<craige>
Hey samueldr (if you're about) it looks like my poor old Oppo Find 7 is going to die before a Librem-5 or PinePhone lands on my desk - if I had to hit the shops tomorrow - what phone could I pick up that is going to be most useful for me to wedge mobile-nixos onto - happy to look at either an existing supported phone or a wish-list one.
<samueldr>
hi craige
<samueldr>
the main thing to remember is that I don't think that "soon" they'll be useful as a daily driver under mobile-nixos
<samueldr>
so not to buy any *to* run mobile-nixos
<samueldr>
but, as I understand it, you want to get one meanwhile, and then a linux-first phone afterwards
<samueldr>
so, to *actually* answer the question
<samueldr>
anything that ticks the boxes of [ ] bootloader unlocked [ ] sources available is a contender
<samueldr>
anything that additionally has good community support on "enthusiast" forums like xda-developers are also good contenders
<samueldr>
and a big juicy box is "official lineageos support"
<samueldr>
those are generally trivial to port in my experience
<samueldr>
because the sources are well laid out
<samueldr>
while in my experience, random users making ROMs will often just hapazardly put a repo and not tag nor branch anything remotely sensibl
<samueldr>
e
<craige>
:-)
<samueldr>
I figure that a good phone for the money right now would be the pixel 3 (not A) if it's been discounted in AUS
<samueldr>
here it's been cut back almost 50% off on the official google store
<samueldr>
and initial poking at a pixel 2xl makes me think (as suspected) there won't be any issues
<samueldr>
well, there shouldn't be any more issues with the 3
<craige>
That's a great call.
<samueldr>
(neither should there be wih the 3A)
<samueldr>
don't be scared by the lack of lineageos on pixel devices
<samueldr>
they are blocking themselves on figuring out A/B partition scheme updates
<samueldr>
meanwhile to play around and just exec another OS it looks like it's not an issue
<craige>
I can play with it until the Find7 dies and then jam on OMNIROM, LineageOS or stock if I need it in a hurry.
<samueldr>
oh, something that is a soft blocker: we don't have support for Mediatek, Samsung or well anything else than Qualcomm for phones
* craige
nods
<samueldr>
how's the oppo dying?
<craige>
Power button is finally giving up the ghost. If I let it lose power, I'm in a world of hurt getting it to power back up again.
<samueldr>
ah :)
<samueldr>
if it wasn't for the fact that you likely need the power button to do it
<samueldr>
some phones have the ability to enable a "power on on usb power"
<samueldr>
a good chunk of nexus and the pixel phones do
<craige>
Yup. I've worked around it for the most part by reprogramming a soft button to do power functions but it's not good if I actually have lost charge.
* samueldr
is looking for the aboot image
<craige>
I might have to also explore "power on on usb too". This has been a pretty damn good phone. 5 years, 4 screen :-D
<samueldr>
it should be rather trivial to see if it supports the option
<samueldr>
if you're rooted, you could `dd` the aboot partition (not 100% sure how you'd find it) and strings it to find the fastboot commands
<samueldr>
for pixel devices it's "fastboot oem off-mode-charge"
<samueldr>
the string is "oem off-mode-charge" within strings
<samueldr>
it should be next to all the supported commands
<craige>
It is rooted (currently running OMNIROM). I'll give that go :-)
<samueldr>
I've used that succesfully on other devices to take a peek at the available commands
<craige>
Pixel 3 is still pretty much full price here (all over AUD$800) but it's a sound option if I get jammed.
<samueldr>
eek
<samueldr>
google is out of stock
<samueldr>
so I guess it really is, here, about liquidating their overstock
<samueldr>
(google says its out of stock on their australian website)
<craige>
Our retail stores still have plenty of stock at full price. If I need one, I'll need it urgently, so I'll hit a bricks'n'mortar retail chain with a hard offer to clear old stock :-)
<samueldr>
oh, I'm sure our retail store are at full price too here :)
<craige>
I don't *want* to buy one if need to, I'll need it fast :-)
<samueldr>
yeah, our telcos still are selling it full price 1099$ while google says the MSRP is 999 and sells it at 599 right now
<samueldr>
though you can subsidize it if you pick a plan starting from 100$/mo!
<samueldr>
I can't imagine paying 100$/mo... I pay ~15$/mo
<craige>
I buy outright and try to target devices I can run for 5 years (the Find7 has been the first to make it).
<craige>
I note that postmarketOS promote the Nexus 5 which I can pickup for $70 and they also seem to have the Pixel 3 XL in reasonable order, so a Pixel 3 might be stretch there.
<craige>
"might *not* be a stretch"
<samueldr>
nexus 5 is armv7l
<craige>
Yep but as an el-cheapo phone, it's tempting, if off topic.
<samueldr>
heh, in that sense yeah, good deal
<samueldr>
and still *is* a valid mobile-nixos target
<samueldr>
might need more work to get a useful system due to lack of binary cache
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<craige>
The Zenfone 2 looks like a reasonable option too but *shrug* if I'm in a fix than the Pixel 3 will be the go.
<samueldr>
CAREFUL
<samueldr>
zenfone 2 is intel atom based :D
<samueldr>
zenfone 2 _laser_ is aarch64
<samueldr>
asus has a bunch of funky names
<samueldr>
and the zenfone 2 lineage is possibly the worst
<samueldr>
though I sure would like having a zenfone 2 non-laser
<samueldr>
it'd make an interesting target
<samueldr>
of note: it's not the usual graphics chip, but a powervr!
<samueldr>
so no free mainline gravy train
<samueldr>
hmm
<samueldr>
would running a dreamcast emulator work better on powervr hardware?
<simpson>
Unfortunate. Hopefully somebody will fix that soon.
<samueldr>
yeah, a review of the main page needs to be done
<samueldr>
especially considering the (breaking) changes on 19.09/unstable
<samueldr>
though note that armv7l is still not supported by nixos
<samueldr>
(no build infra)
<kongobongo>
Thank you for help. I will pass this time. Installing Debian or Arch and using only Nix on it looks like a less bumpy ride. Cheers.
<samueldr>
simpson: as for your question... anything well supported by mainline u-boot/kernel is a good target; that's what we aim to support
<samueldr>
and starting from scratch is possible by cross-compiling u-boot for your board if it's not already handled in hydra
<simpson>
samueldr: Sure. I guess, like, I've got a few boards that come from commercial devices. Where could I scribble down the information connecting those commercial identifiers to the technical board info?
<samueldr>
if the mainline kernel supports the board, you can pick the generic image, dd it, then add the required u-boot
<samueldr>
hmm, not sure I follow
<simpson>
e.g. I have one of those fancy picture frames at home. I know the CPU and there's an SD card slot; surely there's something I can slap onto the SD card in order to boot the picture frame as a free device.
<simpson>
Something better than elinux wiki~
<samueldr>
ah, not SBCs, but random crap, right?
<samueldr>
good question
<samueldr>
I would, too, like to see a relevant site for that
<kongobongo>
samueldr is there a generic image newer than 18.03?
<samueldr>
like, cross-reference "this is XYZ soc" and see all boards on there
<samueldr>
kongobongo: aarch64 yes
<samueldr>
armv7l I think some users have produced some
<samueldr>
you can bootstrap yourself using cross-compilation, and then do a complete native build, which will be long
<kongobongo>
I don’t expect any issues with iMX6. That board should be fully supported by mainline.
<samueldr>
i.MX 6 is armv7l though
<kongobongo>
samueldr wiki linekd to 19.03. Thank you for the correction.
<samueldr>
kongobongo: yeah, stable is soon switching to 19.09
<samueldr>
that's why I suggest it :)
<kongobongo>
Ah, so I cannot use generic image for it?
<samueldr>
you could, if it was a 32 bit one (armv7) rather than 64 bit (aarch64)
<samueldr>
though we don't have a build infra for armv7l; there's nothing in the scale required for nixpkgs that supports armv7l natively**
<samueldr>
** (there's maybe something, but hard to procure and may require work, so it's kind of a white lie)
<samueldr>
simpson: I would like to see a "what's inside db" that lists those kind of things, for random consumer products
<simpson>
samueldr: Yesss.
<samueldr>
especially if there's cross-referencing
<samueldr>
so if you have a XYZ12345 SoC in a display frame, you can see the other devices with it, with the known info
<samueldr>
so you may be able to figure out how to hack it
<kongobongo>
Thank you samueldr. I have here ARMv7 Cortex-A9 so it's 32bit. Good to know you are focused on aarch64.
<kongobongo>
(I got it for 10$ so wanted my fav distro on it. I'm not very familiar with SBCs hence my trivial questions.)
<samueldr>
no worries, everyone started not knowing I think :)
<kongobongo>
Do I understand correctly that if I have NixOS on armv7 I cannot use substitutes from aarch64? So even when I put NixOS on my SBC I need to compile the world anyway?
<samueldr>
pretty much
<kongobongo>
And problem solved. ;) Cheers.
<samueldr>
and this will also apply for nix on non-nixos