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<angerman> who's been playing with putting nixos on the kobol Helios64?
<samueldr> not I yet
<samueldr> mine's still (likely) on the high seas
<samueldr> angerman: anything in mind?
<samueldr> I took a look earlier this month and it seems pretty standard
<angerman> samueldr: it just arrived.
<samueldr> lucky you
<angerman> now I need to find some spare time
<samueldr> >> Example, because freight is still super costly for Canada, we are currently working with a forwarder to bulk ship next week all orders for Canada at once.
<samueldr> that's the reason I'm saying it's on the high seas
<angerman> They bulk shipped them to SG, and then used a really cheap local delivery for the last mile.
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<angerman> Sitting in Asia sometimes has benefits :D
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<sphalerite> angerman: aaaah I want mine too
<sphalerite> angerman: how long did it take to advance from "Processing" on the order check page, and how long after that until it arrived?
<samueldr> the order check page?
<sphalerite> oh, you're in Singapore. I missed that.
<sphalerite> samueldr: https://shop.kobol.io/check-order/
<samueldr> currently processing
<samueldr> neat
<sphalerite> well, mine's been "Processing" for 4 weeks
<samueldr> yeah, I assume mine too
<samueldr> oh, found the info about shipping to canada in my mails though
<samueldr> Just a heads up to let you know that your parcel has left our warehouse in China to reach a fulfilment partner in Canada. The journey to Canada is made by sea, so it will take around 4 weeks to reach the facility.
<samueldr> Once it reaches the fulfilment facility in Canada (Mississauga), we will provide you with a tracking number for the last portion of the delivery.
<samueldr> (received on the 17th)
<samueldr> so I guess at least another two weeks
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<angerman> sphalerite: no idea to be honest. I got an email a while back where they said they'd ship bulk to SG.
<angerman> about 3days ago, I got 3(!) messages from Qexpress.
<angerman> today it arrived.
<sphalerite> angerman: aren't they in Singapore themselves?
<angerman> sphalerite: came from Shenzhen I think
<sphalerite> ah ok. kobol itself does seem to be singaporean though
<angerman> ahh, so I can go trash their office if stuff doesn't work :D
<angerman> Always good to support the local economy
<sphalerite> hahaha
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<Ke> what I really love about the extlinux conf boot approach is that it hardcodes almost nothing about physical layout, so you can more or less install to a directory
<Ke> this means that if you can compile the u-boot image, you can stage a recovery from existing nixos fairly trivially without having physical hardware that you move
<angerman> https://wiki.kobol.io/helios64/kit/ ... lol, good luck sorting 4mm vs 5mm M3 screws
<Ke> also what goes in extlinux.conf is human readable and fixable, if your uuids change or something
<Ke> sadly nixos system might not be
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<angerman> yuck. Next time I buy legos...
<angerman> the case ain't level. T_T
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<kahiru> like, it is not standing straight up?
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<angerman> kahiru: it’s standing on 3 out of four rubber feet.
<angerman> People should just design three base contact points. Those will never have these issues.
<angerman> I guess I can just move one rear pad into the middle and remove the other one.
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<angerman> Level issues are my biggest problem with shipped hardware. The armrest for the keyboard want level either.
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<HackerIdiot> hello I just visited nixos-mobile site but didn't find anything to install in my phone
<HackerIdiot> can anyone help me out
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<HackerIdiot> anyone there
<HackerIdiot> 🧐🧐
<simpson> Yes, but I don't know. Which kind of phone do you have?
<HackerIdiot> I have vivo phone
<simpson> I haven't heard anybody talk about that phone. I doubt that we have anything ready-made for you right now, but if you're willing to hack, then you might be able to make something for yourself.
<HackerIdiot> OK sure I'm ready for it
<HackerIdiot> simpson: are you there
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<simpson> HackerIdiot: Not really, no. But always, yes? I don't know.
<simpson> I would read https://mobile.nixos.org/porting-guide.html and then look at https://github.com/NixOS/mobile-nixos/tree/master/devices for inspiration from similar boards.
<HackerIdiot> okay
<simpson> Importantly, you'll want to know the SoC's information. Who made it, its make and model, the SoC name that Linux uses for it, any Device Tree stuff, etc.
<simpson> I haven't yet had time to do this myself, or I'd have more guidance.
<samueldr> HackerIdiot: first (obvious?) step is to know whether the bootloader can be unlocked on the phone
<samueldr> just like you would for an Android ROM
<samueldr> that's a make it or break it kind of deal
<samueldr> then, some initial "facts gathering" has to be done to know more, e.g. is there a kernel source code release for the phone? is it aarch64?
<HackerIdiot> I will try it on my rooted phone
<samueldr> but before starting, a word of warning: this is not a project that is "ready" and usable. Assuming you can port it to your phone as much as I have done for other phones, there is a 50/50 chance your wifi will not work, there has been no work done yet for cellular communications
<samueldr> and a last word of warning: strong assumptions are made that we can erase the data on the phone, otherwise it becomes a bit harder to deal with
<samueldr> there's also a big assumption that the user / porter is quite familiar with NixOS, as it builds entirely on top of NixOS
<HackerIdiot> OK I will first try on my other experiment phone so it would be easy for me to format it totally
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<samueldr> definitely, I would strongly suggest not using it on your main phone for the time being :)
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<samueldr> and uh, before you start, know that there is no "actual guide" about porting, for the time being
<HackerIdiot> ok
<samueldr> the general method is to figure out the details specific to your device, and base that upon a similar device
<simpson> Or, rather, there's no guide that's not just how to cross-compile NixOS + how to port Linux to ARM boards.
<samueldr> ... up until the past week-end
<samueldr> yeah
<samueldr> nothing specific to Mobile NixOS
<samueldr> there's a tool for android-based devices that can help you get started now
<samueldr> for the time being the ROM for the device you want to port to has to be available on the "Android Dumps" project
<HackerIdiot> ooh
<samueldr> is will get most of the information from there
<samueldr> it*
<samueldr> though it will not "complete" the port; as in you will need to provide a derivation for the kernel (which you can base on a similar device's) and you will need to change kernel configuration options
<HackerIdiot> ok
<samueldr> for kernel options you might be able to get by by diffing a kernel from a "similar" device, and also from info from postmarketOS https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Kernel_configuration
<samueldr> relatively similar
<HackerIdiot> right now I'm trying on nix-on-droid
<simpson> samueldr++ for this; it is very encouraging.
<{^_^}> samueldr's karma got increased to 0o425
<HackerIdiot> thank you
<samueldr> simpson: whenever you have a day off, with autport it gets much easier since most of the guess work ends up being the kernel
<samueldr> which I might be looking into solving a chunk soon
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<simpson> samueldr: Oh, I've been unemployed for months. It's more a question of gumption and of digging out my hardware. (And of making sure that I've got the CPU for building packages.)
<samueldr> unemployment does not necessarily mean day off or free time!
<samueldr> stage-1 is entirely cross-compiled
<samueldr> stage-2 you can either cross-compile a "hello world type" demo stage-2, or get a native stage-2 from hydra if it's aarch64
<simpson> Ah, that's something I'd forgotten about; will I be in deep trouble if I use a years-old phone? Is arm6/arm7 too old?
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<samueldr> well, pre-built useful stage-2 won't be a thing
<samueldr> and the kernel could be too old for systemd
<samueldr> _could_
<samueldr> but in theory it might still "work" for some values of work
<samueldr> asus-flo, nexus 7 2013, is armv7l, too old to boot systemd, but stage-1 fully works
<simpson> I have one of the older Motorolas with the hardware keyboard. It doesn't need to do much to be extremely cool.
<samueldr> up until it tries to boot the system :)
<samueldr> though if it's old enough, and popular enough, maybe there are mainline ports for it
<samueldr> still, stage-2 is an issue
<simpson> ...Maybe this is the greenfield needed to develop non-systemd NixOS variants.
<samueldr> well, there's more issues than systemd with an old kernel
<samueldr> even kernels that can boot with systemd can lack important features
<simpson> Yes, true; perhaps it'd be just a graveyard for old devices.
<samueldr> I was just saying :)
<samueldr> but in practice it would be useful to have a "non-NixOS" stage-2 story
<simpson> Right, I shouldn't get my hopes up. But that's okay; it's 2020 and my hopes are not especially high.
<simpson> "boots" is pretty good!
<samueldr> something that is nix-built still
<samueldr> I haven't confirmed since earlier this year, but armv7l worked on asus-flo up to stage-2
<samueldr> if armv7l wasn't such a bunch of issues I would have looked for a mainline-based kernel more in depth
<samueldr> silver lining: wifi is more likely to work easily with an older device :)
<simpson> I found a Beagle! Not a phone.
<samueldr> beagle board / bone ?
<simpson> Yeah. Old red board from the initial runs, with the TI DSP. I also found an LG Pixel! That's a phone. I don't remember what's wrong with it; TBH it might just not be compatible with my current carrier.
<samueldr> ugh
<samueldr> can't look up that phone
<samueldr> because LG manufactures the google pixels
<samueldr> so it's been forgotten by google
<simpson> I believe that it's a Pixel 3, although it may be a Pixel 2. I'll find out once it's charged enough to boot.
<samueldr> :|
<samueldr> I assumed it would have been a pre-android device from LG named "pixel"
<samueldr> because that's not much of an old phone
<samueldr> you can try to identify it here
<simpson> I found a Samsung A930! This is a feature phone; it's far too old, and I'm gonna donate it. Good thing, too; the battery started to bulge, and I've isolated it. The camera on this phone is rad; it has a hardware swivel to rotate between front- and back-facing.
<samueldr> feature phones often were neat
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<simpson> I found an Android 4.0 Mini PC! Yes, that's the real name; it's made by OEM Systems and I think that they just like generic bland names. It's not a phone, but it does run Android.
<samueldr> oof
<simpson> Okay, good haul, good treasure hunt, good dive into my past of trash.
<simpson> I was really hoping to find a Motorola Droid, which has a hardware keyboard and I'm pretty sure no flaws other than being EOL.
<samueldr> omap 3430, Cortex-A8, armv7
<simpson> samueldr: Okay, the Pixel's got battery now. It's soft-bricked; it's got Cyanogenmod on it and the home screen sticks in a crash-loop. No SIM card. It's a Pixel 5 "hammerhead".
<samueldr> Nexus!
<samueldr> snapdragon 800, armv7
<samueldr> though IIRC there's good mainline work for it
<simpson> How do I use your autoport tool without the overlay configured?
<samueldr> oh, -I mobile-nixos=/path/to/checkout/mobile-nixos
* samueldr checks if it works
<samueldr> there's so much variance in android devices that it's happened that things failed to work
<samueldr> like right here, it seems to not have been able to extract a kernel config :|
<samueldr> there might really be none
<samueldr> I guess that would be one device for which running against a selected ROM would be better
<samueldr> so yeah, it gives the appropriate info, except the kernel config couldn't be extracted so some fields are not filled in
<samueldr> and you don't have a base config
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<simpson> samueldr: Sorry, had to field a phone call. I had had a typo in my -I flag. Works fine!
<samueldr> I pushed changes recently if it crashes
<simpson> It *did* crash; how did you know? To reproduce, I incanted `./autoport.rb google hammerhead`
* simpson pulls and tries again
<samueldr> because I ran it before you did!
<samueldr> [14:33:27] <samueldr> like right here, it seems to not have been able to extract a kernel config :|
<simpson> Okay, now I have "Generation done successfully". That was straightforward. Cool tool.
<samueldr> though anoyingly for your device you won't have a config.armv7l to start from
<samueldr> you might want to cleanly flash a rom e.g. cyanogenmod or linageos
<samueldr> adb shell cat /proc/config.gz | zcat > config.armv7l
<samueldr> something like that
<simpson> Mm, yes, that is a good idea.
<samueldr> especially a good idea if you want to start from _their_ kernel source tree
<samueldr> since you'd start with a known good value
<simpson> What do I need to do to write the words which will show up on mobile.nixos.org? Where do I document my struggles?
<samueldr> first would be writing them down, in any form
<samueldr> the whole site (except for the news page) is here https://github.com/NixOS/mobile-nixos/tree/master/doc
<samueldr> you always have the full site / docs in the checkout
<simpson> Oh, it's not generated from the device's Nix description, okay.
<samueldr> oh
<samueldr> I thought you wanted to write up your process and what was needed
<samueldr> the device pages are half-generated
<samueldr> >> (No device-specific notes available)
<simpson> Aha.
<samueldr> that means there is no README.adoc for that device
<samueldr> there is one caveat with "README.adoc", the first four lines of the device-specific doc **have** to be the title, the include, a blank line, and the "Device-specific notes" heading
<samueldr> (the first three are stripped out when rendering the page)
<simpson> Got it, thanks.
<simpson> ,locate bin/adb
<{^_^}> Found in packages: adbfs-rootless, haskellPackages.adblock2privoxy
<samueldr> hm
<simpson> ,locate adb
<samueldr> programs.adb.enable
<{^_^}> Found in packages: msf, axis2, oh-my-zsh, python27Packages.pwntools, python37Packages.pwntools, python38Packages.pwntools, python27Packages.adb-homeassistant, python37Packages.adb-homeassistant, python38Packages.adb-homeassistant
<samueldr> you want to use the option for the proper udev rules
<simpson> Fair enough.
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<simpson> The mini PC is called an MK802. No idea who makes them. The SoC is an Allwinner (sunxi) and the dmesg looks reasonable, but I don't know how to identify the ROM for matching it up with known hardware.
<samueldr> no idea really
<samueldr> AFAIK those kind of allwinner boards "don't match up" to common android-based devices
<samueldr> you're most likely better served by looking into "normal" linux
<samueldr> still, Cortex-A8, that's going to be armv7 so a bit annoying with the current ARM landscape on NixOS
<simpson> Yeah. And it *is* running Android. I don't remember how to check versions from the shell though.
<simpson> samueldr: Okay, so I have shell access to both devices. Sadly, though, neither have a config.gz already.
<samueldr> mk802 I wouldn't even try with Mobile NixOS
<samueldr> nexus 5 though it's weird to not have /proc/config[.gz]
<samueldr> I assume you checked for /proc/config ?
<simpson> Yeah, there's no config at all.
<samueldr> hm... annoying
<samueldr> though that doesn't mean there isn't in the kernel that's currently running
<simpson> And yeah, we'll put the MK802 (or whatever clone it is) to the side. Nice to know that I have it, but it's indeed pretty old.
<samueldr> but it's kinda inconvenient to get at it
<simpson> The booted kernel is CM; could we yoink CM/AOSP/etc. kernel configs?
<samueldr> yes
<simpson> So fast.
<samueldr> though sometimes starting from defconfig hasn't been a success
<samueldr> ... but things changed recently for the kernel normalization
<simpson> Hm, so would you recommend that I try building LineageOS's kernel, or vanilla upstream, or AOSP, or...?
<simpson> I've forgotten everything about phones.
<simpson> Ah, okay, I think I see what to do. Just gotta copy heavily from other devices~
<samueldr> LineageOS would be a good source to use for the kernel
<samueldr> you should be able to work from asus-flo's config
<samueldr> kernels are likely similar, both LGE
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<samueldr> wait no
<samueldr> I'm an idiot
<samueldr> it's written in the fricking name
<samueldr> I was confused by the lge-mako (which I owned for a while)
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<samueldr> sadly its pillow went spicy and it never was the same after
<simpson> It's fine. I mostly needed to look at other armv7l devices, and other Google devices. I am now at https://bpa.st/O4WQ and I suspect that I need to pin nixpkgs to something specific?
<samueldr> still, asus-flo is probably its closes implemented board
<simpson> My nixpkgs is somewhere near master, which is probably far too fresh.
<samueldr> any recent nixos-unstable should work
<samueldr> weird, that's an *old* change post 20.03
<simpson> Ah, maybe it's somewhere near master but actually not really.
<samueldr> we're evaluating and building fine tracking unstable for a while
<samueldr> (ignoring firefox not always finishing)
<simpson> Hm, doesn't work even with nixpkgs master. I wonder what I failed to fill out.
<samueldr> that particular error really seems to point out to using an older nixpkgs
<samueldr> (or that master since last nixos-unstable update removed that option)
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<simpson> D'oh! I was using system nixpkgs; I accidentally unloaded my shell and lost my $NIX_PATH.
<samueldr> :)
<samueldr> so it pointed to using an older Nixpkgs I see
<samueldr> I underestimated how grating it would be to wait on kernel builds to revamp the kernel builder
<simpson> Yeah, it was using my system channel. ("Oh, that's my system nixpkgs. It's also named nixpkgs. Just like my other nixpkgs.")
<simpson> ,locate kernel-normalize-config
<{^_^}> Couldn't find in any packages
<samueldr> it's a tool from the repo under its bin directory
<simpson> Oh, yeah, just found it.
<samueldr> bin/kernel-normalize-config $device
<simpson> I had assumed that it was one of the Linux kernel scripts.
<samueldr> it would have been nice if it really existed that way
<simpson> What's up with compiler-gcc6.h? I'm not familiar with this but I know how to imitate what existing devices do. Is it armv7l-specific?
<samueldr> I'm not 100% positive of the whole history
<samueldr> but with gcc6+ on older kernels that file is desired and not present
<simpson> The file itself has a link to a 404'd issue from an SoC vendor.
<samueldr> that's not even specific to Mobile NixOS or postmarketOS
<simpson> Understandable.
<simpson> Oh! Maybe it's because Linux kernels that old don't know about GCCs that new?
<samueldr> most likely
<simpson> And you were right about asus-flo. I had to borrow 00_fix_return_address.patch from there. But now we're off and CC'ing.
<samueldr> it seems like qualcomm devices generally behave similarly in "epochs"
<simpson> I get a warning on every gcc, `warning: switch -mcpu=cortex-a15 conflicts with -march=armv7-a switch`, but meh? I gather that GCC still does the right thing, it's just grumpy and passing that grumpiness on to me.
<samueldr> exactly
<samueldr> we could "fix" it by patching the kernel tree I guess
<samueldr> NIxpkgs itself adds -march flags
<samueldr> so yeah, it would be helpful to identify "qualcomm epochs"
<samueldr> so e.g. you know that snapdragon 600 is ~ equiv to snapdragon 800
<samueldr> and know that snapdragon 660 is equivalent to ??? in the 8xx range
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<simpson> Okay, so right now I guess I'm building a kernel. I didn't time it, but I'm guessing that it'll take nearly an hour. What do I need to know afterwards? My mind's apparently repressed basically everything; ISTR Device Tree, fastboot packing, secure signing or sideload? I kind of copied what the other Google devices did without really thinking.
<{^_^}> mobile-nixos#24 (by 0x4A6F, 1 year ago, open): [WIP] device: add lg-hammerhead
<{^_^}> mobile-nixos#144 (by thefloweringash, 21 weeks ago, open): lg-hammerhead: init
<simpson> There are several of us, it would seem.'
<simpson> Confirmed another asus-flo patch needed. Today I am Schlemiel the Painter, it would seem.
<samueldr> oh uh, completely forgot that there might have been WIP ports
<samueldr> if you build -A build.androidbootimg, it's ready to be flashed
<samueldr> mobile-nixos#144 is based on mainline, which might be better in the end
<{^_^}> https://github.com/NixOS/mobile-nixos/pull/144 (by thefloweringash, 21 weeks ago, open): lg-hammerhead: init
<samueldr> well, "better"
<simpson> thefloweringash: I'm working on using the LineageOS 16.0 kernel, which is Linux 3.4.0, much older than the PostmarketOS kernel you started with, which is Linux 5.6.0, it looks like?
<samueldr> ideally we'd package both, the OEM tree, and the mainline-based tree
<samueldr> but I don't know how useful either will be
<simpson> I don't have strong opinions, other than that it's not fun being stuck on older Linux. But I don't know what the tradeoffs are like at all.
<samueldr> I'm not sure either
<simpson> Also, do you prefer `lg-hammerhead` or `google-hammerhead`? The latter matches what autoport creates, but the former is understandable since LG's marks are the ones on the physical device.
<samueldr> lg- since at the time google "didn't make" them
<samueldr> while current devices may be made by LG or HTC, but "google makes them"
<samueldr> and ideally, you look around at postmarketOS and LineageOS to guesstimate
<simpson> Okay. Then it's probably going to be easiest for me to just add work onto what thefloweringash has produced, assuming that their WIP got far enough to boot and etc.
<samueldr> I think it will need a refresh of its device info file
<simpson> Okay. I'm going to wait for thefloweringash to reply before I go further; I want to collaborate and include their work.
<samueldr> might take a good while due to timezone diffs :)
<simpson> Sure. On the other device, it's a sunxi with mainline support. Do we have a non-Android sunxi workflow?
<samueldr> kind of
<samueldr> there's no clear cut porting instructions
<samueldr> but the basic idea is to get mainline u-boot going
<simpson> Ah, yes, effort.
<simpson> My nemesis~
<samueldr> haha
<samueldr> whenever I'll need to get a job, I hope I can figure out an employer that employs me for making NixOS on ARM and Mobile NixOS better (and only that)
<simpson> That sounds nice. I'd go for that. I don't know who's paying for that sort of thing, though.
<samueldr> same
<simpson> Part of me feels quite silly for having passed up an opportunity with Collabora when I was younger. But also, it would have been a lot of work and maybe I'd be just as grumpy and burnt-out.
<simpson> ...Okay, the FEL mode on the sunxi works. Great. I'll look into mainline u-boot when I get more gumption and round tuits. And also a Micro SD card.
<samueldr> mk802_defconfig mk802_a10s_defconfig mk802ii_defconfig
<samueldr> all three part of mainline u-boot already
<samueldr> so hopefully it's only a question of picking the right one
<samueldr> u-boot cross-compiles fine to armv7l
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<simpson> I added a ubootMK802, but I'm not sure how to actually make the cross-compilation start. It complains that it can't build for "arm-none"?
<simpson> error: Package ‘uboot-mk802_defconfig-2020.07’ in /home/simpson/nixpkgs/pkgs/misc/uboot/default.nix:96 is not supported on ‘arm-none’, refusing to evaluate.
<simpson> I was trying the "Easiest Way" from https://nixos.wiki/wiki/NixOS_on_ARM for building a u-boot.
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<samueldr> pkgsCross you chose the armv7l one?
<simpson> Hm. I tried `pkgsCross.arm-embedded.ubootMK802` which doesn't work, but now I'm trying `pkgsCross.armv7l-hf-multiplatform.ubootMK802` and it seems to be building. Did I misread the wiki, or is the wiki wrong?
<samueldr> wrong I guess
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<simpson> ...Hold on, "hf" is hardware floats, right? Is that right for armv7l? Ugh, my head is swimming from ARM.
<samueldr> I think so
<samueldr> I never really followed up, and I think it's only on ARMv5 and lower that it's an issue?
<simpson> Well, it built. Just gotta find a Micro SD card and do the rest of the needful.
<samueldr> the offsets to burn it as universal to sunxi boards AFAIK
<simpson> Yeah. I want to boot from SD, see if it works, maybe build and tweak a few more times. Maybe always boot from SD, depending on how far I want to go.
<simpson> Like, in a very real way, it's just another (not-yet-)brick in the wall; it's just another device to add to nixpkgs and make sure everything works.
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