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<infinisil>
Related to dvorak
<infinisil>
I just tested my typing speed yesterday, and it's about 100 WPM avg when I'm warmed up
<infinisil>
But once, once I was able to type one segment without mistakes, with 125 WPM! (The words were pretty short though)
<ottidmes>
is it really worth the effort switching from qwerty to dvorak?
<infinisil>
Well, I didn't switch to get faster, I just wanted to he different xD
<ottidmes>
seems more of a thing that you do, simply because you can
<infinisil>
be*
<infinisil>
I'm using programmer dvorak though, the special symbols without shift is very nice I have to say
<infinisil>
I guess you could get the same with qwertz though
<ottidmes>
yeah, that bit is not specifically coupled to qwerty I guess
<__monty__>
I type dvorak, not because of speed but because it hurts less, well not at all really.
<__monty__>
I've slowly increased from 50wpm to high 60s but that probably has more to do with typing than the layout.
<etu>
__monty__: I type dvorak for the same reason
<etu>
Comfort is my main reason
<etu>
And 12 years later, yeah well. :-)
<jasongrossman>
__monty__: Ditto, more or less.
<jasongrossman>
Also it's fun to be different.
<jasongrossman>
ottidmes: I learned Dvorak when I needed a displacement activity. I was meant to be writing a thesis.
<__monty__>
I learned really early, right after I'd learned touch typing.
<qyliss^work>
The main benefit I got from Dvorak was that I had to properly learn how to touch type
<qyliss^work>
rather than whatever I had cobbled together over time in the 15 years I'd been typing previously
<qyliss^work>
But I really notice how much travel my fingers suddenly have to start doing when I switch back to qwerty
<qyliss^work>
It was annoying to learn, though. I probably wouldn't recommend it.
<__monty__>
You should recommend it to people just learning typing, before there's too much qwerty muscle-memoryloss.
<qyliss^work>
yeah
<__monty__>
It's too bad most people go "But how would I type on someone else's computer?" As long as using computers in ignorance is so easy alternative layouts will never stand a chance : /
<jasongrossman>
We should make NixOS Dvorak-only.
<__monty__>
Yes, steal haskell's slogan: Avoid success at all costs!
<jasongrossman>
__monty__: LLOL
<qyliss^work>
although it's also a bit of a pain when I want to use other peoples' computers
<gchristensen>
I found once I learned dvorak it took not long to re-learn qwerty and have it be useful
<infinisil>
It's funny when somebody else tries to use my computer
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<etu>
infinisil: People don't even try on mine anymore, dvorak on a blank ergodox with a big emacs window Q-p
<etu>
:p
<ldlework>
__monty__: I always chuckle at the 'use somebody else's computer' thing
<ldlework>
it's like, when i got to my windows machine, i'm not paralyzed with confusion
<ldlework>
i remember how to use a keyboard with control and alt in the normal places and stuff :)
<infinisil>
etu: Haha yeah, also a blank ergodox for me and sometimes emacs :)
<ldlework>
I always like to imagine the alternative of being totally confounded though
<etu>
__monty__: Also, US-Dvorak is shipped by all major OSes since it's an ISO standard, so windows ships it.
<qyliss^work>
looks like there's no point making NixOS Dvorak-only since from what I can tell from this conversation literally every NixOS user already uses it :P
<infinisil>
Haha yes
<etu>
qyliss^work: Great sample size for that survey I'd say :p
<qyliss^work>
A bunch of my coworkers have Dvorak in their input lists just for if I need to type on their computetrs
<qyliss^work>
100% of NixOS users use Dvorak. Might as well remove all the other layouts.
<gchristensen>
so apparently you can set keyboard map by specific device, not just full system
<infinisil>
I want all OS'es to have some feature to use somebody else's layout. E.g. by associating your email with your layouts. Then just enter your mail on somebody elses computer and it downloads it and uses it
<infinisil>
#coolfeaturesthatwillneverexist
<__monty__>
etu: I'm talking about the kind of people that don't even realize you can change the software layout of a hardware qwerty keyboard.
<__monty__>
Let's link layout to google account...
<__monty__>
Also, windows' layout switching has always been broken when I've used it. I go through all the hoops to add dvorak to the list, make it the default, remove qwerty and bam! Everything's still qwerty even though the input menu says it's dovark and it's the only option in the menu so you can't toggle it. WTF microsoft?
<Synthetica>
infinisil: Just enter an url that returns a string describing the layout, so that you can have different layouts on prime-numbered days
* Synthetica
doesn't use Dvorak
<__monty__>
So now I have to not remove qwerty and then switch explicitly in every program : /
<etu>
__monty__: oh, yeah, well
<infinisil>
Synthetica: oh nice
<etu>
Synthetica: Our survey says that you're a minority :-p
<infinisil>
Just need an universal keyboard layout description now
<Synthetica>
QWERTY-ctrl:swapcaps represent!
<ldlework>
caps is a bad modifier
<__monty__>
Swapcaps? I never use caps.
<ldlework>
takes your hand out of normal typing posture
<gchristensen>
you should write more cobol
<ldlework>
caps makes a good modal key though
<ldlework>
or menu key
<Synthetica>
gchristensen: Said no-one ever
<ldlework>
hehe
<gchristensen>
haha, but it can apparently have monadic io!
* etu
just didn't add caps-lock on his ergodox layout, no need to swap it
<ldlework>
ergodox makes you extend your thumbs to access the modifiers :(
<__monty__>
gchristensen: That's probably why no one uses it : >
<Synthetica>
(ctrl:swapcaps reverses the place of caps and ctrl on regular QWERTY, which I use a lot, since I'm a filthy Electron-editor user)
<gchristensen>
:D
<Synthetica>
__monty__: HEY!
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<infinisil>
My laptop's SSD seems to be dead :(
<qyliss^work>
oh no!
<infinisil>
There's no trace of it in fdisk, as if it vanished
<infinisil>
To my luck, that SSD was actually a replacement for an older one due to me needing more capacity (at that time), and I still have the older one :)
<samueldr>
:( hope your backup solution works well (knowing you it's zfs snapshots and it's already tested?)
<infinisil>
samueldr: Yeah, I have my backups, and have had to use them for the laptop twice already
<samueldr>
I see, so the laptop is cursed
<infinisil>
Haven't thought of that, but that must be it!
<elvishjerricco>
still seeing efifb in `/prof/iomem`
<gchristensen>
hrm
<gchristensen>
I should back up my computer
<samueldr>
😱
<gchristensen>
feels like I of all people would have his stuff together?
<gchristensen>
nope
<elvishjerricco>
Anyone have any idea why I'm getting `pci 0000:42:00.0: BAR 1: assigned to efifb` despite having `video=vesafb:off,efifb:off`?
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<ldlework>
gchristensen: NixOS Challenge
<ldlework>
We should make 2019 the year of the challenge.
<ldlework>
I should go to NixCon. Is it interesting?
<ldlework>
dumb question given the venue i guess
<gchristensen>
do you find the posted videos interesting? and/or, do you find it valuable to meet peers face to face?
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<elvishjerricco>
samueldr: You said you've done GPU passthrough, right?
<samueldr>
attempted, never succeeded
<elvishjerricco>
Ah. I've fixed every error message I've found, and the thing still just doesn't show up on screen :/
<elvishjerricco>
With `video=efifb:off`, the Grub screen remains on the screen as Linux boots. Once I start the VM, I see `kernel: vfio_ecap_init: 0000:42:00.0 hiding ecap 0x19@0x900` in journalctl, and the screen goes black. Seems like a good thing. But then it just never comes back on
<samueldr>
ah, so the GPU your machine boots from
<elvishjerricco>
Yea, unfortunately
<samueldr>
(no idea, just making sure I understand)
<samueldr>
and you don't / can't have another GPU to at least see if it's the only issue?
<elvishjerricco>
My impression is that as long as you give qemu the right vBIOS, the boot GPU is fine to us
<elvishjerricco>
I do not.
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<elvishjerricco>
My least favorite thing about qemu is that googling stuff about it almost always just yields libvirt answers, not actual qemu answers.
<sphalerite>
ldlework: nixos challenge?
<gchristensen>
erase your computer and time how long it takes to be productive again
<ldlework>
sphalerite: record yourself dd'ing your personal workstation
<gchristensen>
:D
<sphalerite>
oh
<sphalerite>
lol
<ldlework>
it isn't about racing, but that's an interesting element
<ldlework>
the most interesting element is that it is the machine you use to get work done
<ldlework>
just dd'ing some rando laptop is no challenge :)
<samueldr>
ldlework: for new users or for experimented nixos users?
<samueldr>
because for experimented users it's... kinda funny :)
<ldlework>
Anyone is welcome to the challenge. The idea is that it is a good marketing angle for NixOS.
<samueldr>
if you remove network and disk I/O it makes for short videos :)
<ldlework>
Users destroying their actual workstations because they're confident they can get it back no problem.
<ldlework>
Could be a fun thing a NixCon too
<ldlework>
Think of the horror stories of failed attempts.
<ldlework>
Make sure your nix-env is clean!!!! :P
<samueldr>
"oh no, my private key"
<ldlework>
hahaha
<ldlework>
That's why it is a challenge!
* ldlework
clacks his teeth.
<ldlework>
Afterall, this can happen at anytime, for no reason at all, to anyone!
* gchristensen
should really run a backup
<ldlework>
If I didn't hate CSS so much I'd make a challenge website
<samueldr>
you don't need CSS to make a website
<samueldr>
(being technically right is the best kind of right)
<gchristensen>
write up the website, link to a style.css, and have it be a 404 because it was deleted
<gchristensen>
sphalerite: do you know of one packaged?
<gchristensen>
ldlework: nice!
<gchristensen>
oh my word, python
<gchristensen>
I wasn't expecting python!
<samueldr>
nobody expects the spanish inquipython
<ldlework>
gchristensen: my primary is python
<ldlework>
looks like those are actually the same project or something
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<elvishjerricco>
A NixOS guest picked up the passthrough GPU! But the bootloader didn't; I had to use a serial console for that part, and if I didn't, then it wouldn't boot. But once stage 2 start, the screen turns on, and I can start up KDE
<elvishjerricco>
So the question is: Why doesn't the boot loader use the GPU? The answer to that would probably illuminate why the windows installer doesn't boot.
<sphalerite>
ooh sounds exciting!
<sphalerite>
elvishjerricco: Is this using legacy BIOS boot or EFI?
<elvishjerricco>
sphalerite: EFI + OVMF
<sphalerite>
and you did some VBIOS stuff?
<elvishjerricco>
sphalerite: Yea. Had to download the real ROM for the GPU and set the `romfile` option on qemu
<sphalerite>
ah
<elvishjerricco>
Though I guess I never tested it without that
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<gchristensen>
can I trick bash in to printing raw bits?
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<gchristensen>
"graham is obviously using the right tool for the job"++
<{^_^}>
job"'s karma got increased to 1
<ldlework>
gchristensen: what are you actually trying to do
<ldlework>
like the larger goal
<gchristensen>
I want to do something weird as a remote Nix builder, so I've chained dropbear to a shell script and am rnning NIX_SSHOPTS="-o StrictHostKeyChecking=false -o Port=2200" nix-build -E '(import <nixpkgs> {}).hello.overrideAttrs (x: { unpackPhase = "exit 1";})' --store $(pwd)/nixstore --builders 'grahamc@127.0.0.1' -vvvvv
<samueldr>
gchristensen: echo $'\01' | xxd
<gchristensen>
yes! thank you! :D
<samueldr>
(beware, there's a \n here)
<gchristensen>
oh man, maybe I shouldn't start this in bash.
<samueldr>
:3
<ldlework>
gchristensen: basically whatever the goal at hand is, that's true
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: printf "%s" $'\x00\x01\x02' is better :p
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<sphalerite>
gchristensen: nope, the null bites will byte you
<sphalerite>
oh right with echo, never mind me
<gchristensen>
it will?
<gchristensen>
but anyway, not actually perfect -- protocol mismatch with
<samueldr>
is it... ssh in bash?
<sphalerite>
it's a problem if you use $'\x00hello' because it just puts that in argv and, well, argv elemnts are null-terminated
<sphalerite>
but if you're using echo -e you don't have that problem
<samueldr>
you could also use `xxd` to "revert" a dump
<samueldr>
if you're fine with dependencies
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: also wat
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: maybe you want nix-daemon --stdio?
<gchristensen>
I don't actually :)
<sphalerite>
what *are* you doing?
<ldlework>
lol
<gchristensen>
I want to experiment with work-losing scheduling algorithsm
<gchristensen>
so my idea is this ... create a fake remote builder with a fake number of simultaneous jobs, like 9000 according to the /etc/nix/machines file
<gchristensen>
and all the features
<gchristensen>
nix will talk to it, and then this thing will redistribute the work to other, real builders
<samueldr>
some kind of chaos-monkey-but-for-builds?
<gchristensen>
one sec
<samueldr>
oh, I misread, I thought it would *lose* the jobs, making nix redistribute the work to others :)
<gchristensen>
work losing in that it kills partially completed jobs :) since they're idempotent it only loses the amount of time spent
<gchristensen>
the idea is it is unfair and prioritizes short jobs over long jobs. if you have hosts A,B,C it'll assign all jobs to host A first, and kill anything that takes >30s then reschedule those on hostB hostB kills anything >120s, and those get rescheduled on hostC. early hosts in this chain would be set to 1 core per job, and later servers could allocate more cores per job -- and then big jobs would naturally
<gchristensen>
"float to the top" of the powerful systems
<gchristensen>
but also, it could allocate cores per job per system, so the one host isn't necessarily all small jobs -- a big job on one host could take up multiple slots
<gchristensen>
sort of like the "consumable" features proposal in Nix, but automatic and part of the scheduler
<sphalerite>
gchristensen: oooh nice. I've been thinking about implementing a smarter build scheduler but didn't consider work-losing
<samueldr>
ah
<samueldr>
so you get trivially done stuff trivially done early
<gchristensen>
yeah!
<gchristensen>
and we wouldn't need to manually segregate one node for "Big Jobs" if they automatically percolate up and take up more resources per retry
<gchristensen>
also I think it'd be a fun project to learn erlang with, since it is basically all message and data streaming, and no hard work
<gchristensen>
anyway, so since I want to learn Erlang I figured I'd start it in bash because that is sensible, right