the release.nix lived in a separate repository, I'm not sure where that code is -- if it exists at all
<gchristensen> is the earliest I can find, August 2003 https://github.com/nixos/nixpkgs/commit/1445fe4a26755556d67a046eb04c338db10e8586
<kisik21> wow, I don't even recognize the syntax
<gchristensen> if you `cat` a .drv file, you might
<kisik21> people wrote low-level derivation code back then?!
<kisik21> There was no nix language?!
<kisik21> feels like something ancient
<gchristensen> yeah, this is before the language itself
<gchristensen> ye ol' ".fix" files
<kisik21> I'm just several years older than this commit...
<kisik21> time is a weird thing
<gchristensen> ;)
<kisik21> I was born in 2001 and Nix... was born seemingly right after me
<kisik21> it is destiny
<aanderse> don't say things like that... you make young people like me feel old :\
<kisik21> I'm probably the youngest person here
<kisik21> I'm 17 right now
<gchristensen> quite possibly, welcome!
<kisik21> can't even drink yet (not that I want to)
<kisik21> oh, my battery's being drained by all that building
<infinisil> I'm not sure if I can be proud of this, but I never drank alcohol and I'm 23 y/o
<gchristensen> yeaah Nix'll do that to you
<kisik21> especially with qemu
<kisik21> I'm still not losing hope in trying to build an armv7l-linux system
<kisik21> building nixUnstable right now to bootstrap stuff on my RPi
<kisik21> two slow machines are better than one slow machine
<kisik21> and if I get another PC chugging along, I may build it before the end of the month :D
<kisik21> Looks a bit cute, may use it
<kisik21> I'm not technically cross-compiling though
<kisik21> Technically it's all native but emulated
<kisik21> that's why it's so slow
<samueldr> might be faster to cross-compile, and then bootstrap on hardware, depending on your hardware's oopmh
<samueldr> oomph*
<kisik21> RPi2
<kisik21> no swap
<manveru> aanderse: i think i finally got that damn bundler under control :)
<samueldr> I was thinking more about the other computer doing the build :)
<samueldr> qemu can be terribly slow
<aanderse> manveru: yeah? :D
<kisik21> I'm building nixUnstable. if I do, I could upload it to vika.cachix.org and propagate it to various PCs and make a buildfarm - half qemu, half native
<manveru> haven't tried with redmine... but in my tests it works :)
<aanderse> manveru: i'm glad to hear that! looking forward to trying it out
<kisik21> ok great I have AC power now
<kisik21> 1/1/180 built... it's soooo sloooooow :3
<ashkitten> kisik21: ha, it's weird *not* being the youngest person in a room anymore
<kisik21> may I ask how old are you?
<ashkitten> 19 or so
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<vika> I think I'll need to change my nickname on freenode since I'm transitioning my machines to use my name instead of that silly nickname I used when I was... i don't remember how old I was
<gchristensen> eh, the internet is for fun names.
<infinisil> Aww yeah
<ashkitten> i wish i had a better nick
<vika> Ohhhhh it's speeding up, already 3 packages built and 2 more on the pipeline =)
<infinisil> vika: I recommend using a nickname that will be available wherever you sign up
<vika> infinisil: what do you mean?
<vika> I have kisik21 registered on freenode already
<vika> may I somehow do something to be vika?
<vika> >.<
<vika> this is so complex
<infinisil> vika: I mean for other sites
<manveru> aanderse: well, the tricky part is still the database thingy... in theory we could just put in a config/databases.yml in nixpkgs and it'll work right, are you fine with that?
<vika> infinisil: you don't need other sites when you got your own! Why do you think I'm struggling with NixOS for RPi2?
<manveru> aanderse: otherwise there's no way other than teaching bundix to apply patches or modifying it manually everytime
<aanderse> manveru: i'm totally fine with that
<manveru> cool
<vika> I so want an RPi4
<vika> does anyone here have it already? can it run NixOS?
<manveru> i'll try to make a branch to experiment with :)
<vika> I know RPi3 can
<gchristensen> rpi4 with 4gb of ram is shockingly reasonable looking
<manveru> and i just bought two rpi3 :P
<vika> Yeaaaaaa! I want one but AliExpress doesn't have them yet
<aanderse> manveru: great, thanks!
<gchristensen> and apparently it will support 8g of ram at some point
<samueldr> "it's a typo"
<samueldr> so "no", until they do
<samueldr> :)
<vika> 8G of RAM? I could build Chromium right on that beast
<vika> it already runs Chromium
<gchristensen> samueldr: womp womp
<samueldr> tried to get an rpi4, the shops are all sold out
<samueldr> so I guess I won't have one
<vika> samueldr: I'm waiting until winter when AliExpress sellers get their hands on these little cutie pies
<vika> it should appear pretty fast, I think
<vika> but the demand will probably be shocking
<vika> (not for the 4G model though, it's expensive)
<samueldr> as far as running, nixos might be runnable with the downstream kernel as 32 bit reasonably easily...
<samueldr> ... but upstream kernel will need to be implemented
<samueldr> (and 64 bit using downstream kernel is a wild guess)
<samueldr> then, there's u-boot that we need for the usual image
<vika> 64 bit with downstream kernel means no drivers for GPU
<vika> at least that's why they won't make Raspbian 64-bit
<vika> VideoCore GPUs are all 32bit AFAIK
<samueldr> I don't know about that exactly, but it's more about the existing userland IIRC
<vika> but RPi3 is running in pure 64-bit mode on NixOS, right?
<samueldr> you can share one build for rpi2~3B+, so why not go for 4 too
<samueldr> yes
<vika> Cool!
<samueldr> with the upstream kernel
<vika> Cool x2
<samueldr> if I could get my hand on a rpi2 with the new broadcom chip, those are likely to work as 64 bit too
<vika> They do
<samueldr> (there is a late rpi2 variant which has the same cpu as the rpi3)
<samueldr> I mean: verifiably work :)
<vika> They're basically RPi3 minus WiFi
<vika> and who needs WiFi on a server
<vika> well I do
<samueldr> you
<vika> I had a wi-fi chip sticked in the USB port of my RPi 2 for a long time
<vika> it saved my life several times and once drained my mobile data
<vika> or better say my parents' mobile data
<vika> because it was mom who was sharing Wi-Fi at that moment
<vika> we were switching every two weeks because we were out of town and we had strict data caps
<vika> and well, my RPi accidentally connected to her AP and started seeding torrents
<vika> several gigabytes wasted
<gchristensen> whoops
<vika> that's why you don't put Wi-Fi passwords for data-capped APs into your headless machines
<vika> Ohhh that's actually a pretty old story
<vika> because today I have a tethering restriction, 3GB per month (and everything else is unlimited). My home router has OpenWRT and OpenVPN set up though, so I use some hacks to circumvent that restriction
<vika> I hope nobody here's working for my mobile carrier :D
<gchristensen> we do have some people in telecoms, but I doubt they'd be concerned
<vika> well, I'm Russian
<vika> so I doubt someone works for my mobile carrier here
<gchristensen> no idea :)
<vika> that means I'm safe!
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<elvishjerricco> My power went out at home. I’m away until sunday. So my desktop went down... the one that needs a password to boot. I SSH into that thing for programming quite often
<gchristensen> ups
<gchristensen> "oops" I meant to say, but also a UPS would help
<elvishjerricco> gchristensen: power was out for a few hours so I don’t think it would have :P
<gchristensen> :P
<gchristensen> I suppose you're not in the market for a big ol' diesel generator
<elvishjerricco> I do have a roommate there, but I don’t want to tell him the password
<gchristensen> good choice
<vika> so. nix build nixpkgs.nixUnstable --system armv7l-linux --builders "ssh://nixos-builder armv7l-linux" --max-jobs 4 is gonna use 4 cores of my PC and also nixos-builder machine in the local network, am I right?
<elvishjerricco> I also have a binary keyfile though (used for boot shenanigans). I could macgyver a USB image that would boot, use that key to unlock the disk, and boot the system, and then rotate that key.
<vika> oops wrong channel :3
<elvishjerricco> Orrrrrr I could just spin up a modest instance on a cloud provider for the weekend.
<vika> I think my build is getting bottlenecked by gettext which seems to be required by everything nowadays
<vika> It only builds gettext on the remote builder and my notebook is staying unused and cold as ice
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<vika> bugs.python.org seems to be unavailable from Russia. What's up?!
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<gchristensen> I guess somebody there said something Russia doesn't like
<vika> gchristensen: the host just drops connections...
<vika> even before I send something
<vika> it's so weird and looks like a misconfiguration
<vika> but the bug tracker is offline
<vika> it's inaccessibl
<vika> :3
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<elvishjerricco> Is there a good way to get NixOS with ZFS for root on AWS?
<infinisil> I wouldn't call that a good way though, and maybe AWS allows something nicer
<elvishjerricco> infinisil: kexec is always a fun way :P
<elvishjerricco> I don’t think AWS lets you boot from an iso or anything
<gchristensen> I think clever has a way to make the disk image a zfs root
<pie_> "hey kid wanna get some zfs images"
<infinisil> gchristensen: The wiki article describes clevers kexec approach, maybe you mean that?
<gchristensen> no he makes an AMI itself
<clever> elvishjerricco: one min
<clever> this is a modified copy of the nixos scripts for generating AMI's
<clever> most complex part is that runInLinuxVM doesnt support out-of-tree modules
<elvishjerricco> Noted. Thanks
<clever> line 20 forces out-of-tree modules to work, so it can generate a zfs image
<clever> and a lot of amazon-image.nix expects ext4 rootfs, but also includes stuff you really want on aws
<clever> so i had to duplicate chunks of it
<clever> but i also had a new idea on how to handle things in aws
<clever> gchristensen: basically, what if i took the kernel+initrd from the kexec stuff, and just jammed them into an AMI with grub?
<clever> gchristensen: so booting the AMI always drops you into the nixos installer
<clever> gchristensen: then you just wipe the disk (that the AMI generated) and nixos-install as normal
<clever> ideally, there would be a nixops plugin, that could boot this installer AMI, partition, format, and mount all disks
<clever> then just `nix copy --to ssh://root@target?remote-store=local?root=/mnt /nix/store/hash-nixos
<clever> Raw
<clever> then the activation logic needs a tweak, to deal with chroots (or maybe just nixos-install --system?)
<clever> and your done, the 1st generation is exactly your deployment, and zero overhead from the AMI bootstrap
<clever> gchristensen: and the place where plugins come in, is that you could have a plugin that takes an ubuntu/rescue shell, and then converts it to a nixos installer shell
<clever> but aws can skip that, and go directly to a nixos installer AMI
<clever> and then, any backend can follow that phase up, with a remote install plugin, that takes a nixos installer shell, and copies the 1st generation over, while formatting disks
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