gchristensen changed the topic of #nixos-chat to: NixOS but much less topical || https://logs.nix.samueldr.com/nixos-chat
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<averell> to be fair, for infinite recursion the position doesn't really matter...
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<eyJhb> And then Gitlab came down
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<clever> gchristensen: do you happen to know if `dot` can generate a graph where some of the nodes are within a box?
<clever> for example, having several services, with lines showing how they are inter-connected, and then any services in a single machine are all grouped in one box
<eyJhb> clever: I think gchristensen asked that question a couple of days ago
<clever> i remember him asking something similar, but cant remember the details
<eyJhb> Does that give you anything?
<clever> ahhh, yeah, i see how that can apply to my question now
<clever> i had interpreted that as a single self-containe graph, being an image in another node
<clever> while in my case, i want the nodes within one box, to reach out to nodes in another box
<clever> let me see what happens if i use his fix on my idea...
<eyJhb> Helping by linking to other people, wooo :D
<clever> eyJhb: the irc logs didnt have a good example, but it did have the right keywords
<clever> and the example is exactly what i want
<eyJhb> I did _something_ then :(
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<gchristensen> clever: subgraph cluster_foobarbaz { ... }
<gchristensen> but you can't point anything to cluster_foobarbaz, you have to point to nodes inside it
<clever> yeah
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<__monty__> Can you create a node that overlays the entire cluster? Then point to that?
<steveeJ> I just added an example of booting a custom kernel to the wiki: https://nixos.wiki/wiki/Linux_kernel#Booting_a_kernel_from_a_custom_source feedback for improvement very welcome
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<drakonis> so, what a clownshow
<drakonis> nixos.org should be extended because welp, the entire .org domain registry is owned by a private equity
<drakonis> there is no way this will be good
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<clever> drakonis: dont forget about what was hosted on nixos.com ..... (NSFW)
<drakonis> oh yeah, that's a big problem.
<tilpner> steveeJ: What do you need lib for?
<steveeJ> tilpner: pretty sure that's a leftover. let me verify
<steveeJ> tilpner: removed, thanks!
<tilpner> steveeJ: And now you don't need stdenv anymore
<tilpner> steveeJ: You can also do modDirVersion = version;
<tilpner> steveeJ: And kernelPatches defaults to []
<tilpner> (Though you may want to keep it in, so people don't need to discover it when they do have patches)
<steveeJ> tilpner: agreed on all points made
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<infinisil> That's hella cool
<infinisil> I could waste hours on this
<infinisil> (not just the one I just did)
<tilpner> At least with that one you know what you're getting into
<tilpner> With iohk.io, you can get stuck while trying to find out what iohk is
<infinisil> Ah neat, didn't know they had such stuff on their website
<infinisil> I really like the configurability of the above one though
<infinisil> Protip: Set pressure to 1 to get tornados!
<infinisil> And turn the diffusions to 0
<samueldr> I wonder how legal it is for a device to force you to accept its "agreement" which includes data collection
<samueldr> here in Canada
<samueldr> in Europe I'm sure it's wholly verboten
<samueldr> pretty sure it is here, too
<samueldr> even auto-updates for software is considered the same as ticking a box for receiving a newsletter here!
<samueldr> which means that android, through google play services, doesn't respect the rules
<samueldr> (as far as my not-a-lawyer understanding gives me)
<samueldr> you are simply told, through the google setup, that you will receive updates automatically
<drakonis> infinisil: that is hella good.
<drakonis> i'm once again doing a NixOS slide deck and i'm figuring out where to begin making them
<drakonis> i dont have all the experience you all have, so i need some advice on where to get inspiration to build them
<drakonis> gotta sell NixOS to a 60 something people crowd
<tilpner> Who are they?
<tilpner> Developers? Sysadmins? Office users?
<drakonis> a mix of all of the above
<drakonis> its a introduction to NixOS
<drakonis> the talk is in a event that targets regional linux users
<samueldr> provincial and federal linux users are not welcome
<drakonis> heh
<drakonis> i've been wanting to do this for a year now
<drakonis> however i feel i dont know enough about writing packages and modules to actually conduct a talk
<drakonis> and only just recently i have been able to use it on my laptop because weird complications
<drakonis> i should probably talk about the good use cases like deployment and development, right?
<tilpner> Depending on how much time you have, recorded/interactive demos might be interesting to people
<drakonis> 50 minutes
<tilpner> - Shell script with nix-shell as interpreter, magic fetching of dependencies
<drakonis> i'm planning on doing that
<tilpner> - lorri for magic project environment
<drakonis> i have not fiddled with lorri but i'm looking at doing it now
<tilpner> - Show how usually-tedious things are done with a few options on either server/desktop
<drakonis> ^ absolutely the thing i want to show
<tilpner> E.g. xfce+i3 setup from bare installation
<tilpner> I also like to show https://tx0.co/rzt
<joepie91> drakonis: I'd recommend showing how small the step from a system config to "that system config, but in a VM" is
<joepie91> or container
<tilpner> "Group configuration for functionality closely together"
<joepie91> like eg. with declarative containers
<joepie91> drakonis: and if you really want to make it fun, how small the step is to deploying that config remotely, using eg. morph
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<drakonis> looks like a lot of fun
<drakonis> setting up mumble with a single configuration file
<drakonis> lovable
<samueldr> it might be easier to demo the stuff you use nixos for
<samueldr> if you have dumb tricks that are otherwise annoying or hard to do on other distros, that also helps sell
<drakonis> to be fair, my day to day isn't exactly too complex, however, there are some things that other distros are not super fun to deal with
<drakonis> any thing to do with arch or gentoo require a lot of computer janitoring
<drakonis> deploying and replicating my machine across my laptop and desktop is absolutely the best thing
<drakonis> not having to deal with the clunky horrible bits of debian where the fresh bits require you to be running unstable and experimental together
<drakonis> show how good it is to develop in it
<samueldr> see, "not too complex", but annoying to deal with elsewhere... especially the replication across machines
<drakonis> my laptop is the same config sans a few packages and services
<__monty__> Could also be nice to show off the rollback capabilities. And definitely mention how some of the benefits of nix can be had on any distro.
<drakonis> also being able to quickly bring up a hosed machine
<tilpner> Yes, generation selection from grub is worth showing
<__monty__> Maybe make it appear as though something went wrong showing something off. "Uh oh, that's no good." "reboot, rollback, let's try this again"
<infinisil> I like that idea!
<drakonis> i'll come in with a broken generation just for that
<drakonis> hmm, i wonder if i can set up a vm that boots into the running system
<drakonis> so it shows in the projector
<drakonis> might be a lot of effort and might break things in unexpected ways in the host
<manveru> drakonis: using qemu it's pretty easy
<drakonis> being able to boot into grub with the generation history on a vm
<drakonis> just to replicate the boot experience
<samueldr> nixos-rebuild build-vm-with-bootloader
<drakonis> interesting.
<drakonis> i should be able to control the ram and cpu threads available to the vm through it, right?
<drakonis> last i've used build-vm, it gave me tiny amounts of resources
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> there are hidden options for that
<samueldr> virtusalisation.*
<samueldr> don't know of a good way to list all those relevant
<drakonis> nixos-option then
<samueldr> IIRC they're behind a conditional for good reasons
<samueldr> so they won't show
<drakonis> oh, i didnt know anbox was available.
<drakonis> anbox is such bs to set up on other distros
<drakonis> i think i'll try to appeal to a variety of crowds with the talk
<drakonis> maybe next time i'll do a series of specialized talks
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