<ldlework>
it's very hard to do multiple trades with covered cash unless you're trading a fraction of your portolio
<ldlework>
futures look promising though
<abathur>
sphalerite: I was already picking at a few bits (you weren't the only one); probably just marginal improvements given your exact comments but still curious what you think
<samueldr>
abathur: I assume it shouldn't look like that then, right?
<energizer>
i have a user service running on a timer. journalctl lists it by the filepath in the nix store instead of the unit file name. how can i fix that?
<abathur>
ah, I probably stepped on a style light mode needed; not sure about adding it in the first place in part for this reason :)
<abathur>
no, I'm not a monster
<energizer>
er i guess that's a #nixos question
<samueldr>
energizer: yeah, that would be more adequate
<samueldr>
abathur: indeed you have a prefers-color-scheme: light somewhere in there
<abathur>
I added a rule and forgot to mirror it in the light style, I think
<samueldr>
when you'll have that fixed, I guess the last issue will be one that's not yours to fix... where font thickness is an impurity from the operating system and not defined by the specs
<samueldr>
like, how it actually gets rendered
<samueldr>
you always can *feel* when a mac user wants to use a thin font style, as it gets a bit too thin on other platforms (macOS has a heavy-handed approach to drawing fonts)
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<abathur>
I'll just disable the light theme attempt for now, it looks like I broke more than one rule for it and I'm not sure enough that it's necessary to invest in it
<samueldr>
light theme / dark theme implementation in browsers mainly suck anyway
<samueldr>
at least in OS that don't have a light mode / dark mode switch
<abathur>
yeah, it was a whim to try
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<abathur>
also, you're projecting a little on the font (but, yes, the font rendering is pretty night-and-day different)
<abathur>
courier's at the top of my stack, but at least on my nixos system it seems to be using courier new
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<Gaelan>
Any advice on managing shell.nix files for projects where we can't check them in?
<lovesegfault>
Gaelan: add them to .gitignore
<lovesegfault>
If the project has no nix at all just add "*.nix" to .gitignore and bam, problem solved
<Gaelan>
but then I at least need to check in a gitignore with shell.nix (maybe actually workable for this case, but not for, say, an OSS project)
<cole-h>
Why "can't" you check them in?
<Gaelan>
I'm working on it with other people who don't use nix - I guess I could just check it in with "this is a file for my weird workflow, everyone else ignore it" but I'd rather not
<lovesegfault>
I doubt someone will be against an addition to their .gitignore :P
<lovesegfault>
even a FOSS project
<cole-h>
I don't personally see the problem. That said: yeah, .gitignore, or even put the shell.nix some other place memorable and then `nix-shell /path/to/shell.nix` when you need to?
<lovesegfault>
if someone made me a PR just adding something to .gitignore and they justified it "hey I use this tool, adding it here so it makes my life easier when I make PRs" I'll just merge it
<lovesegfault>
it's 0-cost
<Gaelan>
ohh, .git/info/exclude does the same thing as gitignore but isn't checked in
<lovesegfault>
right,
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<ldlework>
sitting down to do some python dev
<ldlework>
once again baffled how to get started with nix
<energizer>
poetry2nix
<energizer>
well, poetry. then poetry2nix
<ldlework>
energizer: is there a way to install a specific version of a python package from nixpkgs, no right, because it's all fixed
<energizer>
you can override
<energizer>
poetry is my preference, but if you want to not use it, jonringer has a video tutorial
<energizer>
on buildPython*
<energizer>
on youtube
<ldlework>
i hate this, i barely had enough motivation to do this thing, such a barrier and creativity killer
<energizer>
what do you want to install?
<energizer>
let's go in the other channel, they dont like it when we do support in here
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<aleph->
Lord I'm beginning to really hate seeing .then() statements >_>
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<aleph->
Should also get around to setting a nix store up at home at some point.
<aleph->
Since I'm not immediately seeing anything is there an easy way to pull X number of derivs from one of the global stores to a newly set up nix store?
<siraben>
ldlework: you could overrideAttrs it, no?
<aleph->
siraben: Heh not a big Haskeller but if only. Trying to figure out how to adequately get my data structure out of this mapped promised so I can construct some HTML
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<siraben>
aleph-: you could use async/await
<aleph->
I probably should just move to async await.
<ldlework>
async/await is do-notation for the promise monad
<siraben>
indeed
<aleph->
Been trying my hardest not to till I get around to converting this code base fully
<aleph->
Eyep it is indeed.
<siraben>
you can mix and match async/await with promise chaining no?
<ldlework>
.then is useful when you want to handle some promise but not block subsequent code
<siraben>
using .then(x => ...) is like writing `>>= (\x ...)` all the time in Haskell, heh
<aleph->
siraben: You can yeah. I own this code base now So I should just do it.
<gchristensen>
infinisil: let me know when you're around :)
<siraben>
NinjaTrappeur: yay, that project is awesome
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<NinjaTrappeur>
siraben: definitely!
<NinjaTrappeur>
The hard cut at the end of the talks is so rude ><
<__monty__>
FOSDEM? Agreed.
<__monty__>
As an IRC user I'd also like if it was clearer what channels exist.
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<etu>
NinjaTrappeur: I think it's a bot that does the switching.
<ehmry>
yea, they should have run the chat infra on IRC or xmpp rather than depend on that matrix trash
<gchristensen>
huh ... using wget's spider options skips pages which have no outgoing links ...
<eyJhb>
ehmry: Matrix works just fine, more about execution of the whole thing :)
<eyJhb>
But yeah, IRC is easier to just do
<ehmry>
eyJhb: no matrix doesn't work fine, I think you just don't have experience using IRC
<gchristensen>
ehmry: it is okay for people to like matrix
<ehmry>
not if it makes unecessary problems for me
<gchristensen>
sorry, it isn't up to you what people like
<eyJhb>
ehmry: I have using IRC for the past 10+ years, I do have experience in it, and I still think that Matrix has its place :p
<eyJhb>
But it does have it shortcommings, but not knowing which rooms to enter is not really a matrix thing
<ehmry>
nah, the matrix room url format is bad, the saving grace is that there is basically only one matrix provider to connect to
<NinjaTrappeur>
etu: yes it is. Sadly it seems like there's no notification for the speaker, cutting them mid-sentence when time's over :(
<eyJhb>
@room:server.com ? Seems quite simple
<etu>
I tried joining #misc:fosdem.org but it didn't work, idk why, I can see the distributions room on the same matrix server :p
<ehmry>
@room:server.com (#room:server.com?) is looks like something between NIH, not gonna reading URI RFCs, and cargoculting twitter
<eyJhb>
The only reason IRC is easy, is if everything is on the same server. If I find something that is not on Freenode, then I either 1. Drop it, and cry 2. Try to find a webclient for it.
<ehmry>
everything is not on the same server, you don't notice IRC federation because it just works
<ehmry>
matrix is for people that can't learn how to connect to a second server after 10+ years
<gchristensen>
ehmry: I've gently asked you to stop, but I' mean it: stop.
<__monty__>
You don't need to use matrix to join fosdem channels, btw. It's just not clear which irc channels exist, there's no central list afaict.
<__monty__>
The thing I love about Matrix is they at least make an honest best effort to "federate" with IRC.
<__monty__>
So much nicer than Discord or Gitter before the takeover.
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<siraben>
Without Matrix I couldn't be connected to Freenode 24/7
<siraben>
unless I set up my own bouncer
<eyJhb>
siraben: I run waaay too many things atm. just waiting for SPACES! Then I can integrate everything into Matrix
<siraben>
What will spaces do?
<__monty__>
Not being connected 24/7 is a feature to some people : )
<eyJhb>
Give me the ability to put everything IRC into its own space, as to not clutter everything up
<eyJhb>
Ie. I plan to bridge as much as I can with Matrix (Slack, Discord, etc.)
<siraben>
__monty__: Perhaps. But when I started using IRC in high school it was annoying to be disconnected every time I closed the lid of my laptop, and lacked the time to learn devops
<siraben>
yeah can we just bridge everything heh I dislike having to use separate messaging apps all the time
<eyJhb>
siraben: But you can! With Matrix! Messenger, Signal, Slack, Discord, IRC, etc.! <3 :D
<siraben>
<3 indeed
<eyJhb>
Currently I am doing Slack + Messenger with Bitlbee, which is also quite nice
<__monty__>
Matrix can bridge with Signal?
<eyJhb>
But I really miss having a good mobile application for IRC.. And I want to move away from the Messenger app completely on my phone, and only use a single thing
<siraben>
I use Element client for IRC on an iPhone and Android (it works better on Android)
<eyJhb>
Same, however mautrix-facebook is a little unstable and will disconnect from the MQTT stuff a lot....
<eyJhb>
I should try the latest master instead
<siraben>
and finally Gitter has been acquired by Element
<siraben>
Gitter was awful both on web and mobile, why would anyone use it
<__monty__>
I think what people liked about it is being able to log in with github?
<eyJhb>
What will happen to Gitter now then?
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<__monty__>
It's just subsumed by Matrix afaik.
<siraben>
Gitter will become a Matrix client
<ashkitten>
yeah gitter has a proper matrix bridge with virtual users now, that's the first step of the transition
<ashkitten>
now they're working on porting all gitter features to matrix
<ashkitten>
have yall seen all the new bridges popping up?
<siraben>
where?
<ashkitten>
there's an imessage bridge now, even
<siraben>
IIRC that's been around for some time (months?)
<ashkitten>
you need a mac to run it on, or in the future an old iphone to leave plugged in and running
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<infinisil>
gchristensen: o/
<gchristensen>
ready? =)
<__monty__>
Yes, prepared my popcorn. Hold on to your seats, ladies and gentlemen.
<eyJhb>
Curious, what is happening?
<__monty__>
Probably interesting questions given the participants of the dialog : )
<infinisil>
gchristensen: Same port, 5671?
<gchristensen>
yea
<gchristensen>
if it goes down for a few minutes no big deal
<infinisil>
Ready :)
<gchristensen>
fingers crossed
<infinisil>
{^_^}: See ya on the other side
<gchristensen>
deploying
<infinisil>
deploying
<infinisil>
deployed
<gchristensen>
still going :')
<eyJhb>
They are taking over the world with {^_^}
<gchristensen>
migrating {^_^} to a new rabbitmq instance
<eyJhb>
Lets hope the operation is succssfull!
<infinisil>
gchristensen: What are you using for deployment nowadays?
<gchristensen>
nixops for my personal network
<gchristensen>
morph for ofborg and another small network
<infinisil>
I see
<__monty__>
eyJhb: And we were here to see it \o/
<eyJhb>
Have you heard about our lord and saviour, nixus ?
<eyJhb>
Yes! :D
<infinisil>
Hehe
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<infinisil>
There he goes!
<eyJhb>
wait, is ^^a he?
<infinisil>
Oh good question
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<eyJhb>
I got very much into the he and shes of things, as we have had a spanish/french exchange student.
<eyJhb>
Equations are a he!
<gchristensen>
ok that is a good start
<eyJhb>
Also, {^_^} welcome back!
<gchristensen>
infinisil: maybe restart your end?
<infinisil>
It's constantly being restarted, though no luck: Exception: ConnectionClosedException Abnormal "Handshake failed. Please check the RabbitMQ logs for more information" (this was also displayed before you deployed)
<gchristensen>
hmm
<aleph->
Other things I need to do. Learn nixops and stop using a weird combination of git/scp/ssh to do deploys.
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<gchristensen>
infinisil: AMQPLAIN login refused: user 'ircbot-infinisil' - invalid credentials
<gchristensen>
did you update the password from the encrypted data I sent you?
<infinisil>
Yeah, the password is $(uuid) :P
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<infinisil>
Hmm
<gchristensen>
hrm is right. let's DM P
<eyJhb>
aleph-: Just throwing it out there, Nixus is also really easy and nice. I use it to manage 5 servers + my router :)
<aleph->
Hmm think I looked at it.
<aleph->
Ah right infinisil's util
<infinisil>
:D
<eyJhb>
I think infinisil is slowly starting a cult
<infinisil>
gchristensen: Feb 07 16:58:45 protos nixbot[8343]: [ThreadId 1] Exception: ChannelClosedException Abnormal "NOT_FOUND - no exchange 'exchange-messages' in vhost 'ircbot'"
<gchristensen>
hrm.
<gchristensen>
a little bit of state that wasn't created automatically :)
<philipp[m]1>
Ewww state!
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<infinisil>
,ping
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<gchristensen>
a bit on the uptake there
<infinisil>
,ping
<{^_^}>
pong
<philipp[m]1>
\o/
<gchristensen>
opa!
<infinisil>
Ayyy, welcome back!
<gchristensen>
not so baid
<gchristensen>
and I don't have to run rabbitmq anymore =)
<infinisil>
Nice, I declare success \o/
<gchristensen>
oh cool the github notifs work too, man, great success
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<eyJhb>
> builtins.readFile("/etc/hosts")
<{^_^}>
access to path '/etc/hosts' is forbidden in restricted mode
<__monty__>
Is resholve ready for use in packaging for nixpkgs?
<gchristensen>
it is packaged in nixpkgs for use, yea
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<aleph->
And finally back
<aleph->
Stupid net outages
<aleph->
So qq in a nixops nix definition. Can I just set a machine def to a set of imported nix files rather then defining it inline?
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<sphalerite>
aleph-: → #nixos
<abathur>
__monty__ the most-likely roadblock, in my experience so far, is that it doesn't really handle flags yet (I haven't quite decided how...), and a few of the commands it is resolving arguments to have vaguely-common flag forms, `command -v <blah>` probably being the most-common
<elvishjerricco>
Sure seems like it, because those ones actually work :P
<pie_>
Ive got an old machine on 2.3.6 and its complaining about the cache ssl key not being ok? where did i pebcak?
<pie_>
unable to download ... ssl peer certificate or ssh remote key not ok
<pie_>
its probably a cacert issue but i have no idea how
<pie_>
it explodes anyway with the nix ssl variable set
<pie_>
doh the date is set wrong
<elvishjerricco>
I really wish I understood qemu's command line... I added a network device and the vm started with none of the storage devices...
<elvishjerricco>
Oh no I just goofed it
<pie_>
is there no nixos-20.09 branch or do i just not know how to update git's branch list
<pie_>
well there is definitely a branch for it..
<srk>
release-20.09?
<srk>
elvishjerricco: I want to try some of the declarative qemu vms PoC out there. maybe nixos test machinery could work for persistant deployments hmm
<pie_>
the issue is i cant tell how to get git to update the branch list from the remote
<srk>
git fetch --all ?
<pie_>
git fetch --all might do it
<pie_>
yeah im trying that right now. that sounds like it will get _Everything_ though?
<srk>
git fetch origin release-20.09 ? :)
<pie_>
hm well it was fast enough, so ok..
<pie_>
well that still didnt do it
<srk>
maybe not good if it's not there but there is a trick to fetch just a single branch. useful for linux
<pie_>
git branch --list -a doesnt list anything past 20.03
<pie_>
wait thats remotes/channels/...
<srk>
nah, that should work and you can do git checkout <branch_name> FETCH_HEAD
<srk>
oops - git branch <branch_name> FETCH_HEAD
<pie_>
ok i had a remote for nixpkgs-channels, no surprise there because thats not what i was updating
<srk>
yep, that was deprecated some time ago
<pie_>
yeah
<pie_>
so how do i get it to show all the branches on the repo proper? (which is what my origin points to)
<pie_>
it only lists 6 local branches from that
<srk>
git ls-remote origin
<srk>
I'm mostly using git branch -lav to list all branches
<pie_>
ok i was doing git fetch origin/nixos-20.09 instead of with a space....
<samueldr>
git's UX is full of weird inconsistencies like that :(
<pie_>
ok so if i have a checkout that was 20.03 but now i want to "upgrade" it to 20.09 how do i do that
<pie_>
git merge shows conflicts
<samueldr>
the branches have diverged a lot
<samueldr>
do you care about changes in your checkout?
<pie_>
aha.
<pie_>
i guess i shoud have been cherry picking
<samueldr>
uh?
<srk>
or track master ;)
<samueldr>
that depends what pie_ wants to do :)
<aleph->
Okay I have chili cooking, time to figure out nixops finally.
<aleph->
And wrong channel yet again heh
<pie_>
i had a branch and i merged 20.03 into it
<samueldr>
depends, right channel for cooking... even just stating things :)
<pie_>
how do i find my commits before the merge? :'D
<srk>
abort!
* samueldr
dips out
<pie_>
reflog seems to have it
<samueldr>
I find git frustrating even though I have learned to cope with it :)
<pie_>
srk: oh i already aborted the new one
<pie_>
something still isnt right
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<hexa->
github seems to have issues
<hexa->
>> Failed to load latest commit information.
<samueldr>
if it's to reach a lower number up there in the tabs, while alienating some users or developers, that would do it
<eyJhb>
Is there any positive spin on it?
<samueldr>
yes
<samueldr>
putting myself in the shoes of a project maintainer
<samueldr>
those numbers can be crushing when they never go down
<samueldr>
and it may be that there is nothing that can be done for a lot of those issues
<samueldr>
lack of information for a vague issue
<samueldr>
PR being out of date, needing to be updated
<samueldr>
the main issue here is that github is a poor approximation of a project management software
<samueldr>
there is no way to "soft close" a PR with, let's say "needs updating"
<eyJhb>
I would rather just label them as stale then
<samueldr>
still a poor approximation
<eyJhb>
It is
<eyJhb>
But active and stale -> might be able to be picked up
<eyJhb>
Closed and stale -> fuck that
<samueldr>
that's the main issue here, github is not a project management software, and it will, by design, not interact with any
<eyJhb>
Ie. the /nix/store issue would be closed then
<samueldr>
those numbers up top could also be removed
<samueldr>
it serves not much purpose
<samueldr>
especially given things like stale bots
<samueldr>
oh, look, 8 issues, this project is healthy!
<samueldr>
999999 issues closed as stale
<__monty__>
I'm divided on that.
<samueldr>
(I'm divided on that too)
<samueldr>
open/closed is not enough states to represent the nuances of software development
<samueldr>
but here we are, stuck with that
<samueldr>
even just closed, without thinking about staleness is terrible
<samueldr>
why is it closed?
<samueldr>
unactionable?
<samueldr>
solved?
<samueldr>
invalid?
<__monty__>
Yeah but in this context, too many open PRs/issues do correlate with inactivity.
<samueldr>
I'm not sure
<__monty__>
Otoh, I maintain a project where we have trouble getting things merged because most contributions are fairly drive-by and not tested well.
<samueldr>
yeah
<samueldr>
that's nuance
<__monty__>
So I'm on the receiving end of "Hurr durr, wth, this issue is a year old!" comments.
<samueldr>
it is a situation where there is no good answer
<samueldr>
(about stale bot)
<samueldr>
because the good answer is about a question that wasn't asked
<samueldr>
"is the tooling adequate" -> no
<samueldr>
my initial response here was quite dismissive ot the maintainer's aspect, but still stands true... and I totally get also why maintainers want to do that
<aleph->
Been meaning to check out the infra track
<bbigras>
I don't know. The live thing was super early for me. At like 5:30 am so I'm waiting for all the recording to go up
<manveru[m]>
not much i was excited about... mostly the usual k8s, ansible, pulp, consul stuff, not that i was expecting much
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<elvishjerricco>
Welp. Just learned that the tools previously used to support nvidia gpus on macos no longer work, so this whole thing was for nothing.
<energizer>
which programming languages will execute independent operations in parallel by default? e.g. `print(factorial(20), file="a.txt"); print(sum(random(10000), file="b.txt")` the calculations will happen simultaneously
<aleph->
manveru[m]: Heck is pulp anyway?
<infinisil>
energizer: Not fully independent actually, because the first could fail, or some other code could depend on b.txt appearing after a.txt
<energizer>
infinisil: some other code?
<infinisil>
Yeah, like a file locking mechanism or so
<energizer>
yeah i want a runtime that doesn't make assumptions like that
<manveru[m]>
aleph-: not sure... some stuff on top of ansible for deb/rpm management i think
<aleph->
Ah, huh
<aleph->
Seems unneeded but meh
<__monty__>
aleph-: VHDL and VeriLog? : >
<__monty__>
Maybe Futhark? It's heavily focused on parallel programming I believe.
<infinisil>
jtojnar: Yeah but that's explicit parallelism, I think energizer is asking for implicit one, though that doesn't seem trivial to define
<infinisil>
Fundamentally you can use `pseq` in haskell to do parallel pure evaluation
<infinisil>
pseq is like seq, but it evaluates both arguments in parallel
<infinisil>
And if everything is parallel by default, I think that would be super expensive
<jtojnar>
time for template haskell? 🤣
<infinisil>
E.g. `1 + 1` evaluates both sides in parallel
<infinisil>
I guess you could build a strict evaluator that evaluates all arguments to functions in parallel when it is called
<infinisil>
So `f a b` would be 'a `pseq` b `pseq` f a b'
<infinisil>
Well it's neither strict nor lazy then. It's something inbetween
<infinisil>
But that sounds interesting
<infinisil>
But then you have the problem of evaluation order
<infinisil>
If both a and b fail to evaluate, which error does `f a b` produce?
<elvishjerricco>
The spark pool in haskell is pretty quick; obviously you wouldn't want to spark at *every* two argument function, but "most" would probably perform quite well if you could reasonably define "most"
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<__monty__>
It would definitely not be lazy afaiu. Non-strict maybe, depending on things like error handling.
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<__monty__>
A significant problem would be bottoms, especially infinite recursion. Would you simply accumulate threads looping infinitely not producing anything useful?
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<infinisil>
Good point
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<gchristensen>
isn't there a super easy way to pass jq a bunch of arguments and then get it as an object in stdout?
<eyJhb>
gchristensen: Ehmm... What do you mean/what is the end goal/examples?
<gchristensen>
nice to see people have opiniosn about it
<infinisil>
I've been thinking a lot about tagging systems in general
<infinisil>
Especially with music
<infinisil>
But it's really tricky. There's tags which can imply other tags, tags that contradict others, tags that are a combination of multiple, etc.
<infinisil>
And I'm not sure if there's a better way than just entering these relationships manually
<infinisil>
Though I'm thinking about a system that infers these relationships
<infinisil>
(so I guess that would be better than manual)
<infinisil>
Like, if 99% of songs tagged with "shimazu aya" (an enka singer), also have the "enka" tag, then the system can infer the "enka" tag for pretty much al future "shimazu aya" ones
<infinisil>
The more tags you add, the smarter it gets
<infinisil>
I'm also thinking: Instead of having to opt-into tags, what if you'd have to opt-out instead
<infinisil>
So by default, every item in the library has *all* the tags. You then want to listen to e.g. the "enka" tag, so it plays all songs that still have that tag
<infinisil>
But whenever you spot a song that's not enka, you remove that tag
<infinisil>
Therefore you can relatively easily tag your music library, without having to know all the tags that can exist
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<pie_>
infinisil: are tags turing complete
<infinisil>
No lol
<pie_>
are you sure
<neeasade>
<infinisil> But whenever you spot a song that's not enka, you remove that tag
<neeasade>
FWIW, this is kinda how I currently do it
<infinisil>
Oh nice, what's your tooling? How well does it work?
<neeasade>
I use search terms to generate playlists against a local collection -- but some terms like "house" (for house music) are too generic, so I have an alias to remove the current song from the currentplaylist
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<pie_>
nice
<infinisil>
neeasade: How well is it working?
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<infinisil>
Any problems you're seeing?
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<neeasade>
I'm very content with it -- been about 2 years with this approach. main issue is that I can't apply this to streaming services/lug it around, but I don't do that much anyway -- I just had to establish the habit of slamming the youtube-dl button when I heard something I like on the internet