<hexa->
explaining functional programming with factorio examples
<hexa->
s/with/using/
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<bbigras>
nice
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<siraben>
hexa-: heh I was about to post that!
<siraben>
cc supersandro20005
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<supersandro2000>
siraben: why did you ping supersandro20005?
<siraben>
oops my element client autocompleted the wrong person, heh
<siraben>
meant to ping you obviously
<supersandro2000>
it should auto change the nick
<supersandro2000>
matrix being matrix 😂
<supersandro2000>
but I know
<supersandro2000>
already looked at the article
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<siraben>
though myself I think category theory is more motivating once you see groups, rings, vector spaces, topological spaces, etc. then the abstractions and their laws do appear quite natural
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<supersandro2000>
bless you
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<siraben>
who sneezed?
<slack1256>
me
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<lovesegfault>
I'm in nix jail
<aleph->
Is that like super jail?
<aleph->
:p
<lovesegfault>
pretty much :P
<lovesegfault>
it's when you get absolutely intractable errors :D
<aleph->
Heheheh
<aleph->
Okay wonder how much downloading a channel would run me...
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<siraben>
lovesegfault: what's a nix jail?
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<DigitalKiwi>
probably something on freebsd
<supersandro2000>
I just noticed that a haskel program is using 1T of virtual ram
<Taneb>
That's how GHC's runtime does things
<leons>
yeah, it's a common occasion when using things such as git-annex
<Taneb>
Nothing really to worry about
<leons>
yes. The linux kernel is very efficient in granting virtual memory without actually allocating too many pages
<supersandro2000>
I thought so
<supersandro2000>
I don't have near one TB of RAM
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<DigitalKiwi>
turns out it only takes 1TB of virtual ram to hold infinite lists
<__monty__>
That's just GHC oversubscribing (not sure about the terminology anymore) virtual memory to avoid any penalties when growing it.
<V>
overcommitting is the word
<__monty__>
Ah, yes, thanks. V++
<{^_^}>
V's karma got increased to 12
<V>
it just means they're shifting the obligation to add memory maps to the kernel, which means that some (not entirely) arbitrary process gets murdered when the system runs out of memory, instead of them having to deal with ENOMEM
<V>
(yes, the kernel would add memory maps without overcommit, but in that case it guarantees the process will have sufficient memory for every allocation it makes, as opposed to pretending it does under the hope that it won't use so much that the kernel has to kill something to free up space)
<__monty__>
Thanks, didn't know the details any more.
<V>
I'm somewhat conflicted as to whether it's generally a good or bad thing; I can definitely see the use, but it also reduces predictability/robustness
<__monty__>
In case you actually go over the 1 TB threshold?
<V>
well, it's more like. browsers do this stuff as well.
<V>
fork() is also totally broken without overcommit, as the child process needs exactly as much memory as the parent has (there's vfork for this, but not everyone knows/uses it)
<V>
I used to have overcommit disabled on a desktop system and browsers would just outright crash, even when they could have presumably freed cached stuff
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<supersandro2000>
I don't know what people have about chrome eating ram
<supersandro2000>
it has 8GB and now it crashes rather than using more
<supersandro2000>
🙃
<eyJhb>
Emantor: ohh cool! What kind of devices do you make? Do you have anything to do with embedded systems that use SIM Cards for communication?
<Emantor>
eyJhb: We do not build devices ourselves, but provide consulting services for people building devices based on Linux. Embedded Linux can be found in a lot of places, from industrial climate control systems to embedded entertainment devices.
<Emantor>
And yes, some of our customers have devices with SIM cards. Lots of LTE modems are supported natively or only require a single kernel change to be detected. Thanks to Microsoft and their MBIM requirement.
<AMG>
Microsoft is trying a new solution for the persistent “would you like to allow notifications from this website” requests that you see across the internet: crowdsourcing data on which ones people block and which ones they allow. According to a blog post today, Microsoft is calling this feature adaptive notification requests, and the company is rolling it out in Edge 88 after it received
<eyJhb>
Emantor: Nice! We are currently doing a semester project, where we have to work with "somewhat" embedded devices, that gather powergrid information, which is sent using a modem :D Or rather, need to make some diagnostic tools for debugging why the stop sending stuff...
<eyJhb>
Unsure how much can be done. But embedded devices are cool
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<Emantor>
The devices are running Linux as well? Could be a lot of stuff all over the stack. Remember to check your assumptions ;-)
<eyJhb>
We are looking at their dev setups, so it is a Raspberry Pi with a modem attached to it + a meassuring device. But the "real" systems are just the meassuring device and a sim card plobbed into it, but I would assume they are Linux!
<tilpner>
Identifying the right assumptions to check tends to be the crucial part
<eyJhb>
But yeah, currently we are doing the system definition, and then we need to do FMEA on that system (or the scope)
<eyJhb>
*anyone that has some nice things for FMEA are welcome* :D
* Emantor
hadn't heard of FMEA until reading the wikipedia article.
<eyJhb>
Is any of the stuff you ( Emantor ) do opensource?
<eyJhb>
gchristensen: I really feel that. I have not tried sitting up a mail server since I was 12, until I tried nixos-mailserver some time ago! It is WONDERFUL!
<gchristensen>
nice
<eyJhb>
However Hotmail + Gmail do not like me...
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<eyJhb>
Also, if anyone finds the actual FMEA procedures for Apollo feel free to ping me
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<hexa->
eyJhb: labgrid is :)
<Emantor>
eyJhb: I work for Pengutronix, https://www.pengutronix.de/en/index.html has an open source tab with all our projects. I am one of the maintainers for labgrid and otherwise I have been contributing to OP-TEE.
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<infinisil>
> timeTo mars
<{^_^}>
"1 day, 1 hour, 30 minutes, 16 seconds"
<gchristensen>
whew
<infinisil>
OH damn, I have a meeting then
<gchristensen>
cancel it
<infinisil>
Time to move that :)
<pie_>
lol
<pie_>
just make watching it the meeting
<aleph->
lol
<aleph->
pie_: Good idea
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<veleiro>
srk: thanks that module actually made me understand mailservers much more, especially in the docs they list the way to get a perfect score
<infinisil>
I do have this perfect score, but unfortunately my mails still get rejected by some google mail servers
<veleiro>
that's the story with using nix for me too. it simplifies complex systems in a way that I can better understand it all
<veleiro>
at least abstractly
<infinisil>
There's a good guide out there which I want to go through at some point to have my mails not be rejected anymore, trying to find it..
<veleiro>
cant you just be marked as spam at some point, by google mails and that's it?
<infinisil>
I doubt there's nothing you can do then
<samueldr>
the better teachers/profressors I had were those that used out of the box methods to present some of the concepts
<samueldr>
but in the end it was still about getting to a simple formula you had to remember by heart
<samueldr>
I would have rather seen harder tests, with open books, than being punished by having too much to remember already
<samueldr>
since anyway, most of the time open book won't help if you haven't learned the thing
<gchristensen>
right
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<eyJhb>
Luckily all mine are open book...
<eyJhb>
But not all have the help of calculators, etc.
<eyJhb>
And some do, and you are allowed to use your computer + CAD stuff, but most of us used woldframalpha. BUt that was until I found out about Sympy <3
<__monty__>
I far preferred the ones that banned calculators.
<__monty__>
Just meant the calculations weren't too hard to do in your head.
<eyJhb>
What my professors can do in their head, and what we could do was... not the same to say the least
<__monty__>
Ime usually students can do more mental arithmetic.
<samueldr>
I'm totally terrible at simple arithmetics in my mind
<gchristensen>
yeah, I can'at do it
<samueldr>
which, after having listened to someone's experience with dyslexia, is one of the forms of how it can manifest (and in their locale, being diagnosed with dyslexia one thing like that is not enough)
<samueldr>
I wouldn't think I have dyslexia, in these conditions, as pretty much it's the only thing I experience, and even then, I'm not even sure it's at a level it would "count" (hah)
<samueldr>
an uh, there's also a link in the show notes about a talk he did about it
<gchristensen>
dyscalculia?
<samueldr>
it may be something about being in the UK, and something that dyslexia is not _just_ about reading
<samueldr>
I'd have to fish for the right minute in the podcast
<mcint>
for mental arithmetic, i find helpful that i have a bag of tricks, like rules for some numbers (e.g. 9), and divide-and-conquer sub-algorithms
<samueldr>
around 12:41, good thing it was at the beginning of steve's bit
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<__monty__>
Hmm, I didn't learn the tables by rote either.
<__monty__>
Seems to have always been an advantage with mental arithmetic though.
<__monty__>
Because it helps with all of it. Rather than just the few pairs that fit the tables.
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<veleiro>
when did NixOS become really usable? it seems its popularity is growing quickly
<veleiro>
just nix systems in general really
<__monty__>
Quite a few years back I'd say.
<__monty__>
Though it's not ready for prime time yet, imo.
<gchristensen>
2014 is when its growth really shifted iirc
<__monty__>
UX still needs work.
<joepie91>
I've noticed a shift in the past 2 years
<joepie91>
where it starts being mentioned fairly reliably in eg. comment threads about deployment etc
<veleiro>
yeah well i think flakes are incredibly useful and this intensional store stuff, flood gates will open when this type of upgrades settle
<veleiro>
just cant believe nixos is more than a decade old
<veleiro>
i dont imagine running my own hydra instance without the intensional store model
<gchristensen>
nix's growth has really been a slow burn thing
<gchristensen>
kinda cool
<veleiro>
hard to believe it was discussed in the original whitepaper!
<__monty__>
Avoid success at all costs!
<gchristensen>
not here!
<__monty__>
You're probably not bracketing correctly.
<gchristensen>
I'm likely just delusional
<__monty__>
Avoid (success at all costs)!
<veleiro>
yep, because once a piece of technology gets so much weight behind it, it will never change, too much at stake, too many huge entities involved in it.. like bitcoin
<samueldr>
gchristensen: (finally came back to what I was talking about) the talk from steve mould also goes in the same direction AFAICT https://youtu.be/iAcvYqDKznE
<supersandro2000>
cole-h: I want a better progress bar that does not suck