gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
<jasongrossman> ldlework: It's Saturday, actually.
<jasongrossman> ldlework: And I was pleased to see that you liked "Lessons in the Fundamentals of Go".
<ldlework> Kageyama is brutal :)
<colemickens> o_0
<colemickens> my home server's ssh host key changed?
<ldlework> lol
<colemickens> ah, wrong hostname and a wildcare subdomain. phew!
<ldlework> yikes
<ldlework> heh
<colemickens> My brain was battling "yikes" vs "where's the ID10T error at"...
pie___ has joined #nixos-chat
pie__ has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
snajpa has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
srk has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
<infinisil> Internet status: Some websites work and some don't????
<infinisil> I'm not sure why my ISP would mess around with that
<infinisil> Or if it's even my ISP or some router problem
<infinisil> Anyways, when I use vpn it works (as one would expect)
<infinisil> Oh also it's not just <example>.com not working, sometimes it is working, sometimes it takes forever to load, and sometimes it doesn't work at all
<infinisil> It's just weird!
<infinisil> I can't wait for the day when I'll finally have had no internet trouble for a week or so
<ottidmes> infinisil: I would suggest changing your router, but... :P
snajpa has joined #nixos-chat
<ottidmes> infinisil: did you try changing DNS to (Cloudflare) (Google)
srk has joined #nixos-chat
snajpa has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
<infinisil> ottidmes: Did both
srk has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
snajpa has joined #nixos-chat
srk has joined #nixos-chat
<ottidmes> infinisil: if you still have your old router at hand, maybe try that one again, so that you can determine if problems are router related or not? That is all I got I am afraid, good luck!
<infinisil> Yeah thanks
<infinisil> It's just really frustrating with these fancy consumer devices
<infinisil> They make it "super easy to use", yes
<infinisil> But what if there's a problem?
<infinisil> I'd rather have a linux system where I can get help online, debug stuff myself, have access to the source code, view logs of everything, run commands
<infinisil> I proposed to my family that I could try to set up a router myself (on NixOS ofcourse :)), but they didn't like that idea.. So here I am, trying to "debug" the problems I'm getting with this shit
<infinisil> </rant>
pie__ has joined #nixos-chat
<ottidmes> I get the feeling all to well, and even if you say: "go ahead, but know that I am not going to help if you run into problems", you know that they will not be able to solve those kind of problems, so they will ask you for help anyway, and it's family, so you don't say no...
<infinisil> Yeah lol
pie___ has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
<ottidmes> and if it all works out of the box, plug and play and all that, than sure, they can be great products, but we are thinking, more along the lines of, but what if there is a problem, how easy is it for me to resolve, we take that into account when we talk about "easy" (I get the framework feeling, frameworks are awesome when what you want to do fits nicely with the frameworks way of doing things, but as
<ottidmes> soon as you get something that does not fit, it can take a lot of effort to workaround the framework)
mdash has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
endformationage has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.3]
Synthetica has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
rawreraw has joined #nixos-chat
sir_guy_carleton has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.2]
<ldlework> my books list now differentiates between audiobooks, and now has a sample pdf/mp3 for each entry, and links to the store pages added too, http://ldlework.com/projects/media/books/read.html
<ldlework> I also eliminated all manually inputted data, and the source file literally only contains asin id numbers now: https://gist.github.com/dustinlacewell/7c50c99a4a8f43b62ccd62eea518e9f0
<ldlework> thoughts about Perkeep?
<jasongrossman> ldlework: Had to look it up. Looks really interesting. But unless it's something you want to put time into for fun, or for political reasons, I'd wait and see whether it becomes standard.
<ldlework> Hmm, it seems like you could put all the data you own into Perkeep, and if something better came along, simply take it out of Perkeep and put it into whatever new thing you like more.
<jasongrossman> ldlework: Yes. Good point. But. Even doing that is work. And I'd rate its chances of having compatible software in a few years (admittedly guessing with not much knowledge) as low.
<jasongrossman> ldlework: Hope I'm wrong. I do like it (so far).
<jasongrossman> Oh, we already have a derivation for it.
<ldlework> What do you mean 'the chances of having compatible software in a few years is low' ?
<ldlework> jasongrossman: also, imagine not having all your data in something like perkeep until something better comes along
<jasongrossman> ldlework: You know how most of the data formats that have ever been invented are now unreadable?
<ldlework> jasongrossman: they specifically used json so avoid that because archivability is a central concern
<jasongrossman> ldlework: Yes, that's good. I'm comparing data that currently is in files with formats known to be good for archiving (like text and jpeg) in directories on a stable file system.
<jasongrossman> ldlework: I'm probably going to play with it for fun though.
<jasongrossman> I'm now running it. Pretty exciting. :-)
<ldlework> jasongrossman: like for my website, i scrape a few web sources based on an input file (books and movies I've seen) and then I cache that data to json so next time I rebuild I don't have to do that. i could store movie and book covers and the metadata and so on in Perkeep, and then get things like immutability and versioning for free
<ldlework> vs, just hand-rolled json files on disk in git
<ldlework> i see your point though like, if i wanna view an image in perkeep, i can't just open my image viewer
<ldlework> unless FUSE gets involved I guess?
<jasongrossman> ldlework: I store my web site in plain text files in a non-hierarchical directory. :-) There are degrees of archivability. Anyway, I am enjoying perkeep, so I don't really want to talk anyone out of it.
<ldlework> i'm really just trying to reason about it because i'm unsure myself
<jasongrossman> Cool.
<jasongrossman> ldlework: I have absolute proof that it's not mature yet though. The web site's mascot is an owl, but when you open a local instance in a browser its mascot is a pig.
<ldlework> lol
<jasongrossman> You know there are professionals employed by the big libraries and stuff whose job it is to come to a consensus on archive standards? I have no idea what they think of this - maybe they like it. More likely, I'd have thought, they haven't heard of it.
<ldlework> the guy who worked at Sierra and created Leisure Suit Larry just sold all of the sole copies of the original source code to a bunch of Sierra games on ebay
<jasongrossman> I actually think paper is best. Which I'm sad about - I don't think paper is fun.
<jasongrossman> I was wondering what Sierra was! I thought they meant MacOS Sierra but the stories didn't seem to fit that.
<ldlework> in different auctions so unless the same person won them all its all spread out now
<jasongrossman> Why did he only sell copies and not the originals?
<ldlework> no he sold the originals, but in a bunch of different auctions
<jasongrossman> I asked him and he said they were copies. Don't worry. This is only a joke.
<jasongrossman> Because I had paper in my head from our other topic.
<ldlework> that stuff probably should have gone to some video game or other digital preservation institutions
<jasongrossman> Yes.
<ldlework> you.. asked him?
<jasongrossman> Not really.
<ldlework> hopefully it all gets leaked over time
<jasongrossman> I'm enjoying reading the perkeep docs. ldlework++
<{^_^}> ldlework's karma got increased to 5
<jasongrossman> ldlework: This is well thought through: "
<jasongrossman> Note also that any errors you get from my private blob server always delay for at least 200 ms to mask timing attacks that could otherwise reveal the existence or non-existence of a blob on my private server."
<colemickens> jasongrossman: how much data do you have in it? and/or do you have any data on how much bloat you're seeing?
<ldlework> i was just thinking that volitile files will waste diskspace because you probably don't need every version
<ldlework> would you ever keep source code in perkeep? :thinking-face:
<colemickens> I've wondered about that too. I think the data stores and data structures built on ipfs and dat are somewhat similar to the perkeep ideas.
<colemickens> My favorite thing about perkeep is the openidconnect style model for application data that Brad has talked about in the latest perkeep talk
<colemickens> you could tell a web app to store their data in your perkeep store and grant them a token with certain rights/quota.
<colemickens> I had problems with metadata bloat last time I tried though, not even with versions necessarily.
<ldlework> what did you try to use it for
<colemickens> probably took one of my tv show season backups and threw it into camlistore with recommended/default settings
<colemickens> s/camlistore/perkeep
<colemickens> but the resulting blob store was noticeably larger than the import, prohibitively so. but it was a while ago
<ldlework> i really like the idea that I would run my own data-store and you'd like give Facebook access to certain parts of your data, and the only Facebook could ever do is aggregate my content.
<colemickens> I want something like it as my data forever-home.
<colemickens> ldlework: cooler than that, with the sharing model in perkeep you could do a dynamic grant
<colemickens> and say grant my "plexclone" app access to any permanodes tagged "media"
<ldlework> i mean, storing video blob partials in json seems really inefficient...
<colemickens> well the blob data themselves aren't stored in json, but the metadata blobs themselves are json
<colemickens> and the smaller chunks/metadata blobs do get "packed" on disk.
<colemickens> iirc it's sorta like on the fly defrag for the small blobs
<ldlework> Also interesting is the idea of storing objects which are schemas for interpreting other objects
<ldlework> Or coming up with relational systems ontop..?
<ldlework> Ah I see.
<ldlework> That makes more sense.
<ldlework> I imagined 16 meg runs of byte data inside of json objects and i was likey O_O
<colemickens> these slides are great and have complete speaking notes too
<ldlework> i watched the related talk
<colemickens> someone should write a module for it :)
<ldlework> nixpkg?
<jasongrossman> colemickens: How much data do I have in what?
<colemickens> I may have read into "I'm enjoying it" too much, I thought maybe you'd been using it for something for a while. Perkeep that is.
<jasongrossman> colemickens: I see. I have one whole PDF file stored in perkeep.
<jasongrossman> colemickens: I'm enjoying it like I enjoy a movie.
* colemickens nods
<jasongrossman> Now I'm thinking the best thing about it might be indexing.
<jasongrossman> Like Spotlight on MacOS but better implemented.
<ldlework> google should offer free perkeep storage
<jasongrossman> ldlework: Yes, good idea.
<ldlework> they let me upload as many videos as i want
<ldlework> why not just blobs
<ldlework> Maybe we can somehow use youtube as a blob streaming service though
<ldlework> lol
__monty__ has joined #nixos-chat
<ldlework> need an imgur importer..
* ldlework wonders how to get perkeepd to run on :80
<ldlework> meh
<ldlework> jasongrossman: we should get FUSE going
<ldlework> i didn't get any 'cammount' command with the package in nixpkgs
<ldlework> ah pk-mount
rawreraw has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
<ldlework> aha i got it working
<ldlework> mkdir roots/images ~/pk
<ldlework> mkdir: cannot create directory ‘roots/images’: Input/output error
<ldlework> doh
<ldlework> no idea where i've turned wrong
<ldlework> tada
<ldlework> huh this is actually working
<jasongrossman> \o/
<ldlework> i just realized that would let you edit everything
<__monty__> It's password protected at least, even though it's http.
<ldlework> well i added that real quick after posting the link ;)
<__monty__> So this is not your personal pastebin?
<ldlework> __monty__: we've been screwing with Perkeep in here
<ldlework> i'm totally confused by it
<ldlework> trying to publish images i added
<ldlework> "For this to work you need a single permanode with an attribute “camliRoot” set to “mypics” which will serve as the root node for publishing."
* ldlework blinks
<ldlework> i don't really understand the data model
__monty__ is now known as toonn
toonn is now known as __monty__
<ldlework> neat ok I got the publishing working
<ldlework> but the main perkeepd proxies the publisher, and so
<ldlework> you have to either add auth on your backend and your publisher
<ldlework> or neither
<ldlework> so it doesn't work so well as a gallery...
<ldlework> oh it does
<ldlework> very cool
<ldlework> i can't wait to play with this more tomorrow
metastance has joined #nixos-chat
__monty__ has quit [Quit: leaving]
jasongrossman has quit [Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.1)]
alienpirate5 has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Jackneill has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
Jackneill has joined #nixos-chat
<gchristensen> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXIvoGRHEoU this guy takes big pieces of metal and makes slightly smaller, big pieces of metal
endformationage has joined #nixos-chat
metastance has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.3]
sir_guy_carleton has joined #nixos-chat
metastance has joined #nixos-chat
metastance has quit [Client Quit]
endformationage has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
endformationage has joined #nixos-chat
endformationage has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
endformationage has joined #nixos-chat
sir_guy_carleton has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.2]
Haskellfant has joined #nixos-chat
cocreature has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Haskellfant is now known as cocreature
* samueldr looks at the yak
<manveru> ldlework: pretty neat, trying perkeep now :)
<gchristensen> pet nix evaluator in rust https://github.com/jonas-schievink/nxt
endformationage has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.3]
kisik21 has left #nixos-chat ["WeeChat 2.4-dev"]
<colemickens> yesssss
<joepie91> gchristensen: subscribe subscribe subscribe
<gchristensen> :)
* joepie91 mashes 'star' button
<gchristensen> if y'all want to do like a 24 pull request thing for ofborg, I'd love that
<ldlework> I'm grey
<ldlework> gf is orange
<gchristensen> it isn't great code, it has low hanging fruit to make it much better
<joepie91> gchristensen: I'll probably have a look soon(tm)
<gchristensen> aww ldlework :)
<ldlework> dang it!!!
<ldlework> lol
<joepie91> ldlework: who's the announcer?
<ldlework> the guy who made it
<joepie91> oh, is this like an online-play thing?
<ldlework> you can signup and play right now
<ldlework> yes
<joepie91> huh, neat
<ldlework> took like 20 seconds to signup, just email verify
<ldlework> dang it!!!!
<ldlework> fuck yeah!
<ldlework> lol
<ldlework> noooo
<gchristensen> anyone learning a new lang with advent of code?
<ldlework> did that start?
<ldlework> I'm thinking about Rust
<joepie91> ldlework: one of us, one of us, one of us...
<joepie91> more seriously, we have cookies
<colemickens> Do people surf on `nixos-unstable-small`? The one time I tried, libvirt was broken and I've never tried again.
<joepie91> insert joke here about libvirt being in a perpetually broken state for everybody everywhere
<ldlework> lmao
<ldlework> infinity gauntlet on the field