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<infinisil> disasm: since he's adding a service, that shouldn't be a problem. But what could be a problem is dependencies being different and not working in master
<disasm> yeah, that's true
<ekleog> using a service from another branch of nixpkgs than the running one is quite some trickery, though
<infinisil> moet: Um, but isn't there a powertop module already?
<moet> i'm not adding the service; just modifying it
<infinisil> Ah, must've misunderstood you then
<ekleog> as for the name “unstable”, from my experience what happens is it's quite stable, just sometimes a not-widely-used package breaks and doesn't build and this blocks your updating, basically it just makes things slower to update but I haven't experienced any breakage yet
<ekleog> (after a bit more than a year on unstable, iirc)
<moet> ah, i see.. so it's more might-not-build than unstable-while-running
<ekleog> in my experience at least (then I was used to archlinux before, which ran basically the same set of packages as nixos-unstable: the latest released one)
<ocharles> gchristensen: just a heads up if you actually plan on using micro-ci (which I might just rename ci.nix) - config change, but it now stores logs of builds: https://github.com/ocharles/micro-ci/commit/389a1c02954bbc1e71e59f8ee0ba8fb7959e06ad :)
<ocharles> but of course may be best to hold off until it has a more serious announcement
<gchristensen> whoa, crazy cool ocharles!
<ocharles> this should be enough for me to add this to work's github repos though, and stop my colleagues pushing code that the linter rejcets :p
<gchristensen> :P
<Moredread> does anyone else have issues with cache downloads timing out?
<ocharles> the nix bin tools are so damn handy
<gchristensen> Moredread: a few people today :?/
<gchristensen> ocharles: nix bin tools?
<ocharles> nix-instantiate, nix-store, etc
<disasm> gchristensen: s/17.03/17.09 :)
<infinisil> Moredread: Well, my whole network is kinda dead right now, so yes, but not specific to the cache
<infinisil> :p
<ocharles> the plumbing, I suppose you could say
<gchristensen> oh yeah
<Moredread> maybe a local issue? I had problems with steam too... fyi I'm on Vodafone cable in Germany
<infinisil> nix-instantiate --eval is soo nice
<ocharles> infinisil: yep, and with --json it's cake to communicate to other processes!
<gchristensen> fixed, disasm :)
<gchristensen> Moredread: the other person was also with vodafone
<Moredread> gchristensen: great, I guess I'll have to call support later
<disasm> my preference is to stick with stable until about a month out from the fork, then switch to unstable, and then at the fork switch to the new pre-release :) But I like to live on the wild side with enough stability not to mess up my system.
<gchristensen> Moredread: maybe send them http://ix.io/AUY
<gchristensen> Moredread: a healthy version: ix.io/AV0
<disasm> and obviously I ask others of the state of unstable before switching, lol
<moet> how can i learn about the options for `substituteInPlace`? is there a package i can try out which has that tool in ti?
<ekleog> I think I'll switch back to stable soon, now the option to disable a module from nixpkgs has landed in stable and I can just pick a new module from unstable when I want to
<ekleog> that said maybe it'd be better to wait for the next fork to pre-release
<infinisil> moet: It's the stdenv, so if you just wanted to mess with it you could do nix-shell -p stdenv
<Moredread> ekleog: how does that work?
<infinisil> moet: generally it's used in mkDerivation for patching
<infinisil> s/generally/usually
<disasm> gchristensen: you run zfsUnstable right?
<gchristensen> lol, absolutely not
<disasm> gchristensen: ah, some reason I though you were using zfs encryption :)
<infinisil> hyper_ch was experimenting with zfs encryption in zfsUnstable recently
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<disasm> gchristensen: you use zfs with luks?
<ekleog> Moredread: something like disabledModules = [ "foo/bar.nix" ]
<ekleog> that hooks into the imports = [] mecanism to disable a module
<infinisil> oh i didn't know about that
<moet> infinisil: thanks.. it seems the substitute, substituteInPlace etc... binaries don't have usage text or manpages
<ekleog> then you can just add your own module
<moet> is there another place i should look?
<disasm> ekleog: ooh, that's cool :)
<ekleog> it's new from a few months ago :)
<ekleog> section 31.6 of the nixos manual :D
<infinisil> moet: It's actually in the nixpkgs or nix manual, hold on
<moet> oh, ok.. i'll search
<infinisil> oh, my internet is pretty dead right now, can't help right now
<gchristensen> disasm: I have enough excitement in my life without unstable FSs
<infinisil> it's in one of those manuals
<ekleog> grep “substituteInPlace” in there
<infinisil> gchristensen: Were you able to recover some deleted files? xD
<gchristensen> infinisil: I didn't try :)
<disasm> gchristensen: I keep going back and forth on whether I should try zfs or stick with btrfs. Was thinking about trying zfs native encryption, but maybe that's not the best idea until it gets a little more traction.
<gchristensen> zfs is great
<infinisil> zfs is pretty neat even without crypto
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<gchristensen> btrfs has caused me too many problems to use it
<gchristensen> (as noted, several years ago)
<disasm> yeah, everyone keeps saying that, which makes me wonder if maybe I should make the switch before I become a statistic :)
<drakonis> btrfs is dangerous
<drakonis> btw red hat will make their own zfs soon
<gchristensen> silliness
<drakonis> xfs gonna be as good as zfs soon
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<moet> i know configuration.nix is available as a manpage in nixos, but is the nixpkgs manual also available?
<drakonis> look up stratis
<drakonis> its a long term goal i guess
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<gchristensen> I wish they wouldn't
<drakonis> its going to build upon xfs, lvm2 and device mapper to do it
<drakonis> so its not going to be a repeat of btrfs
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<ekleog> I've been using nothing but btrfs since it was available (on arch at the time) (so... 4-5 years ago?), never had any issue (yet)
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<infinisil> moet: I don't think there's a man page, but you can build it locally with `nix-build '<nixpkgs/doc>'
<infinisil> like the website
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<moet> ah, ty..
<infinisil> And this would build the docs of the exact version you have. the website is only updated on every release
<ekleog> I don't think so either, given /run/current-system/sw/share/man  ls man* | grep nix
<ekleog> niice the nix-build '<nixpkgs/doc>', I've always been using the service, didn't know you could preview the changes in the doc this way, thanks! :)
<gchristensen> it'd be cool if it was a man page though
<gchristensen> `man nixpkgs`
<infinisil> yeah
<ekleog> hmm... as `man configuration.nix` exists, maybe it's not that hard to extract from the docbook?
<gchristensen> indeed, docbook was designed for this task
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<disasm> ugh, xfs, lvm and device mapper, the 3 reasons I started looking at alternate file systems.
<gchristensen> zfs is quite pleasant to use :)
<gchristensen> ocharles: ok a wild idea for you
<gchristensen> ocharles: each attrname gets a build status :)
<disasm> gchristensen: currently I use luks with a single btrfs partition and a bunch of subvols in that partition. Is that similar how you'd recommend partitioning zfs?
<gchristensen> sure
<gchristensen> that seems fine
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<gchristensen> disasm: yikes!! https://github.com/zfsonlinux/zfs/issues/3430
<moet> ekleog: how would i launch local nixpkgs in a vm?
<moet> i didn't see that mentioned under chapter 13 of the manual
<infinisil> moet: nixos-rebuild build-vm -I nixpkgs=path/to/local/nixpkgs
<ekleog> and add -I nixos-config=some-not-too-big-configuration.nix to not run a complete x11 etc. vm :)
<infinisil> moet: This uses your systems config in /etc/nixos/configuration.nix by default, you can use a vm specific config for testing by adding -I nixos-config=path/to/another/config.nix
<moet> ah thanks! i didn't realize it was just part of nixos-rebuild.. now reading the manpage
<disasm> gchristensen: seems to only be affected if you don't wipe before creating luks partition from my reading.
<gchristensen> yeah
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<infinisil> other distro's don't even come close to being able to do nixos-rebuild build-vm
<gchristensen> noope
<gchristensen> gotta have perfect chef code to do that :)
<gchristensen> / puppet / ansible / salt stack / shell scripts
<infinisil> i have no idea what the first three of those are. Are you saying other distros would try to do it with these techs?
<gchristensen> yeah
<infinisil> i see
<disasm> I would add vagrant to that list, that's what I did before nixos, vagrant up with a provision step that ran configuration management tool of choice, but nowhere near as cool as nixos-rebuild build-vm
<moet> where is the `-I` option for nixos-rebuild documented? i searched `man nixos-rebuild` and tried doing `nixos-rebuild <subcommand> --help` ..
<Moredread> gchristensen: do you know how I can reproduce http://ix.io/AUY ?
<disasm> well that's interesting, there's an example under "--profile" using -I but no mention of the falg -I
<infinisil> moet: It's a bit confusing, because nixos-rebuild uses nix-build underneath, while nix-build uses nix-instantiate and nix-store underneath. Some options are passed along, so the -I option is documented in the nix-store man page
<Moredread> gchristensen: thx :)
<gchristensen> infinisil: that is terrible UX :P
<infinisil> Moredread: And in nix-build too actually
<infinisil> I meant moet ^^
<infinisil> gchristensen: I have to agree
<disasm> yeah, we should fix that man page
* disasm adds to nixcon hit list
<infinisil> wait, why doesn't nix-instantiate mention the -I flag, i think nix-instantiate is the one that should actually use it
<moet> thanks! i'll look in nix-build and nix-store for -I the
<moet> then*
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<disasm> FYI, if you come across any other documentation failures, hit me up and I'll add them to the list :)
<gchristensen> hi jtojnar anything you'd like me to merge?
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<infinisil> disasm: Do you have man pages for {nix,nixpkgs,nixops,nixos}-manual on that list?
<infinisil> or some terminal interface to it at least
<disasm> added :)
<gchristensen> everyone should feel free to not wait until nixcon to do these things :)
<moet> nix-build and nix-store both mention -I as a way to modify the contents of NIX_PATH ..
<infinisil> moet: The NIX_PATH is just a list of name=value elements, separated by ":", which specifies that <name> in an evaluated nix file should turn into value
<disasm> gchristensen: of course! but if it's not done by then I'll have a list of things for people to do at the documentation summit during hack days :)
<moet> nixpkgs manual says "See the section on NIX_PATH in the Nix manual" ... which has the same couple of paragraphs about NIX_PATH as are on the two man pages i just mentioned
<infinisil> so if you have nixpkgs=path/to/nixpkgs in your NIX_PATH, import <nixpkgs> {} (used all thoughouut nix files) will evaluate to the that given path
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<moet> but none of those three identical places which discuss NIX_PATH mention `nixos-config` as an option for overriding..
<moet> so i'm confused :P
<infinisil> disasm: ^^
<infinisil> add that
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<jtojnar> gchristensen: only dleyna remains at the moment https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/pull/28826
<jtojnar> waiting for staging to be built so I could continue with GNOME 3.26
<infinisil> moet: nixos-config is just the value used for the config
<infinisil> moet: Have a look at the file nixpkgs/nixos/default.nix
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<infinisil> moet: In the very first line, this file uses <nixos-config>
<moet> :P ok
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<moet> does this seem sane? `nixos-rebuild build-vm -I nixpkgs=~/nixpkgs/:nixos-config=~/nixpkgs/minimal-configuration.nix`
<gchristensen> jtojnar: do you want to be a maintainer on those packages?
<infinisil> moet: I think you need to use -I nixpkgs=... -I nixos-config=...
<infinisil> if it gives you an error
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<infinisil> but yeah this looks fine to me, you can't break anything anyways with such a command
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<gchristensen> jtojnar: is there a reason someone would want only one of renderer or server? ie: why two options?
<jtojnar> gchristensen: I will add myself
<moet> hmm.. now it's telling me `warning: Nix search path entry ‘~/nixpkgs/minimal-configuration.nix’ does not exist, ignoring` .. is this because it's inside of ~/nixpkgs ?
<moet> it's most definitely the correct path..
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<moet> sorry for so many questions..
<infinisil> moet: Did you use multiple -I's as i said or the single one and separated via ":"/
<infinisil> ?*
<moet> multiple
<moet> though when i tried single -I with a :, there was a different error
<moet> i'm inclined to think that multiple -Is is correct, based on the other error not seeming to recognize : as a delimiter
<infinisil> moet: And this file ~/nixpkgs/minimal-configuration.nix exists and is accessible?
<gchristensen> jtojnar: I'm not sure it should be enabled by default? can you explain that?
<moet> infinisil: yes, it tab-completes when i delete the end of the string
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<infinisil> moet: Oh, maybe try $HOME instead of ~
<infinisil> the ~ might not get expanded, not sure why though
<infinisil> yeah that's probably it
<infinisil> it gives me the same error when i use ~
<moet> hmm..i thought the shell expands ~
<moet> but yay, it's fixed so .. moving on
<jtojnar> gchristensen: some apps require just server (gnome-online-miners) and some just renderer (gnome-photos), you might not need both
<infinisil> apparently it only does when there's a space before it
<infinisil> TIL
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<jtojnar> gchristensen: it will be enabled by default for gnome since it is required by gnome apps
<jtojnar> ideally we could specify required services inside the derivation but since this is not possible…
<gchristensen> ok
<atorres_> Now ARM is also being tested as architecture for NixOS?
<slack1256> any function to combine dependencies of derivations?
<infinisil> slack1256: Define "combine"
<infinisil> what do you need it for
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<slack1256> I would like to have hoogle, ctags available on a nix-shell environment from a haskell package
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<slack1256> I would like the default.nix of such package stay as is right now, just and the dependencies on the shell.nix somehow
<infinisil> slack1256: buildEnv { name="x"; paths = [ ctags hoogle ]; }
<infinisil> slack1256: Ah you mean to declare shell.nix in such a way that it uses everything from default.nix but adds these 2 packages
<slack1256> exactly
<slack1256> with the buildEnv you showed It seems I can do that
<infinisil> i think buildEnv should work that
<infinisil> for that*
<infinisil> yeah
<slack1256> I need to "callPackage (import default.nix) {}" and put that derivation on the paths list from buildEnv
<slack1256> Mmmm no, I just need the dependencies of such default.nix
<infinisil> slack1256: just paths = [ hoogle (import default.nix) ]?
<infinisil> usually default.nix doesn't need callPackage
<slack1256> default.nix is a function thought, what the wrong type for paths
<slack1256> I need a function that given a function will give me the dependencies it need
<infinisil> slack1256: are the arguments for callPackage?
<slack1256> those yeah
<infinisil> if yes -> callPackage ./default.nix {}
<slack1256> Mmm I will try to make it work first
<slack1256> brb
<infinisil> so, paths = [ hoogle (callPackage ./default.nix {}) ]
<infinisil> or just callPackage ./. {}
<infinisil> because the default.nix is used by default (duh)
<slack1256> that would build my project and give a environment with my project built
<infinisil> probably, I haven't done much with a shell.nix
<slack1256> I would like an environment with the dependencies of my project plus hoogle, ctags available
<gchristensen> jtojnar: I can't test right now due to the mass rebuild
<infinisil> slack1256: as said, use the buildEnv with that callPackage thing
<slack1256> OK, I will try out
<slack1256> brb
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<infinisil> (gonna be messing around with my server for a bit now)
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<eqyiel[m]> what's the expected type of key in nix.buildMachines.*.sshKey? I'm trying to set up a remote build machine and it's failing with this: https://gist.github.com/776022f2b07223a3c3424c9932d541b8
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<eqyiel[m]> the key in question is just one that I made with ssh-keygen, 2048 bit RSA
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<eqyiel[m]> curiously, I can get openssl to print the same message https://gist.github.com/a61d23c5045973f2081dcf08d168d0f6
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] jtojnar closed pull request #28826: gnome3: Add dleyna service (master...dleyna) https://git.io/v5BZv
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] jtojnar reopened pull request #28826: gnome3: Add dleyna service (master...dleyna) https://git.io/v5BZv
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<eqyiel[m]> oh, it was completely unrelated, it was due to having an old signing-key that nix-copy-closure didn't like
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<moet> =1
<moet> ok, so i think i've managed to test the change to cpupower we discussed in here earlier
<moet> but i had some trouble with build-vm .. it's very slow, and buggy.. which is probably just my machine's fault
<moet> in some ways the nixos system running inside the vm is clearly broken (journalctl doesn't work, nix-shell doesn't work etc..)
<moet> so maybe it needs more testing
<moet> but the modified powertop program succeeded in creating the directory in /var/lib
<moet> my conclusion is that i can't really do nix development on this computer
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vaibhavsagar opened pull request #30210: hackage: update snapshot of 'all-cabal-hashes' repo for callHackage (master...update-all-cabal-hashes) https://git.io/vdzgG
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<moet> so i'll paste the diff if anybody is http://lpaste.net/359027
<moet> * is willing to apply it
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<xd1le> Is there a way to get the <nixpkgs> path from the command line?
<xd1le> for example, via nix-instantiate or something?
<infinisil> xd1le: nix-instantiate --eval -E '<nixpkgs>'
<xd1le> infinisil: oh -E, nice. thanks!
<tilpner> xd1le - nix-instantiate --find-file nixpkgs
<infinisil> Damn, I keep forgetting about find-file, which is even nicer
<xd1le> tilpner: thanks
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<Drakeson> I am trying to follow https://nixos.wiki/wiki/How_to_install_NixOS_from_Linux, and the following two commands don't seem to work: nixos-checkout (does not exist), and nixos-install barfs with: "unshare: cannot change root filesystem propagation: Invalid argument". Any ideas what is missing on that page?
<Drakeson> I merely followed the instructions as stated there.
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<Drakeson> nix-channel and nix-env are available in the chroot, btw, so if anything is obviously missing, I can install them. Just that I don't know WHAT is missing.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] NakedFerret opened pull request #30211: Backport querying lock command in xflock4 (master...backport-lock-setting-xflock4) https://git.io/vdz2P
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<gandreani> Could anyone help me understand why this patch won't apply https://git.io/vdz2P? Running the build for the package is just `nix-build -A xfce.xfce4session`
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<clever> gandreani: did you add it to the patches attribute of the derivation?
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<gandreani> Yessir. Rather, I modified a patch that was already there
<gandreani> clever: ^
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<clever> ah
<clever> yeah, it is in patches
<mbrgm> hi! how should continuously released software be packaged for nixos? I want to package FHEM (https://fhem.de/#Download), but it includes a self-update command, which is fed from a nightly release, coming directly from SVN. the released versions are only meant to be starting points for a rolling-updated installation...
<mbrgm> so I thought about packaging the released version, but then copy all files, which are touched by the self-update command, to a mutable directory. this would allow the self-update to work, although it clearly does not follow the nixos philosophy..
<clever> mbrgm: it will have the wrong elf headers, and you have to re-run patchelf over it every time it updates
<mbrgm> clever: it's perl, so this should be no problem?
<clever> mbrgm: then the only problem would be #!/usr/bin/perl and the perl search path
<mbrgm> clever: I highly dislike working around the nix store by supporting this self-update mechanism, but the remaining options are (1) package an out of date version, (2) package based on a SVN revision, which would mean an upgrade every day... or can you think of other options?
<clever> mbrgm: either disable the auto-update, or run it in an FHS env like steam does
<mbrgm> clever: thx for the steam pointer. I think I'll take a look at it
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<srhb> How do I expand my boot menu so the entries do not get cut off at "2" https://imgur.com/a/tNTbY ?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] FRidh closed pull request #30032: pyqt,sip: 5.8.1 -> 5.9, 4.19.1 -> 4.19.3 (master...update/pyqt-sip) https://git.io/vdCLV
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] FRidh pushed 1 new commit to staging: https://git.io/vdzay
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/staging 4003e77 Frederik Rietdijk: Merge remote-tracking branch 'upstream/master' into HEAD
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<hyper_ch> infinisil: I still am
<hyper_ch> diasm isn't online anymore :(
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vaibhavsagar opened pull request #30212: pkgs.yabause: fix typo (master...patch-1) https://git.io/vdzVE
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<srhb-console> Hmm, halp.
<srhb-console> I managed to fry my bootloader and I'm now in the installer
<srhb-console> I've mounted my tree on /mnt, however, nixos-install says "error getting status of /etc/nixos/hardware-configuration.nix: no such file or directory"
<srhb-console> Which is obviously true, because it should be /mnt/etc/nixos/hardware-configuration.nix
<srhb-console> How do I remedy this?
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<srhb-console> I can't chroot and run nixos-rebuild either, since 1) the NIX_PATH is still the installer one (I can change that, of course) and 2) Error in tempdir () using /run/user/0/nix-build.XXXXXX: Parent directory (/run/user/0) does not exist at ... [nix perl thing] line 45
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<srhb-console> Which presumably is the daemon breaking inside a chroot
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<srhb-console> There must be some bug in the installer, I seem to experience these issues rather often and can never remember how to fix it...
<srhb-console> I wonder if it's a zfs thing.
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<srhb-console> Also stop sleeping in - it may be sunday but there's nixing to be done! O:-)
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<srhb-console> Hm, specifying root manually appears to work.
<sphalerite> that's weird
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<srhb-console> Actually, I see I have some assumptions that are clearly erroneous.
<srhb-console> I have some absolute paths in /mnt/etc/nixos/configuration.nix but they're all wrong compared to the root of the installer
<srhb-console> How did that ever work though...
<srhb-console> Shouldn't the installer be chrooting?
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<srhb-console> Ah, that's the issue with the hardware configuration too.
<srhb-console> ugh, this is a mess to fix.
<srhb-console> Is there a way to make the chroot work despite that tempdir error?
<sphalerite> mount -t tmpfs tmpfs /mnt/run (if it's not already there), then mkdir -pm 0700 /mnt/run/user/0
<clever> srhb-console: nixos-install --chroot
<sphalerite> should do the trick I think
<srhb-console> clever: No, that doesn't work, see the tempdir error above.
<srhb-console> sphalerite: I'll try that, thanks
<clever> unset the tempdir variable
<ocharles> gchristensen: isn't that what already happens?
<srhb-console> clever: There is no such variable
<clever> srhb-console: env | grep /run/user
<srhb-console> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR
<clever> unset it, then try nixos-rebuild boot again
<srhb-console> That gets me further, yes. The NIX_PATH is relative to the old root though, I'll try remedying that.
<clever> nixpkgs=/nix/var/nix/profiles/per-user/root/channels/nixos/nixpkgs:nixos-config=/etc/nixos/configuration.nix:/nix/var/nix/profiles/per-user/root/channels
<clever> that is the default value
<srhb-console> nixpkgs=/nix/store/blah:nixos-config=/mnt//etc/nixos/configuration.nix
<srhb-console> Is what it is here
<clever> the nixos-config will need to be adjusted a bit
<clever> oh, and did you use an absolute or relative path for hardware-configuration.nix?
<srhb-console> Didn't the chroot option use to take care of this?
<srhb-console> I used an absolute path which broke it, I've changed that now to be relative to /etc/nixos/configuration.nix
<clever> something got changed recently and its a bit wonky
<srhb-console> I have other absolute paths in it though
<srhb-console> Which also breaks the installer
<clever> making everything relative will fix it
<clever> you can do ./../../foo
<srhb-console> Yeah.
<cocreature> is the nix cache failing for anyone else? I’m getting “download-from-binary-cache.pl: still waiting for ‘https://cache.nixos.org/z8s1fy0ac1p1dgf0p0bxlmnn4h72qsfg.narinfo’ after 5 seconds...”
<srhb-console> cocreature: There were many reports of that yesterday as well
<clever> i need to get to bed now, its 4:30 am
<srhb-console> clever: Sleep well, and thanks.
<clever> yep
<cocreature> srhb-console: hm ok, I guess I can at least stop searching the problem on my side
<srhb-console> cocreature: Not sure, it's not everyone that experiences it
<srhb-console> I've had no issues for instance, and I've downloaded lots.
<srhb-console> It feels like some locations have issues talking to cloudfront
<cocreature> ah now things seem to be working
<cocreature> weird
<srhb-console> It is weird, yes.
<srhb-console> Looks like I may have a bootloader agian. Fingers crossed, brb.
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<srhb-console> Nope!
<srhb-console> How do I force a reinstall of grub/systemd-boot from the installer?
<sphalerite> srhb-console: just nixos-install should do it. Did you mount the ESP in /mnt/root though?
<srhb-console> I did, yes.
<srhb-console> OK, I'll remove all absolute paths from my configuration.nix, I should be able to nixos-install then
<srhb-console> I really thought nixos-rebuild boot from the chroot would do it.
<srhb-console> Ouch, now I hit the cache issue. Great timing :P
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<srhb-console> Not being able to use absolute paths as if /mnt was root in the installer is really painful.
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<jluttine> hmm.. no mkfs.ntfs although mkfs.fat, mkfs.ext4 etc etc. why?
<jluttine> how can i create ntfs filesystems in nixos? i'm formatting an external usb disk
<sphalerite> jluttine: there's a mkfs.ntfs in ntfs3f
<sphalerite> s/3f/3g/
<jluttine> sphalerite: ok, thanks!
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<fearlessKim[m]> for programs such as vdirsyncer/offlineimap that run regurarly, do you setup cronjobs ? or systemd services ? ideally I would setup them through home-manager imo.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] yurrriq closed pull request #23630: skim: init at 1.4.28 (master...add/pkgs/applications/misc/skim) https://git.io/vyuRP
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<Moredread> btw, is there a way to chroot to a nixos install from another running linux_
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<Moredread> wow, now I get google results, the last time there was nothing relevant oO
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<srhb> Phew. That was messy.
<srhb> Is there a way to install the bootloader from a running nixos?
<srhb> (I just assumed that would happen if I nuked the efi bootmgr images and rebuild -- protip: That does not happen :-))
<srhb> Nothing like console sunday mornings.
<symphorien> nixos-rebuild boot I believe
<srhb> Oh, there;s an --install-bootloader
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<srhb> Welp, lesson learned :D
<srhb> Yep, --install-bootloader is the answer.
<srhb> Another protip: Drink at least a few cups of coffee sunday morning (and read a manual or two) before rm -rf /boot/EFI/*
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<hyper_ch> clever: how can I check the auto-snapshot properties of a dataset? zfs get com.sun:auto-snapshot doesn't seem to work... also just zfs get dataset doesn't list tem
<hyper_ch> ah, get all
<sphalerite> fearlessKim: I'm planning to set them up through home-manager myself, once I finally get around to setting home-manager up
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<sphalerite> srhb: nice. What made you think that was a good idea? :p
<srhb> It's all a bit blurry to be honest. ;-)
<srhb> I wanted to try reinstalling systemd-boot to see if that would fix the clipping of the boot entries.
<srhb> It didn't, but it was a hell of a ride. ;-P
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<sphalerite> Haha
<sphalerite> We should make a Linux-based bootloader for nixos
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzox
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 35f8948 Vladimír Čunát: xf86-video-intel: fixup after #29039...
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<fearlessKim[m]> sphalerite: great let me know when you get to it. I wouldn't mind contributing to home-manager if it didn't feel like duplicate work with nixos code. Some nixos modules could be modified to adjust paths depending on if they run for a user or for the system (zsh for instance).
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<srhb> Does home-manager have a story for crypto secrets?
<srhb> Like, can I manage .ssh or .gpg in a sensible manner?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzKX
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 9b4f74e Vladimír Čunát: yabause: fix meta eval
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<dejanr> what do you when stuck stuck with some invalid expression url https://cloudup.com/cUhm7p8F1wo ?
<srhb> dejanr: Invalid how?
<dejanr> its not downloading
<srhb> dejanr: The cache has been having issues for at least yesterday and today
<srhb> Try again.
<srhb> It might be a region thing, because that url downloaded instantly for me (though it was a pain to type in :-P)
<sphalerite> srhb: config and known_hosts, sure. I don't see what role you'd see home-manager fulfilling for the keys/keyring though.
<srhb> sphalerite: no, indeed. I'm missing a proper secret manager. I hate having it all split up.
<sphalerite> ... like gpg? :p
<srhb> ... point.
<sphalerite> I use gpg as my SSH agent as well
<srhb> I wonder if I could integrate it with home manager such that I could make it extract secrets from gpg and put them in the right place
<srhb> For instance, interpolating my github oauth token and such
<sphalerite> I'll eventually be switching to pass for my password database as well
<sphalerite> ah
<srhb> Huh, never heard of pass
<sphalerite> it's supposed to be very nice
<srhb> I'll make a note, thank you :)
<srhb> Things are gradually improving with all this tooling.
<srhb> I still feel the big integration that brings it all together is missing, but I'm not sure if anyone knows how to do it.
<sphalerite> I'm currently using keepassx but clicking around in a gui every time I want to retrieve a password is a bit of a pain
<srhb> Yeah :(
<srhb> I've tried that, dislike it immensely.
<sphalerite> the big integration? You mean the unix shell? :D
<srhb> Sshh :P
<srhb> I feel like there's some story waiting to hatch like... NixOS user namespaces or something, where a user can activate parts of the nixos configuration managed by them, in an unprivileged manner.
<sphalerite> if everything could just read its password from a FIFO or something that would be awesoem
<srhb> Hehe
<sphalerite> but no, everybody uses env vars instead… because that's a great idea
<srhb> Yeah, it's glorious ._.
<srhb> How do I escale ${ in a '' ''; multiline?
<srhb> er
<srhb> escape
<sphalerite> ''${
<srhb> Thanks
<sphalerite> (that's two single quotes as well)
<srhb> Beautiful.
<sphalerite> isn't it!
<srhb> Well, now my syntax highlighting isn't exploding, that is sort of beautiful :-P
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<srhb> (It was doing the right thing, really)
<srhb> Wait, if I *do* store secrets in home-manager, they'll end up in the nix store readable for all, right?
<fearlessKim[m]> pass + qtpass + rofipass + browserpass seems good to manage passwords
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] cocreature opened pull request #30214: ghcjs/ghcjsHEAD: Use separate patch files to fix build of ghcjs (master...ghcjs) https://git.io/vdz6L
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<srhb> lol
<srhb> "Note, as always with Nix, care needs to be taken to not put secret information in files that are written to the Nix store."
<srhb> then
<srhb> oauthtoken = "my secret oauth token"
<srhb> :|
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<sphalerite> Nice
<rycee> srhb: ;-)
<srhb> rycee: I think this is approximately what everyone does on their single user systems. :-P
<srhb> But yeah, it's sad that there's no better story yet.
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<bennofs> it's not that bad for single user, as most applications will be able to read the config file in ~ as well anyway, if you're not using some additional sandboxing
<srhb> Right, exactly.
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<rycee> Yeah, this is from my laptop config that only I use. It's is certainly a bit unfortunate.
<CrazedProgrammer> applications should be able to handle hashed passwords, then the problem is (mostly) solved
<rycee> I can change the blog post to use some other example, at least :-)
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<srhb> CrazedProgrammer: Not even remotely.
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<srhb> CrazedProgrammer: If you can use the hashed password as a password, it's just a password. :-P
<CrazedProgrammer> oh, of course :P sorry.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] joachifm closed pull request #30212: pkgs.yabause: fix typo (master...patch-1) https://git.io/vdzVE
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<srhb> I'm sure some quantum whatnot can get around that little issue, that would be very nice. :-P
<CrazedProgrammer> actually, if you can specify a hashed password and only log in using a password that hashes to that....
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* srhb boggles
<LnL> that means your hash is not salted, or you have the same problem with the salt
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] mimadrid opened pull request #30215: fd: 3.1.0 -> 4.0.0 (master...update/fd-4.0.0) https://git.io/vdzi5
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<rycee> srhb: If you reload the page it should show a more innocent example now :-) I also switched it to use the currently preferred way of setting the `programs.git.extraConfig` as an attribute set and not a string.
<srhb> rycee: Great, thanks! ^_^
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<srhb> I'm obviously still going to do the thing. >_>
<rycee> Well, thank you for pointing it out :-)
<rycee> (we'll all continue to do it, just not tell anybody…)
<srhb> Nix Vault 2017, make it so! :-)
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<betaboon> good morning. an update on my nixos-cache issues: currently I'm having issues downloadings the expressions-archive from nixos.org/channels/...xz.
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<srhb> betaboon: It's been an issue since yesterday. I'm not sure if someone has reported it yet, but I think that might be a good idea.
<srhb> That is, as an issue.
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<betaboon> i still have to real clue what the root of the issues is, havent started wireshark yet ;)
<srhb> I don't think anyone does yet.
<srhb> Some people experience the issue a lot, some not at all.
<srhb> I'm guessing "something something cloudfront" but can't get closer than that.
<betaboon> i just threw some messages into irc yesterday. just gotta get some other work done before looking at the network-traffic. will do later. if i have hard information i might write a ticket
<roi_du_silence> bumblebee doesn't work on my computer; all it does is make my fan roll @100% speed for some reason
<roi_du_silence> I crt
<roi_du_silence> I cry*
<srhb> Even without hard info, I think it would be good to start tracking it, since it's unlikely that anyone else will investigate it.
<srhb> roi_du_silence: nixos-version ?
<fearlessKim[m]> sphalerite: do you use handwriting recognition software with your XPS ? I could find cellwriter on linux
<roi_du_silence> 17.09
<betaboon> IMHO as long as this is not a hits-everyone-situation creating a ticket with the bare information "there are issues" is of no real value.
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Which commit? nixos-version should spit it out
<roi_du_silence> 17.09.1483.d0f0657ca0 (Hummingbird)
<srhb> betaboon: I disagree. But OK, I can add it myself if you don't :)
<betaboon> even worse it might confuse the discussion about this kind of issues
<betaboon> i will look at what is realy happening (ruling out issues in my own network + ISP) before ;)
<srhb> cool :)
<betaboon> I'm just doing alot of changes to my whole nix-codebase, so it might even be related to that. XD
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Steps to reproduce?
<srhb> betaboon: Hehe, we've all been there.
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<betaboon> just the usual stuff. nothing to be afraid of. not after all those years xD
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<roi_du_silence> srhb
<roi_du_silence> one sec
<srhb> betaboon: I nuked all my bootloaders this morning, so... :-)
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<betaboon> might happen to me soon on my macbook. wanna finish my refind-module...
<roi_du_silence> haha
<roi_du_silence> I nuked my windows bootloader by mistake
<roi_du_silence> I cry
<roi_du_silence> don't try to install sourcemage when you're tired
<betaboon> did by chance anyone do price-efficiency-research on the host-providers supported by nixops ?
<roi_du_silence> ok, srhb
<roi_du_silence> put hardware.bumblebee.enable = true;
<roi_du_silence> hardware.bumblebee.connectDisplay = true; in /etc/nixos/configuration.nix
<srhb> betaboon: No, but that would be interesting... Last I heard gce was hard to beat on very small instances, but quickly tapers off in favour of hetzner and friends.
<roi_du_silence> sudo nixos-rebuild switch
<roi_du_silence> and tada
<roi_du_silence> fans start yelling 100% at you
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Oh, darn, I can't do that. I won't have internal laptop screen if I try that.
<roi_du_silence> test, not switch
<roi_du_silence> dw dw
<roi_du_silence> it's the same if I install bumblebee on debian, btw
<roi_du_silence> I get the same symptoms
<roi_du_silence> except it's a pain in the ass to rollback
<srhb> Which drivers are you using?
<srhb> I only use bumblebee to accelerate my games and such
<srhb> Or well, optirun
<roi_du_silence> that would be the use I want
<roi_du_silence> ye
<srhb> I don't think you need that option for that.
<roi_du_silence> at the moment I'm using the intel integrated card drivers
<roi_du_silence> you mean the connectDisplay ?
<srhb> Yes
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<betaboon> does anyone own a HP spectre x360 and can confirm that nixos works on it ? XD
<roi_du_silence> okidoki
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Let me find my configuration.
<roi_du_silence> thanks.
<srhb> I think this is all I have that's relevant: http://nixpaste.lbr.uno/ImcsRBqs?nix
<roi_du_silence> there's a nixpaste site. I'm in love
<srhb> It comes with a nixpaste tool too, so you can just cat to it.
<roi_du_silence> I'll test and let you know how it goes
<srhb> Cool :)
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<roi_du_silence> "Failed to start local-fs.target: Unit home.mount is masked.
<roi_du_silence> "
<roi_du_silence> weird
<roi_du_silence> ok
<roi_du_silence> optirun glxinfo works now
<roi_du_silence> but bumblebee still makes my fan go crazy
<roi_du_silence> I'll reboot to see how it works
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<srhb> Oh actually, I've experienced this.
<srhb> Like, it doesn't throttle down after exiting
<srhb> try running optirun bash for a while
<srhb> See if it settles down
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzXe
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 8079e52 Yann Hodique: zile: 2.4.13 -> 2.4.14...
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<roi_du_silence> what's optirun bash
<roi_du_silence> using optirun to run the bash shell ?
<srhb> Yes
<srhb> So that it's doing nothing for a while, but the card is enabled.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 closed pull request #30209: zile: 2.4.13 -> 2.4.14 (master...pr/zile-2.4.14) https://git.io/vdzCw
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] bachp opened pull request #30216: Minio exporter (master...minio-exporter) https://git.io/vdzXU
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<roi_du_silence> >primusrun glxgears
<roi_du_silence> "segmentation fault"
<roi_du_silence> also, it appears that using both optirun glxinfo and glxinfo uses the nvidia card regardless
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 3 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdzXL
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master dc5734e mimadrid: rustRegistry: 2017-10-03 -> 2017-10-08
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 7f502cf mimadrid: fd: 3.1.0 -> 4.0.0
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master d9d5a40 Jörg Thalheim: Merge pull request #30215 from mimadrid/update/fd-4.0.0...
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<roi_du_silence> this is weird ;D
<roi_du_silence> I'll try rebooting as I said
<srhb> Are you sure your xserver is set up to use the intel drivers?
<srhb> OK :)
<roi_du_silence> yes I am !
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<srhb> Odd.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] gnidorah opened pull request #30217: hotpatch: init at 0.2 (master...hotpatch) https://git.io/vdzX3
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzXG
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 3144832 Joerg Thalheim: zile: fix evaluation
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<roi_du_silence> nah
<roi_du_silence> doesn't work
<roi_du_silence> still fan 100%
<srhb> Meh.
<roi_du_silence> glad the video card can be used though =)
<roi_du_silence> means there's hope
<roi_du_silence> I wonder if I should not just switch to nvidia all the time
<roi_du_silence> I'll try
<srhb> When you don't run anything with optirun, what does lspci -vvv say about the nvidia card?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] LnL7 closed pull request #29871: vim-plugins: add `overrideAttrs` support for `buildVimPluginFrom2Nix` (master...vim-utils/override-capability) https://git.io/vdmQU
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<roi_du_silence> I don't have lspci apparently
<roi_du_silence> what package is it part of ?
<srhb> pciutils
<roi_du_silence> nixpaste.lbr.uno/OuGzjvHl?nix
<srhb> So it's not turned off properly.
<roi_du_silence> I tried nouveau on a plethora of distribs, btw. It never works with my card apparently
<roi_du_silence> srhb : when I had the problem with the fan
<roi_du_silence> with debian
<roi_du_silence> just waiting a bit after turning off the computer fixed it
<roi_du_silence> so I'm not worried about that
<roi_du_silence> I wonder what bumblebee does to make it crazy though
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 closed pull request #30217: hotpatch: init at 0.2 (master...hotpatch) https://git.io/vdzX3
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<srhb> I'm guessing it's stuck trying to turn it off
<srhb> Since it shouldn't look like what you pasted.
<roi_du_silence> what should it look like ?
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<srhb> can you show your entire config?
<roi_du_silence> haha oh wow
<roi_du_silence> sure.
<srhb> You're sure the card is set correctly to hybrid mode in your firmware, right?
<roi_du_silence> well considering I was using it on windows with 0 problems, yes
<srhb> Mkay..
<roi_du_silence> I'll try disabling bumblebee and just using nvidia all the time
<srhb> Yeah, everything looks right to me, sorry :/
<roi_du_silence> dw dw
<roi_du_silence> I figure it's my hardware
<roi_du_silence> thanks al ot for the help
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<srhb> You're welcome.
<srhb> This (old) issue looks similar: https://github.com/Bumblebee-Project/Bumblebee/issues/50
<adisbladis> hyper_ch: You inspired me to make the jump :) Also on zfs with native encryption now
<srhb> wait what, native encryption?
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<srhb> What do I need to do? :-P
<hyper_ch> srhb: you need to run zfs unstable
<adisbladis> srhb: It's fairly simple to set up https://nixos.wiki/wiki/NixOS_on_ZFS#Encrypted_ZFS
<hyper_ch> then create a dataset with encryption on and then create desired sub-sets
<hyper_ch> so that you have to enter the password only once
<hyper_ch> it works good
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdzX5
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 1983e6c Pascal Bach: minio: 20170613 -> 2017-09-29T19-16-56Z...
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 62922af Jörg Thalheim: Merge pull request #29994 from bachp/minio-update...
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<hyper_ch> adisbladis: now playing with auto-snapshots....
<srhb> That doesn't sound too bad.
<srhb> Though if I can't convert, it'll have to wait.
<hyper_ch> now if there was a way to remote unlock encrypted root it would be really nice
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 closed pull request #30183: openafs-client: don't remove kernel module on stop (master...openafs) https://git.io/vduP0
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<adisbladis> srhb: You could probably upgrade, create a new encrypted fs in the same zpool and migrate data there if you are not currently using something like luks under your zfs
<srhb> Right... Hmm.
<hyper_ch> thx goes to Mic92 since he wrote the wiki article and hold my hands :)
<adisbladis> hyper_ch: I set that up for luks before back when I made manual initrds
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 1 new commit to release-17.09: https://git.io/vdz1e
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/release-17.09 769317f Joerg Thalheim: openafs-client: don't remove kernel module on stop...
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<adisbladis> Yes thanks Mic92 :)
<hyper_ch> adisbladis: my home server also uses luks/ext4
<hyper_ch> and can be remotely unlocked
<hyper_ch> by using dropbear in the initrd
<adisbladis> hyper_ch: Using nix?
<hyper_ch> no, debian
<adisbladis> Ahh.. I was hoping it could be easily adapted to zfs root
<hyper_ch> that would be great
<hyper_ch> just imagine clever's kexec nixos... and directly remotely encrypt stuff :)
<Mic92> hyper_ch: we have also an initrd dropbear in nixos
<adisbladis> hyper_ch: I'm going to be setting up a new fileserver at home soon-ish. I really want that kind of setup for it.
<hyper_ch> Mic92: ok :) I'm waiting for you to enahnce the encrypted zfs root entry to enable remote unlocking ;)
<Mic92> maybe this should go to the wiki as well
<hyper_ch> Mic92: no quite sure what that does
<srhb> Mic92: Wait what. How does that postCommand work?
<Mic92> srhb: it is the first command executed when you log into the initrd ssh
<srhb> So the login simply triggers it?
<Mic92> yes
<srhb> Nifty!
<hyper_ch> Mic92: on debian you have early network start and dropbear is loaded so that users can remotely log in... than they have a fifo script where you can feed the encryption key to.... that fifo script feeds the encryption key to the luks-enter-password thing and unlocks it and then continues to boot normally
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<hyper_ch> Mic92: I still don't understand that postcommand: you log into the initrd ssh
<hyper_ch> what happens then?
<srhb> Then the shell executes that profile, presumably
<srhb> Which triggers zfs load-key -a
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] rasendubi opened pull request #30218: escrotum: Init at 2017-01-28 (master...escrotum) https://git.io/vdz1t
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<hyper_ch> I still fial to see how you will supply the encryption password and tell nixos to use it to unlock the encrypted zfs and continue with boot
<srhb> Oh, I thought load-key -a would prompt for password.
<Mic92> yes it does
<srhb> Ah, there you go.
<Mic92> and then it kills the other prompt process
<Mic92> so boot continues
<srhb> clever :)
<srhb> I assume that profile is ephemeral since you're adding to it?
<srhb> ephemeral is such a nice word.
<hyper_ch> srhb: I think clever is absent from irc currently ;)
<hyper_ch> Mic92: awesome :)
<srhb> hyper_ch: They can't patent the word! :-)
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<hyper_ch> Mic92: and you could also set the ip in the initrd, right?
<hyper_ch> now that looks awesome *must test*
<adisbladis> Hmm does dropbear have authorizedkeyscommand?
<srhb> hyper_ch: Add network connectivity support to initrd. The network may be configured using the ip kernel parameter, as described in the kernel documentation. Otherwise, if networking.useDHCP is enabled, an IP address is acquired using DHCP.
<adisbladis> Probably not..
<srhb> hyper_ch: from initrd.network.enable
<srhb> But presumably you can execute what arbitrary commands you want.
<adisbladis> On the other hand I could pretty much emulate the authorizedkeyscommand behaviour
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<srhb> Do people write arbitrary, non-modularized config files with home-manager? What's the tool of choice? writeFile?
<hyper_ch> tilpner has written a plugin that allows to create files outside of /etc.... I'm testing this currently
<srhb> Thanks both :)
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<infinisil> srhb: ephemeral is a really nice word indeed :D I discovered it when I was programming for IOS and using an emphemeral network cache
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<srhb> Aha!
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<infinisil> Nice to see more people trying out home-manager
<srhb> I've only converted my .gitconfig so far.
<srhb> I have a decent setup with stow currently, but...
<srhb> I don't know, a lot of them are no obvious how to convert, and the whole secret thing... :)
<infinisil> I also started with my .gitconfig first, but now I've got a ton of stuff with it
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<infinisil> Ah yeah, the secret thing, i just have a private.nix file which just has an attrset in it, there aren't very important things there, so i don't really care it being in the nix store, and I have it in my .gitignore so it doesn't go to github
<srhb> Yeah, the store is my only issue, I already have secrets in my private github repo.
<srhb> Which, admittedly, isn't very smart.
<srhb> But darn convenient...
<infinisil> a private git repo would be better than my solution tbh, but I'm a bit afraid of submodules
<srhb> How so?
<infinisil> haven't used submodules very much
<srhb> Ah, okay, nothing specific.
<infinisil> ye
<srhb> I use them a lot. My current config (outside of home manager) is a bundle of them.
<gchristensen> I should try home manager, I just use a somewhat-janky module I wrote, like this: https://gist.github.com/grahamc/873369fa52ce60f9c849eb343863d63e
<infinisil> do you have a server srhb?
<srhb> infinisil: A gce thingy, yeah.
<srhb> gchristensen: Eh, looks handy enough :)
<infinisil> gchristensen: janky indeed :P
<infinisil> srhb: Can you use the server for a private git repo?
<srhb> I suppose I could, yeah :)
<infinisil> that's what i plan to do when i get around doing it with submodules
<gchristensen> (I updated it to include the actual module)
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<infinisil> Looks almost like how home-manager does it
<infinisil> A thing I like about home-manager is how I don't have to rebuild the sytem for just a /home change
<infinisil> which is a lot faster
<hyper_ch> adisbladis: srhb: you both are zfs gurus.... is there a way to remove a zfs property completely from a subset? I accidentally made a spelling error when I wanted to disable the frequent autosnapshot on a dataset
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<srhb> hyper_ch: I'm really not. :-)
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<hyper_ch> pretty sure you know more than me :)
<gchristensen> #zfsonlinux knows a lot
<hyper_ch> infinisil: is also included as addressee in my question ;)
<srhb> Alas, I don't know the answer to that.
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<srhb> hyper_ch: Is it on the root set?
<srhb> hyper_ch: If not, I guess you can just use zfs inherit from a parent set that doesn't have the attribute.
<hyper_ch> srhb: no, root set is encrypted... it's a subset
<srhb> as in zfs inherit -r wrongprop parentset
<infinisil> To the manpage!
<adisbladis> You should only need to remove it from the root
<infinisil> "Use the zfs inherit command to clear a user property"
<infinisil> and you can't clear native properties
<infinisil> what property is it?
<infinisil> hyper_ch: ^^
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<hyper_ch> ok got it :)
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<hyper_ch> zfs inherit $wrong_property tank/encZFS/Media :)
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<gchristensen> ocharles: oh maybe it is ...
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<gchristensen> copumpkin: any chance you're in NYC this week?
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<srhb> When I deploy on my gce with machine with nixops, I always get this after longer uodates: fetch-ssh-keys-start[30447]: 2017-10-08 14:06:57 ERROR 404: Not Found.
<srhb> Any idea what that does?
<gchristensen> sounds like it is trying to fetch SSH keys from some sort of GCE metadata serevice
<srhb> Indeed.
<infinisil> Oh god, idrisPackages uses idris1_1_1, which is not cached..
<srhb> It builds quickly!
<infinisil> it does?
<srhb> Yeah.
<infinisil> Let's see..
<srhb> ... Well, I've been hardened over the last few days, ymmv :P
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<gchristensen> I'm always surprised when I hear people talking about idris
<infinisil> The biggest thing I've compiled is either namecoind or firefox
<gchristensen> I was going to say I need to adjust my expectations about it being really niche / obscure, but then I remembered I'm in #nixos :)
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<infinisil> Heh yeah
<infinisil> I still haven't finished the book, I was like 2/5ths through
<srhb> There's a lot of filter bubble going on in haskell/idris/nix-land.
<srhb> :P
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<domenkozar> gchristensen: would be interesting to see if idris appears on any work day
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<gchristensen> domenkozar: :)
<gchristensen> srhb: one day I'll learn a proper functional language
<srhb> gchristensen: Nix totally counts. if only it had proper types :-)
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<domenkozar> dhall is shaping nicely
<srhb> It is!
<srhb> I need an excuse to use dhall for something.
<domenkozar> wait until you get
<domenkozar> set is not a boolean at anonymous position
<domenkozar> that sounds like a good excuse
<infinisil> before discovering nix i didn't even know a functional language without proper typing could exist
<srhb> domenkozar: Right, but ripping out nixlang seems... Hard :P
<domenkozar> you don't rip it out
<domenkozar> just slowly eat it :D
<domenkozar> well can't do that for modules
<srhb> I'm all ears. If we could incrementally replace things, that would be glorious.
<domenkozar> actually you could go modules, unless values depend on config
<srhb> I suppose we can compile dhall to nix, but that seems lackluster.
<infinisil> srhb: replacing what exactly?
<srhb> infinisil: Some nix expressions with dhall.
<domenkozar> srhb: one of the main feautres is taht it compiles to nix/json
* infinisil checks out dhall
<srhb> domenkozar: Right. I mean, that's not terrible, but what would really sell it would be as a drop-in replacement. Like, if it transparently just worked as an alternative to nix expressions.
<srhb> But that's *hard*
<domenkozar> well the fact that gabriel wanted to write nixfmt
<domenkozar> and then ended up with dhall 3 months later
<domenkozar> says a lot
<infinisil> srhb: Is it possible to even do that?
<infinisil> Because if one wants a perfect nix replacement, the language would have to be exactly as powerful as nix
<srhb> infinisil: I think we want less power, not more.
<srhb> So no.
<srhb> But some things could totally be done.
<infinisil> I don't get it then, why less?
<MichaelRaskin> Well, some parts of NixOS use Nix language to the limit and would have a use for slightly more expressiveness…
<srhb> I'm being slightly facetious, but conceptually, there's a reason that dhalls brags about not being turing complete.
<MichaelRaskin> Of course, less powerful languages allow to block more problems in advance.
<srhb> One of the reasons is that you can't guarantee termination if you're also turing complete
<srhb> That's just one example.
<MichaelRaskin> You cannot have NixOS module system if you have guaranteed termination
<srhb> Right.
<infinisil> Alright fair enough, that's a plus, while being less powerful
<MichaelRaskin> I am not saying this is definitely a bad thing, but.
<infinisil> but what about typing
<srhb> infinisil: Typing also means that fewer programs are permissible
<infinisil> typing is more powerful than no typing
<srhb> Nope
<srhb> Less.
<srhb> Strictly.
<infinisil> Oh, i get it
<srhb> The concept of "power" in programming languages is a bit upside down :)
<LnL> MichaelRaskin: are you sure about that?
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<MichaelRaskin> LnL: oh well, not «will sit down and write a paper» sure
<MichaelRaskin> But quite close.
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<srhb> infinisil: Yeah, we want to admit fewer bad programs (less power) which gives us more "power" to reason, while disallowing as few as possible "good" programs.
<srhb> infinisil: It's tricky.
<infinisil> got it
<srhb> :)
<MichaelRaskin> LnL: I think we can implement Ackermann function purely on NixOS module system by using complicated mergers.
<infinisil> MichaelRaskin: Couldn't one just say that the nixos module systems allows a maximum of 100 levels? Then termination would be guaranteed
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<MichaelRaskin> Depth-counting has this property of eventually biting you…
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<infinisil> care to explain?
<srhb> If we solve Nix, I'm sure serendipity will make a proper module system fall out :-)(
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* infinisil looks up serendipity
<saf_spa> Hi there, is this correct that Nixos automatically creates 10 buildusers, yet it does not use them (nix.nrBuildUsers)? I cant find what causes them to be created. I am interested in automed creation, because manual only states how to create them imperatively.
<MichaelRaskin> Well, Nix evolution is _all_ about «nobody would need such computational expressiveness power» — «oops, everyone does it inside Nix, let us add a more efficient implementation into the language»
<LnL> given that options are finite, I think you can guarantee that evaluation makes progress and will terminate
<srhb> saf_spa: Pretty sure that option controls their creation as well
<saf_spa> srhb: on test machine "# cat /etc/passwd | grep nixbld| wc -l" returns 10, yet I have no such option set
<MichaelRaskin> LnL: I think you can create options dynamically. I think NixOS _uses_ this.
<srhb> saf_spa: It might inherit from maxJobs?
<saf_spa> srhb: thanks,..
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<saf_spa> srhb: no, I am using completely stock configuration.nix, only basic things enabled, nothing fancy added
<srhb> saf_spa: Anyway, read that module, it should help you get to know where to look :)
<srhb> saf_spa: There are default values everywhere
<infinisil> srhb: saf_spa: The default is 10
<saf_spa> srhb: ah, correct!
<saf_spa> srhb: perhaps you guys want to update manual (paragraph 6.2) with this. =)
<saf_spa> thanks! :)
<srhb> saf_spa: Can you link?
<srhb> infinisil: 32, it appears!
<srhb> At least now.
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<LnL> MichaelRaskin: hmm, if that's possible I've never seen it used anywhere
<MichaelRaskin> LnL: I think that is how systemd services are created
<infinisil> Ah you talking about maxJobs, nrBuildUsers is 10 by default though
<MichaelRaskin> You load a module, it adds an option inside systemd.services, systemd module aggregates them.
<srhb> saf_spa: I'm unsure if that makes sense changing, since that's Nix possibly without NixOS
<srhb> Am I misreading that
<LnL> MichaelRaskin: I think you're thinking of submodules
<infinisil> srhb: huh
<infinisil> hwhat
<saf_spa> the nix-daemon seems to create 10 users and use value of nrBuildUsers = 10 by default, but there is no relation in it actually creating the build users, if configuration.nix specifies different nrBuildUsers value. Is this correct? So, if different nrBuldUsers specified, those have to be created imperatively?
<srhb> saf_spa: That's not how I understand it, but let me just test.
<MichaelRaskin> LnL: I prefer not to use NixOS module system, so I am not sure about naming.
<srhb> saf_spa: I just increased it to 40 from 32 and I now have a nixgld40 user
<srhb> saf_spa: No imperativeness involved.
<saf_spa> srhb: interesting! thank you!
<srhb> saf_spa: But without NixOS (plain nix!) you have a different problem.
<srhb> saf_spa: Hence the manual instructions for Nix (not NixOS)
<saf_spa> well, I will be using it with nixos, but thanks for the warning. I see the point!
<srhb> saf_spa: Great! :) For the record, I just set it back to 32 (default value since 17.09 at least) and it autoremoved the others :)
<infinisil> huh, in my nixpkgs, the value is 10
<infinisil> I'm on unstable
<saf_spa> srhb: do you have "users.enforceIdUniqueness = false;"
<saf_spa> srhb: oh, wrong option, sorry
<saf_spa> I am newb :)
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<srhb> saf_spa: I have it true, according to nixos-option
<saf_spa> srhb: I meant mutableUsers
<srhb> Yes, I have that true as well.
<srhb> Got bitten by that one time too many :-P
<saf_spa> srhb: interesting... that means in this case nix/nixos will modify these users anyway.
<srhb> immutable users means _you_ don't get to manage users outside of nix.
<srhb> So if you have it set to false, Nix will overwrite, rather than merge, its user configuration with /etc/passwd
<saf_spa> srhb: yes, mutableUsers = false (not default) causes nix to manage users/groups, so imperative way is removed. But "false" doesn't remove /home/ content, does it? Any chance you know it?
<srhb> It does not, no.
<saf_spa> srhb: ok, thanks
<srhb> The most catastrophic thing it could cause (I think) is locking you out of your system, not losing data from /home
<srhb> And only if you make a mistake anyway ;-)
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<LnL> MichaelRaskin: either way, I'm pretty sure that's not a problem as long as you can guarantee that lists and attrs are finite
<infinisil> srhb: Am currently 40 minutes into compiling idris.. you consider that quick??
<joepie91> gchristensen: your hound is broken; no repos in the list
<srhb> infinisil: Hey, I've been recompiling ceph over and over these last few days, over 3 hours per time, have some patience :-)
<MichaelRaskin> LnL: «guarantee something is finite» is a more complicated notion than we would prefer…
<infinisil> srhb: Oh god, no incremental compilation?
<srhb> (Status: Binaries link correctly. Python scripts still fubar. Source still impure. Working on it)
<srhb> infinisil: Nope.
<srhb> Not that I could figure out
<srhb> I mean, without Nix, sure.
<saf_spa> srhb: say, I have 16 core cpu (8 physical, 16 logical via HT) . What better values of maxJobs, buildCores and nrBuildUsers would you recommend? Ofc I would gladly take advice from anyone who has experience here too.
<saf_spa> nix defaults to 1 maxJobs...
<srhb> saf_spa: I'd just go with the default of 32 and nice things if I need to do something else while building
<srhb> oh, maxJobs
<srhb> Uh, that's difficult
<srhb> Some jobs parallellize and some do not.
<srhb> So you'll get wildly different values
<saf_spa> srhb: ah I see, there are some collisions..
<srhb> What is your goal? Speed? Responsiveness?
<saf_spa> srhb: just that stuff gets built sufficiently fast. More reliability, but not wasting time.
<srhb> Honestly, stick in some value high enough that your cpu has stuff to do and control the rest via priorities.
<saf_spa> I get it that maxJobs > 1 is unpredictable, correct?
<srhb> It should not be, no.
<srhb> Some builds don't parallelize well, but separate jobs should, afaik.
<srhb> And the ones that don't parallelize well should have it disabled anyway.
<srhb> "don't worry about it, have a cup of coffee"
<srhb> Hmm, is stterm hiding somewhere in nixpkgs?
<saf_spa> ok :)
<srhb> Ah, "st"
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<adisbladis> Still looking for a decent terminal
<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-17.09-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/769317f5de (from 2 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-17.09-small)
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<srhb> I tend to like suckless tools
<srhb> And I just noticed that xterm is older than me, which I can't accept.
<srhb> (How does that even work? It was called XFree86, right? So how is xterm from 84?) >_>
<adisbladis> srhb: I have very few requirements. One of them is search in the scrollback buffer.
<adisbladis> Which very few terminals have
<srhb> I solve that via tmux
<srhb> Which brings me a lot of other problems, but that's life. :-P
<adisbladis> Me and tmux were never good friends :P
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<srhb> I don't know how to get vi bindings in scrollback in any other way.
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<srhb> eck, looks like st can't dynamically alter font size. That's out then.
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<adisbladis> srhb: Ahhh thats probably requirement number two :)
<srhb> Indeed.
<adisbladis> I'm using konsole now, but not very happy with performance
<adisbladis> srhb: https://github.com/esmil/stupidterm/ looks pretty nice
<adisbladis> I dont think it can do search but it's pretty minimal and can do resizing
<srhb> I might give that a go, thanks :)
<srhb> Break time.
<ocharles> Btw, that argument about totality stopping the module system is likely not true. We know how to describe non total programs in a total language, it just needs support from the RTS to execute them
<hyper_ch> clever: awake again? got a question regarding your justdoit
<ocharles> Idris gives that support by letting you specify something is partial (a notion of "fuel" for guarded recursion )
<infinisil> Still compiling idris btw, 1 hour has passed
<srhb> infinisil: Sorry :P
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<grahamc> Obnoxious, joepie91, I wish it failed the service or tried again if it fails to fetch repo updates. I’ll restart t soon b
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<grahamc> srhb st can’t do ANYTHING lol
<srhb> grahamc: I noticed :P
<srhb> I have the suckless screen lock which is FINE.
<srhb> For my terminal, maybe not...
<srhb> The fanaticism of it appeals, though.
<grahamc> Can it even scroll? Alacritty can’t even scroll
<srhb> No, it cannot.
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<infinisil> there's a PR for it!
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<MichaelRaskin> ocharles: I think the current module system is undecidably untotal, though
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<Mic92> tmux can scroll
<joepie91> grahamc: ah, so this happens whenever it can't reach upstream?
<joepie91> that seems like a pretty stupid failure mode...
<joepie91> would probably be more sensible to just serve stale data and add a note about it being out of date
<Mic92> scrolling in alacritty would be pointless for my usecase with nested tmux sessions
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<gchristensen> joepie91: well only if it can't reach it on startup
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<infinisil> Mic92: Can you scroll with the mouse it tmux?
<gchristensen> joepie91: fixed
<joepie91> gchristensen: wait, does it keep it all in memory...?
<gchristensen> I dunno
<joepie91> anyway, thanks :)
<gchristensen> joepie91: https://github.com/etsy/hound if you want to find out / fix it, by all means :)
<srhb> Has anyone seen this on unstable? ockerd[22159]: time="2017-10-08T15:35:11.842101695+02:00" level=info msg="Loading containers: start."
<srhb> Er
<joepie91> gchristensen: unfortunately I don't do Go :P
<srhb> Wrong line
<LnL> yeah that hound bug is annoying
<srhb> Error starting daemon: Error initializing network controller: list bridge addresses failed: no available network
<gchristensen> joepie91: ok :)
<gchristensen> joepie91: me either
<joepie91> but yeah, does seem to be using memory storage?
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<joepie91> no database setup instructions or such anyway
<Mic92> infinisil: yes, it has mouse support
<Mic92> I personally disabled it though
<gchristensen> I mean it has a local data dir
<LnL> I think it keeps all of the metadata in memory
<LnL> or something like that
<gchristensen> yeah I think so too
<gchristensen> if anyone wants to patch it, I'll gladly apply it for my deploy :)
<srhb> Are interfaces defined declaratively supposed to be recreated on rebuild switch automatically if they've been destroyed?
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<grahamc> Nics?
<srhb> Yes
<srhb> Sorry
<grahamc> I think our nic config is a bit hairy around switching
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<grahamc> In particular around setting up and tearing down bonds.
<srhb> Hum..
<grahamc> I would however expect them to be recreated
<srhb> I create an ip4 interface with switch, then I deleted it by hand with ip link delete dev ifacename, then I tried switching, and I see infinite hang
<srhb> Maybe there's a timeout at some point :-)
<srhb> Interesting, if I recreate it as a dummy device manually and switch again, it gets torn down and recreating correctly.
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<MichaelRaskin> By the way, re: learning curve. I was asked what is the simplest and most consistent way to use Nix imperatively, like apt only better.
<MichaelRaskin> It looks like we recommend -iA for nix-env, but then -iA and -e take _different_ arguments to install and remove the same package.
<LnL> gchristensen: do you have a log for the failed start?
<infinisil> MichaelRaskin: Yeah that's pretty bad UX
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Ma27 opened pull request #30220: lambda-mod-zsh-theme: 2017-07-05 -> 2017-10-08 (master...lambda-mod-update) https://git.io/vdz7e
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<infinisil> It might be better with nix 1.12, haven't checked it out
<MichaelRaskin> Right now it seems to lack new manpages…
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<srhb> ack, networking is so confusing...
<infinisil> this might be the reason I didn't switch when I checked it out shortly previously. I can't live without manpages
<srhb> Is there a way to define the docker0 interface exactly as docker expects it? Like, so that it will start up on it.
<infinisil> srhb: Doesn't the docker option do that?
<srhb> It appears to expect a bridge device, but I'm not sure how to declare that with the nixos networking options
<srhb> It doesn't appear to, let me check the module source..
<MichaelRaskin> infinisil: there is also a risk of schema version upgrade…
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<gchristensen> checkingg, lnl
<srhb> No, looks like it relies on docker creating it, which I don't want.
<infinisil> Ah, because I've seen the docker interface before when i enabled it, didn't know it was created by docker iteslf
<infinisil> MichaelRaskin: Schema version upgrade?
<srhb> Am I understanding correctly that bridges.fooname.interfaces = []; should create a fooname bridge interface?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] danbst opened pull request #30221: nixos-generate-config: lessen priority for cpuFreqGovernor (master...patch-14) https://git.io/vdz7X
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<MichaelRaskin> infinisil: Nix uses an SQL DB for metadata, and some version bumps upgrade the schema, and there has been a case where a specific unstable commit of Nix was annoying to use due to bugs and had a new schema which made trivial rollbacks impossible.
<infinisil> Ah i see
<gchristensen> you can use the unstable nix client with stable nix daemon, that is safe to do
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 closed pull request #30216: Minio exporter (master...minio-exporter) https://git.io/vdzXU
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<MichaelRaskin> That's true and a good idea.
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<gchristensen> one day I'll switch to that :)
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdz5L
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 2ab99df Maximilian Bosch: lambda-mod-zsh-theme: 2017-07-05 -> 2017-10-08
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master db6e138 Jörg Thalheim: Merge pull request #30220 from Ma27/lambda-mod-update...
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<MichaelRaskin> So what is the current best imperative UI choice?
<gchristensen> sorry?
<gchristensen> can I say "shouting"?
<MichaelRaskin> > It looks like we recommend -iA for nix-env, but then -iA and -e take _different_ arguments to install and remove the same package.
<gchristensen> ugh yeah I also wish we just didn't talk about nix-env and instead just treated it as the UX nightmare of plumbing it is
<MichaelRaskin> Is there anything to replace it, though?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Mic92 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdz5W
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master dfd9a2b Alexey Shmalko: escrotum: Init at 2017-01-28
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master df51d64 Jörg Thalheim: Merge pull request #30218 from rasendubi/escrotum...
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<gchristensen> nix-darwin is good, at work I built a tool nix-rebuild so people don't have to go all the way with nix-darwin
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<MichaelRaskin> Well, this seems to be more declarative-style.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] peti pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdz5x
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master c45c4a7 Vaibhav Sagar: hackage: update snapshot of 'all-cabal-hashes' repo for callHackage
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 582ce63 Peter Simons: Merge pull request #30210 from vaibhavsagar/update-all-cabal-hashes...
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<gchristensen> LnL: oy
<srhb> OK, so I figured it out. In case anyone is interested, I defined a custom bridge bridges.docker-bridge, a custom interface docker-bridge with an address and prefixLength, and I passed "--bridge=docker-bridge" to the docker daemon with extraOptions.
<srhb> It... SEEMS to behave.
<gchristensen> MichaelRaskin: yeah I suppose so
<LnL> gchristensen: ?
<roi_du_silence> heyo
<roi_du_silence> I'm trying out glfw-b on nixos
<sphalerite> srhb: one thing I've noticed with getting applications to use a user-defined bridge is that it breaks if you rebuild and the bridge gets removed and readded as a result
<roi_du_silence> stack is yelling at me : fatal error: X11/extensions/randr.h: No such file or directory
<srhb> sphalerite: Thanks for the warning. :)
<roi_du_silence> during the compilation of bindings-GLFW
<roi_du_silence> even though I already have xorg.libXrandr and xorg/libXrandr.dev listed as dependencies in the nix section of my stack.yaml file
<roi_du_silence> where else should I look ?
<sphalerite> srhb: it can be fixed with brctl addif, but it's fiddly. I started writing a script to save/restore it but I haven't finished that yet
<srhb> sphalerite: I'll keep my eyes open.
<gchristensen> LnLLnL: the continue is annnoying, and I wonder how tricky it'll be to fix the isssue as newsearcher probably doeesn't return return a searcher if it fails
<srhb> roi_du_silence: I've never gotten stack to work on NixOS.
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Do you absolutely need it?
<roi_du_silence> it works fine with gloss.
<srhb> Oh.
<roi_du_silence> it's very useful for cross compil
<roi_du_silence> I guess I could try cabal new-build
<roi_du_silence> but no, I don't absolutely need it
<srhb> I find it easier to just work with cabal and nix
<roi_du_silence> still, if there was a fix for that error, I'd take it.
<srhb> cabal-install, that is.
<srhb> Sure.
<Mic92> xf86-video-intel is broken
<roi_du_silence> Mic92: was that directed at me ?
<LnL> gchristensen: you could replace it with `return nil, errs, err` to make it bail out if one of the repos fails
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<gchristensen> oh true
<adisbladis> Mic92: I noticed so too. Is there any point in keeping it around anymore?
<Mic92> roi_du_silence: no I just realized it was not compiling
<roi_du_silence> ok ok
<adisbladis> Mic92: I think some other distros (fedora most notably) are dropping xf86-video-intel
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<sphalerite> yeah isn't it replaced by modesetting?
<adisbladis> Yes it is.
<Mic92> adisbladis: yes they do. I had some freezing problems on my hardware
<adisbladis> I dont know if there is still some hardware depending on it.
<gchristensen> LnL: if len(searchers) == 0 { return nil, false, nil } maybe something like this
<roi_du_silence> srhb : how do you get cabal to work nicely with nix ?
<adisbladis> Mic92: With modesetting?
<LnL> gchristensen: then you might get a nil error
<LnL> yeah that could work
<Mic92> adisbladis: some cpu bug, where the computer cannot recover from s6, switching to intel driver helped for some strange reason, might be wrong though
<gchristensen> I'd rather it just try again later but a fatalf there would be fine too
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<roi_du_silence> either way there is no Xrandr.h on the system.. that's weird af
<adisbladis> Mic92: I'm gonna have a look around and see what other distros are doing about that driver
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<Mic92> adisbladis: debian and fedora switched to modsettings
<LnL> seems like it just removes all of the failed repos from the config
<roi_du_silence> NO WAIT
<roi_du_silence> WTF
<srhb> roi_du_silence: It just does out of the box.
<gchristensen> LnL: yeah, but the searcher won't exist so it won't try again I think
<roi_du_silence> the folder is hidden.
<srhb> roi_du_silence: But there's a whole user guide to the haskell infrastructure in Nix :)
<adisbladis> Mic92: Ahh debian too.
<srhb> roi_du_silence: Huh?
<roi_du_silence> it's really friggin weird
<roi_du_silence> look
<LnL> gchristensen: maybe checking len(searchers) != len(errs) is the most correct thing to do
<roi_du_silence> Oh
<roi_du_silence> no
<roi_du_silence> disregard
<roi_du_silence> ..it's in there why can't stack get it
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<srhb> Did you tell it to use nix for it?
<srhb> It might work, not sure.
<roi_du_silence> ..
<srhb> You'll still lose the haskell binary cache of nix by using it though.
<roi_du_silence> I do use stack build --nix and I have the nix conf specified
<roi_du_silence> the problem here is that stack is looking for randr.h and the file is named Xrandr.h
<srhb> Yeha okay, that's what I usually experience too.
<srhb> Oh.
<musicmatze[m]> Good day. I'm still trying to package a rust package which does not have a Cargo.lock file in the repository ... the issue I'm running into is documented here: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/29981
<musicmatze[m]> can someone help?
<roi_du_silence> and /nix/store is read only.
<roi_du_silence> so I don't know how
<musicmatze[m]> I also just pinged the maintainers.
<roi_du_silence> to solve this
<musicmatze[m]> s/the maintainers/the maintainers of the rust packaging infrastructure in nixpkgs/
<srhb> I will go back to 'dont use stack'
<srhb> Try reading the user guide to the haskell infrastructure in nix
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<gchristensen> trying to download go uild tooling on a train going through rural new york is an exciting thing to try /s
<srhb> gchristensen: Extreme sports for developers
<roi_du_silence> I read it already; I really don't want to let a single X letter stop me
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<roi_du_silence> I wonder if I can tell stack to get the header somewhere else in the shell.nix
<hyper_ch> tilpner: online?
<gchristensen> curlis measuring my download rate in bytes
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<roi_du_silence> Yeah, I can
<roi_du_silence> =)
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<woffs> Can nar's already be fetched via IPFS?
<roi_du_silence> shrb: I think stack is pretty awesome overall and pretty handy to update/reverse compiler versions etc
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<roi_du_silence> I know you can do the same with nix itself. But all my projects use stack and I don't always dev on nix
<roi_du_silence> os
<roi_du_silence> so stack fits me pretty well
<srhb> roi_du_silence: That makes perfect sense. I'm not saying Stack is bad, it just doesn't play well with Nix. :)
<srhb> roi_du_silence: So it might be easier to use it from another system
<srhb> Or in a virtual machine.
<srhb> But sure, you can manage the shell.nix manually entirely.
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<srhb> If that's where the problem is, it should be easy to fix.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] Nadrieril opened pull request #30222: purple-hangouts: 2016-12-22 -> 2017-10-08 (master...update-purple-hangouts) https://git.io/vdzbB
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<infinisil> woffs: Don't think any work has been done for that
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<srhb> roi_du_silence: If you're still stuck, there's also a #haskell-stack channel, and you can try to share your repository (here and there) if you want someone to try and give it a go :)
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzNP
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 07efaaa Vladimír Čunát: xorg-server: security 1.19.3 -> 1.19.4...
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<roi_du_silence> shrb : I'm sorry, I wasn't explicit
<roi_du_silence> when I said "Yeah I can" I meant; just making a shell.nix solves the issue
<roi_du_silence> and makes stack use nix's own paths instead of the "generic" ones
<srhb> Oh!
<srhb> Sorry, I misunderstood :)
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to release-17.09: https://git.io/vdzAU
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/release-17.09 68ddb64 Vladimír Čunát: xorg-server: security 1.19.3 -> 1.19.4...
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<shlevy> Anyone working on moving NixOS to use systemd dynamic users? Pretty cool stuff
<gchristensen> lgtm :)
<hyper_ch> systemd dynamic users? oO
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<Laboon3k> What the fine is it?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to release-17.03: https://git.io/vdzAi
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/release-17.03 ab269d8 Vladimír Čunát: xorg-server: security 1.19.2 -> 1.19.4...
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<Laboon3k> Quick question: who is the current 'maintainer' of mailing list?
<gchristensen> niksnut
<shlevy> Eliminates the need to allocate uids to system services in a huge portion of cases
* hyper_ch is still waiting for systemd to for the kernel...
<MichaelRaskin> Let's just say that this is an addition to systemd that makes sense from my point of view.
<shlevy> MichaelRaskin: Yeah, exactly. I dislike a lot of what systemd does but a service daemon absolutely should have features like this one
<MichaelRaskin> (and I think systemd is a poster child of mission creep that destroys Linux ecosystem)
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<Laboon3k> My messages to the Google nix-devel mail list were destroyed without a trace...
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<Fare> MichaelRaskin, is there a good alternative these days?
<MichaelRaskin> I actually run sinit on my notebook.
<MichaelRaskin> (because all the interesting work is actually done by some Lisp code)
<makefu> i think systemd got a whole lot cooler with http://0pointer.net/blog/dynamic-users-with-systemd.html
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzx4
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 9f1b54b Vladimír Čunát: tigervnc: fixup build after xorgserver changes...
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<shlevy> makefu: That's what started us on this discussion :D
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<MichaelRaskin> I think cancer doesn't get cool enough just by starting glowing in the dark
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<makefu> ah damn backlog
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<bonk``> why do nixos_github need to join/leave the chan every time it posts? why not just have it idling in the chan?
<MichaelRaskin> I think it is a single bot that changes nick when talking in different channels
<clever> bonk``: because it also reports to projects other then nixos
<clever> if the channel was -n, it could message without joining
<clever> but then somebody started to spam
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 1 new commit to release-17.09: https://git.io/vdzx1
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/release-17.09 c156d34 Vladimír Čunát: tigervnc: fixup build after xorgserver changes...
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<hyper_ch> clever: great that you're here.... is there a reason why you don't make sda1 bootable in your justdoit?
<clever> hyper_ch: the boot flag in the partition table hasnt done anything in decades
<clever> when grub is installed into the MBR, the boot flag means nothing
<hyper_ch> clever: you're sure?
<clever> yes
<clever> ive read the source for grub
<hyper_ch> ok :)
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<hyper_ch> clever: so, on my media dataset I did restrict auto snapshots to just "hourly".... I have a pool of my fav. tv shows and I download current episodes of shows that I follow and delete them once I watched them... so no need to keep the stuff longer.... still need to test how I wanna handle the VMs dataset... I assume when you have a vm running it will increase quite in say from snapshot to snapshot
<hyper_ch> and one problem is: I still do get tons of input/output errors with zfs.... never had those with ext4
<clever> i havent gotten io errors on my arrays
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<infinisil> Where do you see those errors hyper_ch ?
<hyper_ch> everywhere
<hyper_ch> e.g. download a few video files today... one of them had io error and needed to be redownloaded again
<infinisil> Like in journalctl?
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<infinisil> I don't know what I'm looking at
<hyper_ch> infinisil: zpool status -v
<hyper_ch> cp //nix/store/30m1bksfiqgbrh11k4i8xr6lc8rild45-squashfs.img /dev/null
<hyper_ch> cp: error reading '//nix/store/30m1bksfiqgbrh11k4i8xr6lc8rild45-squashfs.img': Input/output error
<infinisil> Never ran this myself
<hyper_ch> scrub your pool
<hyper_ch> then run it
<hyper_ch> and I get those errors
<clever> hyper_ch: what does "zpool events" say?
<hyper_ch> and the files listed are corrupted
<clever> and again with -v
<infinisil> Does this only happen in the encrypted dataset?
<hyper_ch> I only have encrypted dataset
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<moet> how do i turn on python-plugin support in vim?
<moet> i've been trying all manner of (vim_configurable.override { python = true; }) in systemPackages, but nixos-rebuild errors
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<musicmatze[m]> I'm still trying to package a rust package which does not have a Cargo.lock file in the repository ... the issue I'm running into is documented here: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/29981 - can someone help me with this?
<srhb> moet: It;s pythonSupport iirc
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<srhb> moet: Though I'm not sure if an override like that works even...
<LnL> moet: don't remember how to override it, but it should be enabled by default with vim_configurable
<tilpner> hyper_ch - Yes?
<srhb> Does dedup on the store make sense if I have hardlinking enabled?
<hyper_ch> tilpner: as you recommended, I did put the stuff into different files :)
<srhb> (If not, which should I prefer?)
<moet> srhb, LnL nixos manual says to do `environment.systemPackages = [ (pkgs.emacs.override { gtk = pkgs.gtk3; }) ];` to override the set of arguments provided to the pkgs.emacs function
<moet> i extrapolated from that about vim_configurable
<srhb> moet: Yeah, unfortunately they're nothing alike.
<hyper_ch> srhb: from what I gather, dedup works also on partial files
<tilpner> hyper_ch - Was there any problem that you needed me for?
<srhb> hyper_ch: True.
<hyper_ch> tilpner: already fixed :)
<srhb> I think it's block level.
<tilpner> Oh, good :)
<hyper_ch> yeah, it's block level.. at least the presentation for encrypted zfs did also go into dedup and it's possible there...
<moet> srhb: heh.. well i couldn't find documentation about it, and reading pkgs/applications/editors/vim/configurable.nix lead me to believe i could pass in an argument called `python`
<Mic92> b/go 12
<moet> pythonSupport also exists in that file, but it doesn't seem to be used anywhere
<srhb> moet: I think the python argument is actually python, the interpreter.
<moet> oooh..
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<srhb> But it looks like config.vim.python might be interesting
<LnL> moet: yeah, it uses composableDerivation
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<srhb> Strangely it appears to be on by default.
<srhb> So just using vim_configurable should give you python support
<moet> i don't see composableDerivation documented in the nixos manual or the nix manual..
<moet> or the nixpkgs manua
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat pushed 13 new commits to staging: https://git.io/vdzhu
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/staging 0071b61 gnidorah: libdrm: enable tests
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/staging e16d95b Gabriel Ebner: mesa: 17.1.10 -> 17.2.2
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/staging 0df6a8f Vladimír Čunát: Merge #30196: mesa: 17.1.10 -> 17.2.2
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] vcunat closed pull request #30196: mesa: 17.1.10 -> 17.2.2 (staging...mesa172) https://git.io/vdzU3
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<gchristensen> dedup is also is strongly cautioned against
<srhb> gchristensen: How come?
<gchristensen> it works great until you write a byte too much and you can't mount it anymore b/c you can't fit the dedupe table in ram
<gchristensen> and your only option to recover is buy more ram or restore from a backup
<moet> srhb: thanks
<srhb> Oh, fun.
<gchristensen> they caution b/c most use cases don't benefit from it and put their data at risk
<MichaelRaskin> Can't you just add swap??
<gchristensen> I don't think so
<nwspk> I'm trying to add a Nix-expression for a Python-library which works fine if I'm adding it to a shell.nix and starting nix-shell. However, I added the package to the pkgs/top-level/python-packages.nix-file but don't know how to test the library now. Is it possible to start a nix-shell against my nixpkgs-repo?
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<srhb> dedup is off then. Why are all the cool features always terrible x_x
<gchristensen> zfs has a lot of cool features that aren't so risky
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<LnL> ^ compression is nice and doesn't have a significant cost like dedup
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<gchristensen> compression is really nice :)
<hyper_ch> simple solution would be to have more ram than diskspace for safe dedupe?
<LnL> I almost have a ~1.6 ratio on my desktop
<gchristensen> yeah I guess I should just get 2TB of RAM for my 1TB disk
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<srhb> I'd love that. :-P
<adisbladis> Compression is extra nice because in my experience it also leads to better performance :)
<tilpner> nwspk - nix-shell -f ~/dev/nixpkgs ...
<tilpner> nwspk - Or change your NIX_PATH for the invocation of nix-shell
<srhb> How do you see compression rate?
<srhb> ah, compressratio
<srhb> 2.12x on store. Nifty.
<tilpner> Any stability problems with zfs *at all*?
<adisbladis> tilpner: I started using zfsonlinux maybe 6-7 years ago. Not really any stability problems.
<nwspk> tilpner: are you sure about the `-f`-flag?
<nwspk> >error: unknown flag ‘-f’
<adisbladis> Must have been around 2011
<tilpner> nwspk - Oh, that is embarassing. Just nix-shell ~/dev/nixpkgs -A foo
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<srhb> Won't that just bring the deps into scope?
<nwspk> tilpner: I tried this but couldn't import my lib in the python-REPL
<srhb> Perhaps you want nix-build
<srhb> Ah
<srhb> Then you want -f ~/dev/nixpkgs -p yourpackage
<nwspk> This also fails with "pre-defined" libs where I know that they're working
<srhb> (I think)
<tilpner> nwspk - Have an example?
<nwspk> I think this works fine with "programs", but seems to fail with python-libs
<nwspk> tilpner: $ nix-shell PATH -A python27Packages.bottle
<nwspk> tilpner: start a python-repl and try to `import bottle`
<srhb> Maybe there's a pythonWithPackages thing
<nwspk> srhb: I think so…
<tilpner> Huh, this is weird. There's a difference in URL handling for nix-shell -A and nix-shell -p
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] NeQuissimus pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdzjL
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master c643759 Tim Steinbach: kbfs: Add package in module
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] NeQuissimus pushed 1 new commit to release-17.09: https://git.io/vdzjt
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/release-17.09 81ebbbc Tim Steinbach: kbfs: Add package in module...
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<nwspk> nix-shell doesn't accepts a path as first argument if you're passing `-p`
<srhb> No, that'll be the top level name
<tilpner> Fetches nixexprs: nix-shell 'https://nixos.org/channels/nixos-17.09/nixexprs.tar.xz' -A python27Packages.bottle
<tilpner> Doesn't fetch nixexprs: nix-shell 'https://nixos.org/channels/nixos-17.09/nixexprs.tar.xz' -p python27Packages.bottle
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<tilpner> nwspk - nix-shell -I nixpkgs=https://nixos.org/channels/nixos-unstable/nixexprs.tar.xz -p python27Packages.bottle seems to work
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<nwspk> tilpner: thanks, that works and I can enter the shell with my package, but can't import it
<nwspk> I'll check if I forgot something
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] woffs opened pull request #30223: devtodo: adjust platforms (master...platforms) https://git.io/vdzju
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<srhb> nix-shell -E 'with (import <nixpkgs> {}); (python2.withPackages (ps: with ps; [ flask ])).env'
<srhb> I thought there was one.
<tilpner> nwspk - "import bottle" works in nix-shell -I nixpkgs=https://nixos.org/channels/nixos-unstable/nixexprs.tar.xz --pure -p python27Packages.bottle --run python2
<srhb> You can easily alias this to add arbitrary amounts of packages to the list
<srhb> ps will be the corresponding python package set.
<srhb> Actually, that should work with -p too
<srhb> nix-shell -p '(python2.withPackages (ps: with ps; [ flask matplotlib bottle]))'
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-17.03-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/ab269d8947 (from 80 minutes ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-17.03-small)
<srhb> gets rid of the import
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<srhb> And then you can add --pure to make sure you're not getting pollution :)
<nwspk> srhb: tilpner: thanks for your help
<nwspk> I figured out that I just had mistaken the packagename with the name for the import
<srhb> heh :-P
<nwspk> now I'm feeling kind of stupid :>
<nwspk> I should finish work for today, I guess
<srhb> Small mistakes are much more fun than bug ones.
<nwspk> definitely!
<noam> Hi, in which file do i need to have "allowUnfree = true;" for it to have effect when installing stuff with nix-env? It only effects system packages from "/etc/nixos/configuration.nix".
<srhb> noam: ~/.config/nixpkgs/config.nix
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<noam> thanks, will try
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<schoppenhauer> hi. is it possible to tell nixos-install to use fewer connections at once, use a socks-proxy, or at least retry downloads a few times?
<srhb> adisbladis There's a pending PR on alacritty for zoom
<srhb> I'm sold
<srhb> Rust and OpenGL accel. I'm on board from principle alone.
<schoppenhauer> because I am in a very restrictive network here. and especially a very slow one.
<adisbladis[m]> Cool :) I'm pretty hopeful for that project
<noam> srhb: seems to work, thanks. this was harder to google than it should be
<srhb> noam: The split between nix and nixos and the like names make things... Iffy.
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-17.09-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/68ddb64d82 (from 2 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-17.09-small)
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<srhb> adisbladis[m]: Meh, it's slow as molasses here. Weird.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] andir opened pull request #30224: Cleanup typoed `propagateBuildInputs` that are probably not needded (master...cleanup) https://git.io/vdgeu
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] geistesk opened pull request #30226: pypcap: init at 1.1.6 (master...pypcap-1.1.6) https://git.io/vdgeK
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<fenton> trying to get wireless networking going. I've done whats in the manual an am not getting any error messages, but `ip a` reports the link down and `ifconfig` has no ip address. Ideas?
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<noam> srhb: For some reason, after i enabled allowUnfree, searching with "nix-env -qaP" shows results it didn't show before, even though some of these results have free license, for one 'nixos.python36Packages.python-jenkins' which have a bsd3 license according to the definition in nixpkgs itself
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<srhb> noam: Transitive unfree?
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<noam> hmm i'm not sure how to even check what can cause this
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<noam> oh you mean there is an unfree dependency maybe
<srhb> Just a guess.
<noam> that would make the most sense
<srhb> I don't see obvious candidates though..
<srhb> six doesn't have a license specified. Wonder what unfree does in that case.
<srhb> That should hit a LOT of packages though, so probably not it.
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<srhb> noam: Hm, I can't reproduce that with python-henkins.
<srhb> noam: Which version are you on?
<noam> srhb: 17.09
<noam> wait i might have messed up
<noam> yeah
<srhb> Oh, phew :)
<noam> srhb: my fault, i searched before without '.*bla.*'
<srhb> Ah :)
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<wilornel> Hi #nixos, do you know of a nice way to `fetchgit` in home-manager? rycee, is HM ran as the user running `home-manager switch`? fetchgit tries to add directories to the nix store in /nix/store. However, is it possible to have home-manager add these things to maybe ~/.config?
<srhb> wilornel: afaik home-manager also puts thing in the nix-store and then puts them into place in the home dir
<noam> i will need to go back to allowUnfree = false to make sure, but it's probably ok
<wilornel> We talked here recently about how fetchgit runs a clone command as a user that is not necessarily the current user executing home-manager
<srhb> wilornel: So the exact same thing here. :)
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<wilornel> srhb: it creates symbolic links in the home directory that point to things in the nix store, right?
<adisbladis> srhb: Compiling alacritty now :>
<srhb> wilornel: Right.
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<srhb> wilornel: Check out how home.file.???.text = ... works for instance
<wilornel> Yes, I was able to set home.file.".emacs.d".source to point to a public repository
<wilornel> now the issue I was facing was with private repositories
<srhb> There are some threads on how to use fetchgit with private repositories
<wilornel> just found my yubikey!!
<wilornel> aw yis
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-unstable-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/eefae49f6d (from 7 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-unstable-small)
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<wilornel> there are? Alright, I'll have to find those threads. I remember the few caveats and fixes you told me the other day but they were not quite elegant enough (maybe I didn't look into them enough as well)
<srhb> I don't recall what I said, if it was even me, but I'm sure they weren't elegant -- that's not how I roll. :-P
<infinisil> Private stuff in nix probably won't ever be elegant
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<infinisil> Well it might in the future, but some things need to change for it to work
<srhb> Indeed
<wilornel> what about running some commands as a user? what about moving parts of nix store to the user home directory?
<infinisil> Nope, that would be very problematic
<adisbladis> wilornel: You can always just do the chekout outside of nix and have the src attribute pointing to a directory.
<infinisil> That's probably the best thing to do as of now
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<wilornel> actually, that's right, that could be done very nicely
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<wilornel> have a script that does all the fetches you need
<srhb> Uhh, won't the source attribute pull it into nix?
<wilornel> can I have home-manager run a script every time it switches?
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-17.09-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/c156d34dd5 (from 2 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-17.09-small)
<adisbladis> srhb: Yes it will pull things into the nix store
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<wilornel> what about doing `git clone myrepo` then in home.nix just do home.file."myrepo".source = "the_path_of_my_repo_clone"
<srhb> Same issue then, isn't it?
<wilornel> wait, what?
<wilornel> what about simply `git clone myrepo` then in home.nix...
<adisbladis> srhb: Hm. Having very strange rendering with alacritty
<srhb> Stick binary encrypted blob in nix store, make sure to decrypt it when you log in. Problem solved!
<srhb> >>
<srhb> adisbladis: I gave up, it was much too laggy
<srhb> Rubber keys.
<srhb> Pity, I really wanted it to be good!
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<adisbladis> srhb: Huh, running it from a nix-shell was the cause of that rendering issue
<adisbladis> Now it seems to work alright
<srhb> Peculiar.
<hyper_ch> tilpner: still here?
<srhb> The problem with using xterm is that it's very, very fast :/
<tilpner> Yes?
<srhb> Hard to switch away.
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<sphalerite> srhb: how about st?
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<srhb> sphalerite: Looks like it won't be getting dynamic font size changing.
<adisbladis> sphalerite: It lacks pretty much any feature which is not "draw characters on the screen"
<srhb> sphalerite: I want that for presentations
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<srhb> alacritty is getting that at least (pr already open)
<sphalerite> srhb: alt+shift+pgUp/pgDown
<srhb> sphalerite: In st?
<sphalerite> it does have it :)
<sphalerite> yep
<srhb> wat
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<srhb> oooooh
<srhb> Well then!
<srhb> Time to figure out how to prettify it :-)
<tilpner> sphalerite - Woah. Time to take konsole out of my desktopEnv!
<sphalerite> :D
<sphalerite> and you can of course rebind it by editing config.h :p
<srhb> We could parameterize that...
<srhb> >>
<srhb> <<
<tilpner> That would be nice
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<tilpner> And package the patches, so that we can use "st with patches: scroll, etc."
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<srhb> tilpner: It already takes patches as argument
<tilpner> Why am I using a custom fetchgit then...?
<tilpner> :/
<srhb> Well it might not have them all packaged!
<srhb> But at least you can pass the patch files in :)
<obadz> anyone knows the difference between the keyctl's @u (user) vs @us (user session) keyrings?
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<infinisil> tilpner: what are you using as a terminal?
<tilpner> st
<tilpner> Some old version I didn't touch in years
<tilpner> master is "21 months" old
<infinisil> Oh :/
<srhb> Darn, xterm is still magnitudes faster. I wonder if it cheats when I'm catting a file somehow
<srhb> Oh well, it has nicer zoom contrls at least...
<srhb> st
<tilpner> My config also hasn't changed, which explains my unfamiliarity with its keybindings :P
<infinisil> I just want a terminal that doesn't have problems
<srhb> I've never had *problems* with xterm.
<tilpner> What problems does st have?
<infinisil> i tried out 4 different ones, and each had some annoyances
<srhb> It just has a really horrid interface for zoom :-P
<tilpner> I tried a bunch of different ones, including mlterm and cancer, but always went back to st
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<sphalerite> srhb: rebind it? :p
* tilpner kinda gave up on sixels
<srhb> sphalerite: I could... Probably. :-P
<infinisil> there's mostly only 2 kinds of programs i need: a terminal and a browser. If the terminal sucks, half of my linux experience sucks
<tilpner> Okay, the lack of text reflow is annoying with st...
<obadz> infinisil: roxterm
<woffs> does not-sucking browsers exist?
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<sphalerite> tilpner: that's what tmux is for!
<infinisil> currently I'm using konsole. The only major problem is how links always open a dialog asking which program i want to use to open it
<tilpner> woffs - No. Recent Firefox is good enough though
<tilpner> woffs - Unless you're referring to suckless/surf
<infinisil> obadz: I may have a look at it
<adisbladis> infinisil: Are you on kde? That behaviour is changed in system settings.
<woffs> after sakura I'm on urxvt for years
<infinisil> I'm not on any DE
<Yaniel> firefox 57 is surprisingly good
<tilpner> sphalerite - I have a tiling WM, what's the point of using nested tiling? (Other than reflow)
<MichaelRaskin> I use Firefox with Marionette for scripting various stuff.
<Yaniel> and urxvt has been excellent as long as I've used it
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<sphalerite> tilpner: none. But reflow and a persistent session are useful
<mmts> is anybody here successfully running NixOS as a XEN domU virtual guest client ? I am having problems with the generated grub.cfg, which doesn’t allow the client to boot "Unable to find partition containing kernel"
<adisbladis> infinisil: Try putting https://ptpb.pw/WpKV in ~/.config/kdeglobals
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<tilpner> sphalerite - I prefer easy-to-recreate sessions in combination with workspaces and suspend-to-disk (though that doesn't work on servers, where you have a point), so reflow is really the only thing missing. If st had that, there would be no need for tmux
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] pbogdan opened pull request #30227: newsbeuter: fix CVE-2017-12904 (master...newsbeuter-cve-2017-12904) https://git.io/vdgUk
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<sphalerite> tilpner: maybe there's a patch for it?
<sphalerite> I'm really bad at managing my terminal sessions
<srhb> What's text reflow?
<sphalerite> srhb: resize window, lines don't get screwed up
<srhb> Ah
<srhb> I have all my sessions in one big tmux session
<srhb> After a few hours I randomly kill all the windows off >>
<infinisil> adisbladis: :OOOOOOOO
<infinisil> IT WORKS
<adisbladis> =)
<infinisil> thanks a lot
<infinisil> why the hell can't i find any information on that online
<tilpner> sphalerite - I don't know how to find external ones, and there are none listed on the website
<adisbladis> infinisil: I doubt many people try to configure that through text files usually
<infinisil> Ah and probably most people use kde that does it for them
<clever> tilpner: whenrunning screen, text reflow works fine in my terminals
<clever> tilpner: but yeah, bare xterm does clip things when the window shrinks, and the text doesnt come back upon growing in size
<tilpner> clever - Yeah, sphalerite already suggested tmux. I don't want to run them
<tilpner> (It's definitely not annoying enough for that)
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<mmts> fpletz: do you have any experience in running NixOS as XEN DomU ?
<clever> mmts: ive done it once before, its a bit tricky, because you have to obey the grub.conf
<clever> which means doing a full hvm guest with grub in the virtual MBR
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] 7c6f434c pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdgTe
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master 76cec2d Michael Raskin: fbterm: fix build
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<mmts> clever: I can run it with a manually created grub.cfg, but that's not a permanent solution e.g. with updates. Therefore either I've missed something or it's missing in virtualisation/xen-domU.nix ?
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<clever> mmts: nixos relies heavily on being able to edit its own grub config every time you nixos-rebuild, and that the bootloader obeys it
<clever> mmts: and the only way to do that, is to either go HVM and run grub inside the guest, or use pvgrub
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<tilpner> Why is there no builtins.is* that returns true for ./foo? I want my module to differentiate between passing /path and "/path" without using isString
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<infinisil> Um, how do i do X11 forwarding on NixOS/
<infinisil> ?*
<infinisil> I can't seem to get it to work
<clever> infinisil: what methods have you tried?
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<mmts> clever: I'm using pygrub, but with the generated grub.cfg it tells me beside some warnings (Unknown directive), that it's "Unable to find partition containing kernel" (UUID is right) ?
<tilpner> infinisil - Where NixOS is client or server?
<infinisil> clever: programs.ssh.forwardX11 = true;
<infinisil> and -X switch on the client
<clever> mmts: i think grub.cfg is grub 1, so you have to tell nixos to use grub 1
<clever> infinisil: within the ssh session, is $DISPLAY and XAUTHORITY set?
<infinisil> tilpner: I have nixos on both ends, i set programs.ssh.forwardX11 on the server
<tilpner> infinisil - Try services.openssh.forwardX11 on the server, and nothing on the client
<tilpner> infinisil - Then pass -X on the client
<infinisil> clever: Nope, both unset
<infinisil> I
<infinisil> get X11 forwarding request failed on channel 0 when connecting
<infinisil> tilpner: That's what i have
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<clever> infinisil: i see 2 different forwardX11 options in nixos
<clever> infinisil: one is only for server, the other is only for client
<tilpner> infinisil - Is it?
<infinisil> OHh interesting
<clever> ona: services.openssh.forwardX11 is for the server, it allows forwarding
<infinisil> Okay I'll try that
<clever> programs.ssh.forwardX11 is for the client, it requests forwarding to happen
<tilpner> It enables forwarding by default, so leave that off
<tilpner> You don't want *every* ssh connection to allow X forwarding
<clever> yeah
<infinisil> alright
<clever> programs.ssh.forwardX11 controls /etc/ssh/ssh_config (client config
<infinisil> Oh, now i got a bit further, I get /nix/store/49jbxb4h9dwma7gb29151ynxx80jrf7m-xauth-1.0.10/bin/xauth: file /home/infinisil/.Xauthority does not exist
<clever> the other one goes into services.openssh.extraConfig
<infinisil> yeah
<clever> try creating the xauth file with touch
<infinisil> i could copy it from my local machine
<infinisil> touching seems to have gotten rid of the error
<infinisil> firefox works :D
<hyper_ch> so, another error: error: querying path in database: database disk image is malformed
<clever> i dont think copying will work right
<hyper_ch> but which database is malformed?
<clever> since ssh makes new keys
<clever> hyper_ch: probably /nix/var/nix/db/db.sqlite
<clever> which would mean your entire nix store is now hosed
<hyper_ch> clever: can access it just fine with sqlite3
<clever> first time ive seen that happen
<clever> hyper_ch: also try /nix/var/nix/binary-cache-v3.sqlite
<hyper_ch> same, access just fine with sqlite
<infinisil> Wait, but when i check my ip in firefox, i still have the local one
<infinisil> or is that expected
<clever> infinisil: where is the target machine?
<clever> infinisil: oh, did you already have a firefox running locally?
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<infinisil> clever: Ah i did, stopping it now
<clever> infinisil: it used x11 RPC to open a new window in the local session
<clever> then the remote one shut itself off
<infinisil> OHh now it goes
<infinisil> The SPEEED i can feel it
<mmts> clever: the generated grub.cfg is definitely for version 2, if I configure "boot.loader.grub.version = 1;" there is a conflict with required xen-domU.nix
<tilpner> hyper_ch - sqlite3 /nix/var/nix/db/db.sqlite 'pragma integrity_check;'
<clever> hyper_ch: you never did anything with the sqlite files
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] jtojnar opened pull request #30228: gnome3.geary: 0.11.3 → 0.12.0 (master...geary) https://git.io/vdgkU
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<hyper_ch> clever: oh, that shows errors
<tilpner> (Probably not the cause, but better than just opening)
<mmts> clever: I might try to leave xen-domU.nix out, and try configuring it myself.
<hyper_ch> clever: can I just restore from a backup? or do rollback on zfs?
<pikajude> does anyone have a terminal emulator they like for WSL?
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<clever> hyper_ch: you could, but anything you added since the backup will get eaten as invalid data
<pikajude> i asked this last week and forgot all the answers
<pikajude> lol
<hyper_ch> what do you mean by will get eaten as invalid data?
<clever> mmts: try just doing boot.loader.grub.version = lib.mkForce 1;
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<clever> mmts: that will force it to 1 while letting you keep domU.nix
<pikajude> thanks tilpner
<clever> hyper_ch: db.sqlite keeps track of what paths are valid in /nix/store/
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<clever> hyper_ch: so if you rollback the database, every "new" path will be invalid, and nix will delete it
<pikajude> ah so it was only one person that responded
<clever> and nix will complain about any missing paths
<pikajude> that makes sense
<tilpner> pikajude - Can't you run any X terminal?
<pikajude> on windows? no idea
<pikajude> it's possible
<pikajude> if urxvt builds on windows that would be neato
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<tilpner> Apparently you can run Linux Firefox on WSL, so I feel like a simple terminal shouldn't be much of a problem
<pikajude> neato
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<hyper_ch> clever: thx
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<clever> tilpner: ive seen screenshots of the entire gnome desktop env running
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<tilpner> Oh, nice
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<clever> tilpner: ive also looked into it some, it has no pid 1, and the +rwx bits are stored on NTFS extended attributes, which no windows program can recreate (explorer even looses them upon copy)
<clever> tilpner: so if you wanted to install another distro, you have to untar it inside WSL, then use explorer to perform an atomic move and swap the entire root dir
<copumpkin> hey maurer you around?
<maurer> copumpkin: sure
<copumpkin> oh hi! I just pung you on github
<copumpkin> but basically, BAP is the only thing I can find keeping llvm 3.8 around in nixpkgs
<copumpkin> and I was wondering how fundamental that dependency was
<copumpkin> like could BAP bump to 3.9 or some other version?
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] pbogdan opened pull request #30231: newsbeuter-dev: remove (master...newsbeuter-dev-remove) https://git.io/vdgkD
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<tilpner> clever - I don't intend to use Windows... ever, but it's still neat that they managed that level of integration, even if it comes with a few quirks. Gives some options to people who are forced to develop on Windows :D
<maurer> copumpkin: If we have core v0.9 now, I can switch it to 4.0
<clever> tilpner: i was interested in building a nixos image purely, using nix, then just installing and running it
<maurer> (3.9 won't work)
<clever> tilpner: but you need to install a full ubuntu image just to unpack the nixos tar, lol
<copumpkin> ah cool
<copumpkin> maurer: I don't really know anything about core versions :) was just wondering if there was an easy fix for the LLVM 3.8 dep
<maurer> Yeah, the problem is that LLVM changes all their interfaces every minor version
<copumpkin> yeah
<maurer> I'll take a look and see if new core is there yet, since the next release of bap, which supports 4.0, depends on that, and it wasn't packaged at the time
<copumpkin> that's why we have to keep so many of the old versions around :(
<copumpkin> thanks!
<ixxie> yesterday I discussed the idea of refreshing the Nix ecosystem logos a bit; here is my current proposal https://github.com/ixxie/nixlogos
<maurer> If it helps, bap can use 3.4 just fine as is
<LnL> they are doing major versions now with 4 and 5
<tilpner> clever - But that would be fine for bootstrapping, no? Afterwards you could put them on their store, so users don't have to do the same: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/p/opensuse-leap-42/9njvjts82tjx
<copumpkin> fun, I might try repointing it at 3.4 since we need that version for an old GHC too
<maurer> LnL: Yeah, but that's just a nomenclature fix
<ixxie> in case you wanna provide feedback theres a thread about the two versions where you can do so https://github.com/ixxie/nixlogos/issues/1
<maurer> they're still breaking compatibility with every release :P
<clever> tilpner: i was hoping there was some windows utility to just unpack the tarball and execute an ELF with chroot
<clever> tilpner: but it sounds like you cant even have 2 roots on the same user (or maybe even machine wide)
<infinisil> ixxie: Where's the tilt in the second version?
<LnL> maurer: yeah :)
<tilpner> ixxie - Whatever you do... Do. Not. Tilt. The Snowflake.
<infinisil> Both versions look pretty much the same to me
<tilpner> Please :c
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<infinisil> Ohhh you mean the snowflake
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<infinisil> ugh the tilt looks bad
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<ixxie> hehe yeah I thought this would be the reaction
<infinisil> It looks off
<ixxie> functional programmers are allergic to symmetry breaking I guess
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] dupgit opened pull request #30232: Merge pull request #1 from NixOS/master (master...master) https://git.io/vdgkx
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<tilpner> Yeah, it's really uncomfortable. I don't mind the font changes though
<infinisil> heh
<tilpner> (Although it doesn't break symmetry)
<infinisil> I'm just gonna vote on makefu's comment
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-17.09-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/81ebbbcd2e (from 3 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-17.09-small)
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] dupgit closed pull request #30232: Merge pull request #1 from NixOS/master (master...master) https://git.io/vdgkx
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<ixxie> tilpner: it does in the sense of translation symmetry with respect to the text
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<ixxie> the old font hurts my eyeballs
<mmts> clever: thanks, the "boot.loader.grub.version = lib.mkForce 1;" generated a menu.lst file. After removing the double slashes in there it's booting, thanks again.
<tilpner> ixxie - Can you make a side-by-side of no-tilt new-font old-colors vs new-colors?
<tilpner> And the font looks great for everything that contains "Nix" in its name. Hydra looks a little odd though
<clever> mmts: ah, then i was off about grub.cfg being 1, but it sounds like it still fixed it
<clever> mmts: you may want to fix the python in pygrub, since nixos-rebuild will put the double-slashes in every time you change something
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<srhb> I could see the tilted version working if only the lambda legs were extended to form a circle
<srhb> perhaps even with a circle outline
<srhb> But without....
<mmts> clever: where do you think I'd be able to fix it without being overwriten with the next update ?
<srhb> (I also think the text looks great)
<tilpner> srhb - Pssh, no tilting :c
<mmts> clever: I'm pretty new to NixOS...
<srhb> tilpner: Right, no tilting. Sorry. :P
<infinisil> Damnit, even after solving youtube's stupid captcha via X11 forwarding, I can't download videos with youtube-dl, still getting HTTP Error 429: Too Many Requests (the same as before)
<clever> mmts: any time you make any change to configuration.nix or nix-channel, the grub config will get regenerated
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<tilpner> infinisil - Can you use https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl#network-options ?
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<infinisil> tilpner: I could use a proxy, but I don't want to have another machine run continuously
<tilpner> infinisil - Snapshot and re-create your droplet
<gchristensen> get a new do droplet?
<infinisil> that's what the server does already
<infinisil> I actually tried snappshotting and recreating it
<infinisil> But it failed to start..
<gchristensen> make a new one before shutting down your old one, otherwise you'll get the same ip
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<infinisil> yeah i got a different ip
<infinisil> i have no idea why it can't start
<gchristensen> is it a nixos box?
<infinisil> yup
<gchristensen> just make a new one :)
<infinisil> but i kinda have some stuff on there, which I'd need to transfer
<infinisil> but i guess this is the best option
<infinisil> does restoring a snapshot not work when you have a different kernel or so?
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<ixxie> tilpner: I love the hydra! The original logo is there with the original colors
<tilpner> ixxie - Yes, I saw that one, but it's not aligned, differently-sized and uses the old font
<ixxie> yeah
<ixxie> tilpner: there is v3 now
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<tilpner> Now we need a new better voting system...
<infinisil> It took me a while to realize what the logo is composed of
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<tilpner> ixxie - v3/nixos-wiki could do with just one weighting
<tilpner> v1/nixos-wiki looks good, but the difference is kind of lost in v3
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<hyper_ch> I tend to think I have to stop that encrypted zfs experiemtn
<infinisil> hyper_ch: please try it without crypto
<hyper_ch> I need crypto
<infinisil> because if it's actually a problem with crypto, then it would be nice to make an issue so people can fix it
<infinisil> and even if it isn't
<infinisil> an issue would be nice
<tilpner> jtojnar - What are you confused about?
<jtojnar> tilpner: isn’t that meh emoji?
<jtojnar> hmm, apparently github does not seem to think so
<tilpner> "jtojnar reacted with confused emoji"
<gchristensen> jtojnar, tilpner : where is this?
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<gchristensen> oh
<tilpner> jtojnar - Do we need -1 too? I thought we'd just +1 every choice we're okay with and pick the one with the highest score?
<jtojnar> the face does not really look very confused to me https://emojipedia.org/confused-face/
<tilpner> The Mozilla version looks sort-of confused
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] falsifian opened pull request #30233: libgnurl: Use recommended configure flags. (master...libgnurl_configure) https://git.io/vdgLi
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<ixxie> tilpner: yeah its a bit tricky that one
<ixxie> tilpner: i'll have to think of the wiki one further
<tilpner> ixxie - Why did you think the old colors needed change?
<hyper_ch> infinisil: I'll give it another try with mdadm raid1 -> luks/dm-crypt -> zfs
<jtojnar> the wiki one is especially weird, with the three different weights
<ixxie> yeah it needs fixing jtojnar
<ixxie> tilpner: because the current colors feel somehow very old fashioned
<ixxie> like 90s style
<tilpner> And that's not just familiarity?
<jtojnar> I like the new colors more too
<ixxie> tilpner: one of my goals it bringing the design more into line with contemporary graphic design, because graphic design is quickly dated
<ixxie> tilpner: I would even consider non-blue except continuity is also important
<ixxie> it still needs to remain recognizable as the same logo
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<tilpner> ixxie - Something's odd. The colors of https://nixos.org/logo/nixos-logo-only-hires.png and your tiny v1 don't match
<tilpner> Oh, nixos-logo-only-hires.png has a gradient
<ixxie> did notice that
<ixxie> hmmm
<ixxie> the one I used is from the SVG on the homepage repo
<tilpner> Where is the SVG used?
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<ixxie> tilpner: probably almost nowhere, but it is also probably the master file from which the png's are generated ;)
<tilpner> ixxie - AFAICT the SVG doesn't have the gradient, so it's an unfair comparison
<jtojnar> but it looks identical
<tilpner> Does Firefox fail to display the SVG on GH for anyone else?
<ixxie> tilpner: the gradient one is the anomaly
<tilpner> (Nevermind, my fault)
<ixxie> anyway, I best be off to bed now
<ixxie> I'll continue tweaking this after work tomorrow
<dtz> thanks for the logo work, ixxie! :D
<ixxie> thanks for all the feedback
<ixxie> my pleasure dtz :P its the least I can do
<tilpner> dtz - Nice comparison links!
<ixxie> yeah thanks for that dtz ^^
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] copumpkin closed pull request #30150: Get rid of most @rpath nonsense on Darwin (staging...no-rpath-nonsense) https://git.io/vd0cA
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<tilpner> ixxie - What format are the source files for this?
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<ixxie> tilpner: adobe illustrator :P but its easy to output in svg or pdf for editing in inkscape for example
<tilpner> I wanted to do a color side-by-side. If the Inkscape export looks close enough, that'd be nice
<dtzWill> clearly the logo needs to be generated with a Nix expression
<tilpner> That doesn't too hard, actually
<tilpner> *doesn't sound
<ixxie> tilpner: I am on it
<dtzWill> for something like this it seems reasonable, but I'm not familiar with tools that let such be reasonably scripted
<dtzWill> xD
<ixxie> tilpner: I will make a version with the orignal colors and also align the original logo with the new one to allow a comparison thingy dtzWill made
<rycee> wilornel: Doesn't `home.file.xyz.source = fetchgit …;` work?
<dtzWill> I just googled for some comparison and used first one, lol, dunno
<tilpner> Oh, okay, that works too :)
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<Judson> Trying to figure out the best way to approach a problem of small consequence
<Judson> I would like to be able to cancel libnotify messages I created with a script.
<Judson> The script is reading the logs of the GnuPG scdaemon so that when I need to authorize a gpg signing or auth action there's a notification (otherwise they frequently time out)
<tilpner> Do you have the notification id?
<Judson> tilpner, right now I'm using the libnotify notify-send, which doesn't handle closing/replacing notifications
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<gleber_> Anyone using Yubikeys on NixOS? How do I make Chromium get access to such key?
<Judson> There's two "gaps" to close - one is that shortcoming of notify-send (I've found a script that uses gdbus to do this), and associating the notification ids with auth/sign actions
<Judson> gleber_ - I am; my problem is actually related
<Judson> I don't have a problem with them...
<Judson> One sec though
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<Judson> gleber_, I have a rule: service.udev.extraRules = "KERNEL=="hidraw*", SUBSYSTEM=="hidraw", ATTRS{idVendor}=="1050", MODE="0664", GROUP="wheel""
<Judson> IIRC you need to be in wheel (or else make the group line up)
<gleber_> Judson: ah, so this is controlled by udev, good to know!
<Judson> Everything is controlled by udev :)
<Judson> So, the options I see are: get gdbus installed somehow, which I perceive will figuring out the owning package and build an nix expr for it, then figure out how to script it so that the notify ids get matched up (which I think involves associative arrays in bash...)
<Judson> Or looking at the id/action thing, decide that I need to write a real program for it (in e.g. Go) and figure out the dbus bindings there.
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<Judson> Saying that out loud makes me lean towards the latter, since I could also maybe use it as an excuse to build it in Rust...
<gleber_> Judson: I see other people have yubikey config like this: https://github.com/Ericson2314/nixos-configuration/blob/nixos/yubikey.nix or like this https://github.com/badi/nixos/blob/master/yubikey.nix, and without any explicit udev rules
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<tilpner> Judson - Tried to get dbus-send to send a notification, failed, found https://gist.github.com/baverman/6440898
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] deedrah opened pull request #30234: aspell: added new patch data-dirs-from-nix-profiles.patch (master...aspell-data-dirs-from-nix-profiles) https://git.io/vdgmB
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<maurer> copumpkin: What's the timetable like on you wanting to remove LLVM? libbap (the C bindings) evidently didn't get updated to match current master, only the last release cut, and the last release cut doesn't have 4.0 support
<maurer> copumpkin: It'd probably be about a week before libbap gets fixed
<copumpkin> Not urgent at all, I’ve now made the changes needed to all LLVM versions so any short-term need is gone
<copumpkin> I’ll just be sad if have to go update all sorts of ancient LLVM versions next time something like this comes along :)
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<maurer> OK. Yeah, this was an update I should have made two or three weeks ago when it got fixed
<maurer> but I've been busy, so this sort of bumps it up on my queue
<eikke> potential stupid question: when I have a 'shell.nix' generated by cabal2nix --shell, how can I run 'nix-shell' and get it to provide cabal in the new env? looks like by default it only contains ghc (and dependency packages)
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<ixxie> tilpner, dtzWill - now made all three versions clean and properly aligned and updated to optimize them for the juxtaposition
<ixxie> however the gitraw files aren't updated so often so I couldn't make the comparison thingy
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<ixxie> I guess you can alway open multiple tabs and switch between them xD
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<gchristensen> ixxie: if the colors change I'll have a whole buncha stickers to get rid of
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<hodapp> huh. I almost want to go see what work has been done on integrating OpenRC in as an alternative to systemd, but that would be a huge learning endeavour and I have too much else to learn at the same time
<ixxie> gchristensen: if colors change you will have the 'Vintage NixOS' stickers ;)
<hodapp> Vintage NixOS? o_O
<ixxie> yeah, its NixOS running in 8 bits
<hodapp> that would impress me
<tilpner> Yay! That was a lot more work than I asked for, here's the juxtapose: https://cdn.knightlab.com/libs/juxtapose/latest/embed/index.html?uid=2c39f638-ac6c-11e7-b263-0edaf8f81e27
<hodapp> I have only run NixOS on 64-bit processors
<hodapp> I remember my first 32-bit system......
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<ixxie> tilpner: I guess its the one comparing between versions that doesn't work?
<ixxie> oh cool it updated
<tilpner> Not sure, I used the dev rawgit links
<ixxie> I will add the juxtaposes to the readme
<gchristensen> Fare, catern, I'm in NYC if ya'll'd like to mee up for something
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<hodapp> darn, I'm in Cincinnati
<hodapp> have yet to meet any other Nixians locally
<infinisil> Nixians, what a nice word :D
<infinisil> although I'm not sure how to pronounce it
<hodapp> NIX-ee-ins
<hodapp> too bad Rust already claimed a lot of the good ones, like Rustacean and Rustafarian (which I might have made up myself, I don't know)
<infinisil> Nix-ee-ans?
<infinisil> What's Rustafarian?
<gchristensen> hmm if I order 500 stickers, it is $200. 100 stickers is $85. 50 stickers is $66. this is the debate I have in my brain every time I order another 50.
<infinisil> That is a steep price decline :O
<gchristensen> $300 for 1,000
<MichaelRaskin> That just means that the fixed cost of preparing the printing matrix is large
<MichaelRaskin> And all the vinyl and paint are peanut cheap.
<gchristensen> so does that settle it, $1,000 is the magic number?
<gchristensen> s/$//
<MichaelRaskin> Sorry, that replacement does nothing
<MichaelRaskin> You wanted s/[$]//
<makefu> gchristensen: 200 for 500 stickers is quite a lot of money, are they premium quality at least?
<gchristensen> I know :(
<gchristensen> makefu: they're very nice stickers
<gchristensen> domenkozar: how did you like those stickers I sent you?
<MichaelRaskin> I wonder if it is a viable business model to print stickers and for some extra fee stash the matrix.
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<MichaelRaskin> So the next batch could be more expensive than just printing them initially, but waaaay cheaper than a new batch anywhere.
<hodapp> infinisil: Someone who uses Rust :P
<infinisil> Ah so the same as Rustacean
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<ixxie> dtzWill, tilpner - I added all the juxtaposes to the readme
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] volth opened pull request #30236: haxe: 3.4.3 -> 3.4.4 (master...patch-69) https://git.io/vdgO8
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] 7c6f434c pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vdgOE
<NixOS_GitHub> nixpkgs/master d66a340 Michael Raskin: xmlsec: fix build (re: nss update)
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<tilpner> ixxie - I saw them. Thank you! :)
<ixxie> thank you too for the feedback
<ixxie> now its really time for bed >.<
<ixxie> have a good one ^^
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] orivej closed pull request #30223: devtodo: adjust platforms (master...platforms) https://git.io/vdzju
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<7JTACLATF> [nixpkgs] orivej pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vdgO9
<7JTACLATF> nixpkgs/master e50fdb1 Frank Doepper: devtodo: adjust platforms...
<7JTACLATF> nixpkgs/master fc5b50d Orivej Desh: Merge pull request #30223 from woffs/platforms...
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<ixxie> Well gchristensen, if this actually does goes throw, I am very sorry for deprecating your stickers :(
<ixxie> through*
<gchristensen> it is okay
<gchristensen> people love old stickers more than up to date stickers, it lets them feel in on something
<ixxie> hehe yeah indeed
<hyper_ch> clever: why can't I import it? https://paste.simplylinux.ch/view/raw/d7e60c9d
<ixxie> gnight
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<clever> -d dir Searches for devices or files in dir. The -d option can be specified multiple times
<clever> hyper_ch: you may need to tell import to look in /dev/mapper/
<hyper_ch> clever: ah that worked
<clever> there is a matching nixos option you will need
<clever> so the initrd can also find it
<hyper_ch> no, doing backup, computer froze and didn't find it
<clever> boot.zfs.devNodes = "/dev"; # fixes some virtualmachine issues
<clever> this string is passed to -d within the initrd
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<hyper_ch> sys crashed again
<hyper_ch> or rather rsync isn't working anymore...
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<tokudan[m]> how can i configure a network interface that does not exist during boot?
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<nix-gsc-io`bot> Channel nixos-unstable-small advanced to https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/commit/76cec2dfa6 (from 3 hours ago, history: https://channels.nix.gsc.io/nixos-unstable-small)
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<ocharles> Does anyone know why doing `nix-store --realise /nix/store/...-blah.drv` does substantially less work than `nix-store --realise` for everything in `nix-store -qR /nix/store/...-blah.drv`?
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<ocharles> the latter seems to be doing all sorts of stuff like installing apparently every python library in existance (e.g., /nix/store/lm8iv6lqjkdh809fmav981v9kc3ghy5d-Jinja2-2.9.6.tar.gz.drv !?)
<MichaelRaskin> Well, if you have the output already, realising its derivation doesn't need the builddeps.
<ocharles> Right, I'm doing them in that order - so I'm surprised that realising all of -qD after realising the top level drv isn't a no-op
<MichaelRaskin> Well, do you have bootstrap static gcc on your system?
<ocharles> hmm, Jinja is in the -qR of that drv
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<ocharles> I have no idea
<MichaelRaskin> It is not needed for anything once you have stdenv from binary cache.
<MichaelRaskin> But realising everything in build-closure will include bootstrap static gcc.
<ocharles> ok, but Jinja is not part of that, yet it does get realised when I realise everything in the build closure, but not when I just realise the top-level drv
<MichaelRaskin> A lot of time realising top-level drv is just a fetch from binary cache
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<ocharles> https://gist.github.com/ocharles/e657fe589038803c1f33ceec6d35c8f1#file-gistfile1-txt-L140 realises the build closure drvs, yet a sucessful build has just happened. I don't really understand why https://gist.github.com/ocharles/e657fe589038803c1f33ceec6d35c8f1#file-gistfile1-txt-L4 doesn't need to do the same work
<Fare> Having trouble with my kernel. When it's not the wifi, it's the touchpad or the sound card. Sigh.
<MichaelRaskin> ocharles
<MichaelRaskin> Well, what I say can happen at many levels.
<josePhoenix> hi all, anyone know how to see which package is requiring Django as an input? Running in to this issue (I think) but I don't even need Django right now: https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/issues/27685
<MichaelRaskin> ocharles: what is your question again, at line 153 it literally downloads bootstrap tools.
<MichaelRaskin> As I said initially.
<ocharles> MichaelRaskin: yes, my question is why, because on line 4 it built the derivation without needing them
<MichaelRaskin> Because binary cache!
<ocharles> It's literally using the binary cache later!
<ocharles> so clearly nix-store --realise does more than just realise all required drvs and the realise the drv in questio
<MichaelRaskin> It doesn't
<MichaelRaskin> It ensures that the outputs of the derivation are valid.
<MichaelRaskin> If it can just fetch it does — with all _runtime_ (but not all the build-time) dependencies.
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<ocharles> So maybe what I'm missing is that with -qR I'm getting to drvs that "wouldn't be reached" - e.g., bootstrap tools are right at the bottom, but whatever would need bootstrap tools will almost certainly already be in my store
<ocharles> I think that's what you're trying to tell me?
<ocharles> https://github.com/NixOS/hydra/blob/master/src/hydra-queue-runner/queue-monitor.cc#L371 which is roughly what I can ascertain from this
<MichaelRaskin> Yes, that is a good way to put this.
<ocharles> Sweet, thanks for helping me grok that!
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<MichaelRaskin> I would say that https://nixos.org/nix/manual/ (search for «runtime dependencies» and read adjacent paragraphs) is a better source than source code for initial understanding
<ocharles> It doesn't look like Nix plumbing binaries give me a way to get the input derivations to a derivation, is that right?
<ocharles> I already have a fair initial understanding, but the manual doesn't really elaborate on how realisation happens
<ocharles> oh, that is nix-store -q --references, I think
<infinisil> yeah, same as -qR
<ocharles> no, -qR is the full closure
<infinisil> Oh right
<infinisil> sr
<infinisil> y
<ocharles> I just want immediate deps, but r'ing the fm was the key :)
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<manveru> is anyone having success with wineWow to run both 32 and 64 bit executables?
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<neonfuz> so I got a new wifi usb and I've been trying to figure out how to use it
<neonfuz> it's lsusb is 148f:5370 Ralink Technology, Corp. RT5370 Wireless Adapter, and the debian wiki says the rt2800usb driver should work, but it doesn't seem to
<neonfuz> what packages do firmare come in?
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<tilpner> Check nix-instantiate --strict --eval -E '(import <nixpkgs/nixos> {}).config.hardware.enableRedistributableFirmware'
<tilpner> (strict isn't necessary for this)
<tilpner> There's also hardware.enableAllFirmware, which you could try, but I have no idea what it includes additionally
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<neonfuz> it's true
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<neonfuz> for both of them
<tilpner> Oh
<tilpner> I only expected redistributable to be enabled
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<tilpner> And you rebuilt and rebooted sometime inbetween? Just checking
<neonfuz> adding enableAllFirmware = true was one of the first changes I made to my config when first installing nixos lol
<hl> Hello. I'm using NixOS 17.09 with KDE, but event sounds don't play correctly, even in applications like Pidgin.
<neonfuz> are you using pulse?
<hl> So for example, as is the default configuration, Pidgin should play certain sounds in certain circumstances, but it isn't doing so.
<hl> Pulseaudio? yes.
<neonfuz> maybe you somehow don't have the sounds themselves installed? idk. Do other apps make sound at all?
<neonfuz> oh just event sounds
<hl> The oxygen set of .oggs are installed, but I don't think I've heard anything play them.
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<NixOS_GitHub> [nixpkgs] lukeadams opened pull request #30238: Qt4 darwin fix master (master...qt4-darwin-fix-master) https://git.io/vdgCX
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<hl> Hmm... so to rule out any path issues, I set the 'message recieved' sound in Pidgin from '(default)' to the full path to an .ogg, but it still isn't working when I mash 'preview' or receive a message
<tilpner> neonfuz - Try boot.kernelModules = [ "rt2800usb" ];