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<elvishjerricco>
Well I think Apple's got the right idea that we should think about data in terms of the app that owns it rather than the user that owns it or the directory hierarchy a lot of the time, since it makes it way easier to jail apps and keep permissions simple. But for that 30% of the time where this doesn't work, I wish they'd give us some way to manually browse files and add permissions. Of course as a programmer it's
<elvishjerricco>
way higher than 30% for me, but I'm guessing it doesn't get nearly as in the way for most people.
<ivan>
if you can avoid using OpenVPN there is an iOS WireGuard now and it can import configuration from QR codes
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: Whether that figure is higher than 30% for most people depends largely on how the OS encourages them to work, doesn't it?
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: E.g., some OSes encourage you to think of your photos as belonging to iPhoto, while others encourage you to think of them as cross-application files.
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: Also, we should talk about non-metal prog rock some time.
<elvishjerricco>
jasongrossman: Right and my point was that for different use cases lend themselves better to one or the other, and most use cases are probably fine with the per-app data model
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: I guess we're agreeing.
<elvishjerricco>
I'm much less aware of non-metal prog unfortunately :P
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: Although there are long-term problems that users are sometimes encouraged to ignore.
<elvishjerricco>
Oh?
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: Don't you ALL THE TIME find that Apple users don't know they can use their files on other computers, for example?
<elvishjerricco>
Not really. Most of my friends are android users, and most of my family is Apple users who just sync to iTunes and get everything rather easily :P
<elvishjerricco>
"Everything" being photos
<elvishjerricco>
My family's only files are usually email and photos lol
<jasongrossman>
elvishjerricco: Maybe it's just that I've observed these people for longer periods of time than you have. Eventually they'll want to switch ecosystems. I don't find that they complain about the problem - rather that they lose files they don't know they could have transferred.
<jasongrossman>
Oh, and often, when their iPhones break, they buy new iPhones entirely because they think that's the only way to keep their files.
<elvishjerricco>
For the most part their files are in the cloud, so they don't lose things when their phone dies
<jasongrossman>
You mean provided they get another iPhone? That's my point.
<elvishjerricco>
I don't see the problem :P
<jasongrossman>
Because they think of them as "iPhoto" (or whatever) files.
<jasongrossman>
Although that would also be depressing!
<elvishjerricco>
I mean they're gonna buy an iPhone because they like that better to begin with, at least in my family. They all made conscious decisions to choose an Apple device from the start, so they usually stick to it because they like it, not because of iPhoto's
<jasongrossman>
Oh, OK. Your family is not particularly what I'm talking about though.
<jasongrossman>
Also, it's very hard for consumers to know why they want what they want.
<elvishjerricco>
I dunno, it's not a very tech savvy question to ask "copy iPhotos to android."
<jasongrossman>
Maybe the people you know aren't as busy as the people I know?
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<elvishjerricco>
I dunno. But I'm fielding tech support questions from my family all the time :P Maybe I'm unique in that they all seem to have at least a basic fundamental understanding of what everything is
<elvishjerricco>
So anyway
<elvishjerricco>
To answer your question, I have not personally observed a problem with people tying their data to their apps and ecosystems, but I can definitely imagine that happen
<samueldr>
hi o/ small note about {`-`} service: you'll see the bot twice for a short duration, while migrating servers. I expect messages could be dropped, but fewer than 5 minutes total duration of dropped messages
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<elvishjerricco>
I do think tying data to apps / services instead of the standard Unix model is a better default though. As long as it is made clear how to liberate data from its app
<elvishjerricco>
iOS actually does make it reasonably obvious with its universal "share" icon, which immediately lets people know what they can share
<samueldr>
hopefully I can switch over the web frontend
<samueldr>
(that was a test, and it was successful it seems)
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<infinisil>
samueldr++
<{^_^}>
samueldr's karma got increased to 47
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<sphalerit>
gchristensen++ for the cheeky centurylink retweet